Rushing to get things done?

poolownerinfl

Member
Dec 19, 2019
6
Florida
We're novices in all things pool. We're in the process of having the pool resurfaced, new tiles, new lights. We've had a few hiccups along the way and now are facing a 2-3 week holiday/vacation season. The pool company is now rushing to get everything done in the next few days and I'm worried. They have paver work to finish tomorrow (Friday) and also plan to clean/acid wash the pool in preparation tomorrow as well. It is forecasted to rain heavily this weekend into Monday but PB has said they can do the finish in the rain on Monday and we should start filling the pool immediately after that with regular tap water (we have VERY hard water) and do nothing else. They don't plan to come back while the crew is on vacation for the next 2+ weeks at which time they'll begin the chemical/brushing start up procedure. From what I've read, the gap in time might be critical and I'm concerned about the weather as well. Should I tell them to stop and just wait until it can all be done in better weather and at the same time? PB is anxious to get paid and wants all but 10% at the time of finishing. Please help! Thanks.
 

poolownerinfl

Member
Dec 19, 2019
6
Florida
Thank you! I forgot to mention that the crew found a few "hollow" spots that have not yet been repaired. Is it ok to resurface over the hollow spots without repair or should those be fixed first and then resurface.
 

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
11,283
Northern NJ
Hollow spots need to be chipped out or you risk delimitation of those replastered areas. The chipped out areas just get a thicker layer of new plaster. You want the new plaster to go on a solid surface.

A bonding coat should be put on the old surface after preparation and let dry for a day before new plaster is installed...


When new plaster is filled with water the pump should be started and chemicals added within 24 hours. See ...


You may also want to read...




 
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setsailsoon

LifeTime Supporter
TFP Guide
Oct 25, 2015
1,781
Stuart/FL
What are the contract payment terms you agreed to? Sounds like you have a provision that ties payment to completing these activities. He should be incentivized to complete on time, but he also should be obligated to meet the quality requirements. Don't pay unless he achieves both. Have a professional discussion to inform him of your position. Don't be confrontational, try to work with him but don't roll over and give up on his obligations to meet quality so he gets paid.

I hope this helps.

Chris
 

kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
42,142
Tallahassee, FL
Let them do everything EXCEPT the plaster and clean up of the shell (that would be a waste of time since they will have to do it again right before the plaster job). They cannot plaster in a rain storm and rain can cause run off with could channel the brand new plaster if it is strong enough. Not to mention the streaking the rain could cause.

"Mr. PB I understand your need to be paid for this job. I have a need for a good plaster job in the long term. I can't allow you to do the plaster job until the hallow areas are fixed nor can I allow the plaster job to be done while it rains. The start up cannot wait that long as seen in this plaster write up (print out the above one shared by Allen) without possible long term impact on the plaster."

Stick to your needs. Put a lock on the gate to keep them out if needed.
 

poolownerinfl

Member
Dec 19, 2019
6
Florida
Let them do everything EXCEPT the plaster and clean up of the shell (that would be a waste of time since they will have to do it again right before the plaster job). They cannot plaster in a rain storm and rain can cause run off with could channel the brand new plaster if it is strong enough. Not to mention the streaking the rain could cause.

"Mr. PB I understand your need to be paid for this job. I have a need for a good plaster job in the long term. I can't allow you to do the plaster job until the hallow areas are fixed nor can I allow the plaster job to be done while it rains. The start up cannot wait that long as seen in this plaster write up (print out the above one shared by Allen) without possible long term impact on the plaster."

Stick to your needs. Put a lock on the gate to keep them out if needed.
I've been making progress payments as work is completed per the contract. I asked for chipping out the hollow spots prior to bond coating. Turns out portions of the step are completely deteriorated! Huge thanks to all of you for advice.
 

poolownerinfl

Member
Dec 19, 2019
6
Florida
Hollow spots need to be chipped out or you risk delimitation of those replastered areas. The chipped out areas just get a thicker layer of new plaster. You want the new plaster to go on a solid surface.

A bonding coat should be put on the old surface after preparation and let dry for a day before new plaster is installed...


When new plaster is filled with water the pump should be started and chemicals added within 24 hours. See ...


You may also want to read...




Thank you. I read all of these and learned a lot
Fast forward. Pool steps were repaired and then holidays so just yesterday pool was plastered. Today waiting for acid wash and then fill. I noticed this spot, about the size of plate and more in the spa. Are these ok/normal?
 

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kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
42,142
Tallahassee, FL
They are areas where there is not as much plaster cream. Don't worry about them UNTIL after the acid wash. It is kind of like not judging a painting until the artist says they are done.

When it is time to add water make sure to NOT stop the flow of the water as doing so could cause a ring in that new plaster.

@Dirk has a good plan for finding out the gallons of your water. I will let him share it.

Do you have your test kit yet? Have you tested your fill water yet?

Kim:kim:
 

setsailsoon

LifeTime Supporter
TFP Guide
Oct 25, 2015
1,781
Stuart/FL
Pool,

Sorry you're having all these problems and at the same time glad (and not surprised) our experts are helping so much. Not sure where you are on progress payments but just in case I'd recommend you inform the builder you will not make any additional progress payments until he rectifies the quality issues. Even if you only have 10% left you have some leverage. Do this as non-confrontational as you can. Explain you have been very understanding so far but it seems like it's resulting in quality gaps and all you want him to do is deliver what he promised, no more.

I hope this is helpful.

Chris
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
4,662
Central California
@Dirk has a good plan for finding out the gallons of your water. I will let him share it.
I just wrote about it in another thread! Spread over three posts:

 

poolownerinfl

Member
Dec 19, 2019
6
Florida
They are areas where there is not as much plaster cream. Don't worry about them UNTIL after the acid wash. It is kind of like not judging a painting until the artist says they are done.

When it is time to add water make sure to NOT stop the flow of the water as doing so could cause a ring in that new plaster.

@Dirk has a good plan for finding out the gallons of your water. I will let him share it.

Do you have your test kit yet? Have you tested your fill water yet?

Kim:kim:
Thank you! The splotch seemed to fade away in the sunshine and after the acid wash yesterday but immediately appeared again as soon as the fill water reached that spot. There was a hollow spot in that area that was chipped away and later covered with bond coat. The plastering crew head looked at all the surfaces that had been chipped away and said it all looked fine to start the replaster. From what I observed, there didn't seem to be any late troweling or excessive watering but honestly, it could have happened and I just didn't recognize it.

Pool is filled and it (except for the splotch and a footprint or two) looks fantastic. I would like the pool surface to look perfect of course but willing to live with some minor cosmetic imperfections. More concerned that this spotch is a structural defect that will cause delamination or more problems in the short or long run. Will address with PB when he comes out tomorrow. Mostly his response to any questions or concerns are "it's fine", "this is what we always do" so not too confident at this point. Is there anything specific I should ask him to do except fix it if it doesn't resolve itself in the next 30 days or so?

I did not test the fill water which was a mistake on my part. PB provides 30 days of start up service, starting tomorrow so I'll get the results. As we are often traveling, we have had a pool service testing chemicals each week but realize now that many of the scaling/staining problems we have experienced in the past are preventable if only we had known better. My test kit arrives tomorrow!!

Again, huge thanks to all of you. I feel so much better even having a small bit of knowledge on my side!!
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
4,662
Central California
Whether it's a 30-day startup, or long-term care, you cannot rely, shouldn't rely, on pool professionals to know what they're doing. Or at least to do things 100% with your pool's best interest in mind. PBs can be the worst, and we have lots of stories here where PBs displayed a remarkable lack of understanding about pool water. That's not true of all professionals, I'm sure, I just know I haven't met one yet that knew how to properly test and balance pool water, and in fact a lot of my pool's worst, and most expensive-to-fix problems resulted directly from a pool professional's ineptitude.

Get a good kit, test the water yourself, make sure it's right: through the startup and beyond. Don't be shy or intimidated to bring matters of concern to the professional. Let 'em b and moan. So what. It's your pool, your money. That PB and his maintenance crew will be long gone after that 30 days, and you'll be left with the results, good or bad. Demand they perform to your satisfaction. If you need ammo, TFP is a great resource for that. Based on my experience, I would certainly trust the folks here (especially the experts and mods) over anyone that's ever shown up at my pool... The startup process, and the condition of your water during these first few weeks and months, can greatly impact your pool's appearance and longevity. Some things done wrong at this stage might not show up for years (again, long after the PB is gone), so you can't be too careful just now, IMO. Learn what is the proper startup procedure for your pool type, discuss a plan with your PB and get him and you to agree on it, then monitor that plan to make sure it is executed perfectly.

I handled all that by using TFP and doing the startup myself, which worked out great. But some new builds require the PB to do the startup (warranty-wise) and that's when you have to figure out how best to work with the guy. Personally, I wouldn't trust anybody, blindly, to do what's best for my pool, I'd want to monitor the whole process.
 
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poolownerinfl

Member
Dec 19, 2019
6
Florida
Thanks! PB didn't show up but sent start up guy. Pretty good explanation from him and my own pool test kit matched his own results with appropriate chemicals put in -- will test tomorrow to make sure. Totally agree with your assessment of contractors -- just want to get paid and move on. Many of our neighbors are reaching the same age/stage in needing a resurface so I'll mention this to PB in hopes of getting some leverage!
TFP is the best! So glad I found this website.
 

kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
42,142
Tallahassee, FL
TFP is the best! So glad I found this website.
We try to be there for pool owners! Did you know you could help us keep the servers going? I am sure you noticed there are NO ads here at TFP. That allows us to have an unbiased look at things and products. TFP is a registered 501(c)3 non-profit as well! Here is the link to show you how it is done: Become a TFP Supporter - Trouble Free Pool

Kim:kim: