Pool still cloudy

Noobpool

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
64
Cullman , Al
Ok please see the attached photos. Slammed until I passed 2 consecutive OCLTs. Deep cleaned the filter added 120 pounds of sand to bring it up to full. (it is on the small side per my math pump has to run 22 hrs to turnover all 40k gallons) Tried to experiment with DE but never worked well for me. Brush walls biweekly vacuum weekly (mostly) All my numbers are good. (FC was low added 2 gallons of 10% to bump me back to 9ppm. Anyone have an idea why my pool is still cloudy?
 

Noobpool

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
64
Cullman , Al
I passed the 2 OCLTs about 2 weeks ago. So filter has run 24/7 since. I backwash as needed. Experimenting with de always ended with a backwash because my pressure skyrocketed quickly
 

proavia

LifeTime Supporter
TFP Guide
Feb 6, 2015
1,516
Chandler AZ
Looks like your FC is below minimum for your CYA.

With CYA of 60, minimum FC is 5. Target is 7-9. What is your CC? Get enough chlorine in there to get to FC of 9. Do another OCLT to see where you're at. Post a full set of test results after your OCLT. Good chance you're going to need to SLAM again.

Remember, you need to pass all 3 criteria to successfully complete a SLAM......
OCLT - FC loss of 1.0 or less
CC - 0.5 or less
Water clear - you can see all the way to the bottom of the deep end without any haziness

Most sand filters are "full" at about 2/3 capacity. How "full" did you fill yours?

Having to turn over the entire pool every day is a myth - and total waste of electricity for a residential pool. If the chemistry is kept at correct levels, no need to run your pump for 22 hours/day.

Basically, you have a chemistry issue. And you have basically proven it based on the statement that adding DE caused the filter pressure to rise rapidly, requiring frequent backwashing. The filter and DE was doing its job - filtering out nasties in your water.
 

Noobpool

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
64
Cullman , Al
I mentioned in my post that I added 2 gallons of 10% to get back to 9ppm which in conjunction with rain was lower than usual loss. I quit slamming when I passed OCLTs twice consecutively. I have since passed several other OCLTs just going back over the results. CC is closer to 0 than to .5 based on my experience with testing when I was 1%cc I had much more pink color whereas now when I test it barely pinks. I filled my sand filter during deep cleaning to just more than 6 inches(less than 6 and a half inches) below the standpipe which is what the filter manual said was full capacity.
 

proavia

LifeTime Supporter
TFP Guide
Feb 6, 2015
1,516
Chandler AZ
I made my comment off of your pic above of your test results. It shows FC 4 - which is below the minumum of FC5. Going below minimum is setting yourself up for algae.

Passing the OCLT and having CC less than 0.5 is passing 2 out of the 3 criteria for successfully completing a SLAM. You need to pass all 3 to insure passage. Your pool is still cloudy, so you're not quite done yet.

Great that you checked your filter manual for proper sand level. I remember the first time I opened my filter - I thought the sand level was way low. After I researched it, I found it was just fine. It never occurred to me that it wouldn't be completely full to the top.

You may want to try the DE again. Sounds as if it was working to remove the fines the sand may have been missing.

I think the most difficult part of the SLAM process is at the end. It takes a lot of POP (Pool Owner Patience). Especially when you've worked really hard to get to that point and you just want it to be over.
 

Flying Tivo

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2017
1,025
Monterrey, NL, Mexico
Did you wash your new sand?? Seams like you did not. If you passed the oclt test, then you can try turning the pump off for 24 hrs and see if it settles. On another post someone was on a hurry and used some Floc to precipitate. It worked for him but TFP does not recommend doing it. When you add DE to a sand filter, you just add enough DE to raise 1-2 Lbs of pressure from baseline, it usually is about 1-2 cups of DE. Maybe you where dumping a lot of DE?

Felipe
 

Eilum

Well-known member
Jun 19, 2016
102
Jackson NJ
I would suggest a clarifier to help your filter clear up what is in the water. That's what worked for me and pool has been sparkling.
 

BattleOfYakima

TFP Guide
Apr 15, 2016
1,683
Central Florida
Just remember that no matter whether you try letting settle, POP filter 24/7, do several rounds of add de the pool school way , experiment with clarifier, experiment with floc, or any other course of action - keep bringing your FC up to shock. It is busy oxidizing everything for you and just in case you missed any small organics on the bottoms of ladders or if the stairs have water under them, etc. it works on that. If you are seriously considering going either clarifier or floc, please at least read the last post of this thread by chem geek, and consider whether you are willing to accept the consequences of experimenting with clarifier or floc - because their results, unlike TFP, are not guaranteed and can make things worse not better. that being said, yes, you can find dozens of pools that had undersized sand filters that made 100% sure they killed all their organics and successfully used a well reviewed floc, like leslies for example, and followed all the instructions, did their vac to waste, and were please with the results. Yes, you'll also find nightmares. So if you deviate from the TFP methods, that's your right as a pool owner, but I just wanted to make sure you knew it wasn't just pour it and forget it type stuff with guaranteed results.
 

Noobpool

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
64
Cullman , Al
Tested this morning and FC was 8.5ppm. I dosed to be right at 9pmm so from 9pm to 5am I lost .5% so yet again passed OCLT. FC still on the bottom end of .5%. I am tempted to try a clarifer just to see if I can get it over the hump. I have had a lot of sand backwash in out (to my inexperienced perspective) when I deep cleaned the filter I did not think to install unions to make easy access to the filter. So I need to redo that as well.
 

BattleOfYakima

TFP Guide
Apr 15, 2016
1,683
Central Florida
Thank you for the update - okay so something just became apparent to me. You've been bringing FC up to 9 for the last many days. During the SLAM to clear the water, because your CYA is 60, you need to be bringing your FC up to 24 (the shock FC for the CYA) and then keeping it at 24 until the pool is clear. This is very likely why you are not seeing the results we expect. So to clarify - target is for clear pool. Shock is for not clear pool. You need FC24 not FC9. No question about this. This is fact.

Other small note - when doing the OCLT, it is best practice to test the actual night fc value 30 mins after last addition rather than just use the calculated/theoretical FC.

I'm going to let others figure out what you mean about the sand stuff.
 

AimeeH

LifeTime Supporter
TFP Guide
Apr 2, 2012
2,028
Columbia SC
Tested this morning and FC was 8.5ppm. I dosed to be right at 9pmm so from 9pm to 5am I lost .5% so yet again passed OCLT. FC still on the bottom end of .5%. I am tempted to try a clarifer just to see if I can get it over the hump. I have had a lot of sand backwash in out (to my inexperienced perspective) when I deep cleaned the filter I did not think to install unions to make easy access to the filter. So I need to redo that as well.
Unless I'm misunderstanding you, you didn't actually test to see what your baseline for OCLT was? You are going by how much chlorine you added to get to a number? That is wildly inaccurate. And your pool is cloudy but you aren't bringing chlorine up to SLAM level?

It doesn't look like you have followed SLAM instructions which you certainly can choose not to but you will likely be chasing a cloudy pool for a long time.
 

Noobpool

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
64
Cullman , Al
Thank you for the update - okay so something just became apparent to me. You've been bringing FC up to 9 for the last many days. During the SLAM to clear the water, because your CYA is 60, you need to be bringing your FC up to 24 (the shock FC for the CYA) and then keeping it at 24 until the pool is clear. This is very likely why you are not seeing the results we expect. So to clarify - target is for clear pool. Shock is for not clear pool. You need FC24 not FC9. No question about this. This is fact.

Other small note - when doing the OCLT, it is best practice to test the actual night fc value 30 mins after last addition rather than just use the calculated/theoretical FC.

I'm going to let others figure out what you mean about the sand stuff.
When I slammed I maintained 28-30 ppm of FC. The theoretical fc vs actual makes sense. I will retest that tonight.
 

BattleOfYakima

TFP Guide
Apr 15, 2016
1,683
Central Florida
Sounds great! I'm eager to hear the results! Since criteria 3 of the SLAM ending/pass is "And the water is clear." I urge you to resume the SLAM immediately if you truly desire to banish the cloudiness as soon as possible. As long as you stay at or under the shock FC per your CYA, and as long as you can see the bottom, drains, and walls, we generally say you're okay to swim in it while SLAMing. It makes brushing more fun too.
 

Noobpool

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
64
Cullman , Al
I am maintaining slam at 28ppm . My pool is still cloudy. I have passed OCLTs twice. Both times I had tested with verified chlorine before bed ~9:30pm cst and staying within 1ppm at 5:45ish am. Obviously keeping testing procedures as similar as possible I. E. Getting my sample from the same place in my pool. I also have been testing in an area I assume has the poorest circulation occasionally and it stays a fairly consistent 6-8 ppm lower than my usual testing spot. (usual location is an arms length deep in the deep end and area of poor circulation is shallow end corner away from returns.)
 

BattleOfYakima

TFP Guide
Apr 15, 2016
1,683
Central Florida
I understand your last try with DE didn't do what you hoped - if you give that page a read, and ask us any questions before you start, maybe we can make this try go right for you! There are also other threads on the site that give individual experiences with it at this stage of the SLAM. If you decide you don't want to DE, it's totally okay to just let the sand filter clear it at its own pace. Just be sure to watch the pressure and clean when you have to, but not before since a slightly dirty filter cleans better than a freshly cleaned one. Cleaning too often slows you down. Not cleaning when you need to also slows you down.
 

Noobpool

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
64
Cullman , Al
I maintain 8 psi when my filter was freshly deep cleaned. There seems to be a wide disparity of when the best time to backwash occurs. Some folks say that a couple of psi is indicative of needing backwash while others say that they only backwash once a season. I will reread the de to a sand filter guide though
 

misplacetexan

Bronze Supporter
Feb 2, 2016
40
Baytown, Texas
I maintain 8 psi when my filter was freshly deep cleaned. There seems to be a wide disparity of when the best time to backwash occurs. Some folks say that a couple of psi is indicative of needing backwash while others say that they only backwash once a season. I will reread the de to a sand filter guide though
A 25% increased on your normal filter psi. For example: At 8 psi, you would backwash at approximately 10 psi. A 2 psi increased of 8 psi is approximately 25%. I am an old fart, so I am using math from the 60's and 70's. Good luck