Pool chemistry regime for dummies, novices and guests

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Propertyopp

Propertyopp

0
Jun 5, 2017
23
Bluemont,va
OK, this is my first post which basically references my readings about pool chemistry and the perennial liquid chlorine, CYA, puck issues. My pool is likely unique so I'm hoping to get some advice and guidance that is specifically relevant. Basic facts:
Our pool is spring fed
I think it's about 23,000 gal
It has a constant leak so is constantly being refilled at some level, unknown. I have a leveler with the hose tied to the spring.
It is a naturally shaped, dug pool laid with some sand and carpets under and then covered with pool EPDM which is black. I dont care about staining.
The spring water is very clean and well balanced to begin with.
There are stone steps into the pool and stone apron. We have some frogs occasionally and have had a snake.....I digress..
It has a Hayward filter and Jayco 1.5 pump using DE
It has a recirculating pump which has an intake at the shallow end and takes water to a waterfall at the other end.
It is therefore possible to have excellent circulation as long as the water level is high enough (usually ok)

What I need is a plan to keep the pool in shape when we are not at home but have guests staying here.
Right now I am shocking to get rid of the last bit of algae from heavy rains and not sufficient attention.
I am using cal hypo
I used liquid chlorine but it was too cumbersome to apply and took up too much room to keep,and wasn't strong enough. Plus the stores are often out of the concentrated.
I would like to use cal hypo daily and have the pool vacuumed, DE etc once a week by a pool guy who may or may not know anything about TFP approaches.
I'd like to try a floater with pucks since everyone says if I put them in the skimmer and dont run the pump 24/7 it will damage the pump.
Lately I have been running the filter and the recirculation pump 24/7 but I have a timer and was running it only in the day time about 7 AM-7PM which is the schedule I prefer. What is the trade off between electricity use and chemicals?

Can someone provide a list of how best to treat the pool with these parameters? It needs to be EASY, something I could ask a guest to do without imposing on a daily basis and then instruct the pool guy for weekly service. For example I dont think I can ask a guest to go out and check the water chemistry every day. Maybe they could swirl a tester tab in the water and brush the sides a couple time during the week.. I did order the test kit recommended here. It just came today.
Basically I need minimal to do list based on assumption that only a few people will use the pool and only occasionally. No kids etc.
Suggestions welcome!
 
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Wow awesome pool! Can't wait for pics!

Couple of thoughts...

If I'm paying to stay somewhere I'm not brushing the pool, but I'd put chlorine in it while i was there.
We need to determibe how many gallons you are replacing on a daily/weekly basis? That's going to be the key to this little puzzle.
 
Have you investigated your waterloss and tried to estimate the daily rate? That's going to impact your sanitation routine on a number of fronts, from varying cya levels. TFP sanitization is in relation to the [fc/cya][/FC/cya].

Do you have one of the TFP recommended kits (TFTestkits.net) and can you tell us you current TA, CH, and CYA?

And what kind of stone is in the pool?

If this is a property you're frequently away from, eg a vacation property, and if other elements of your pool don't contraindicate it, I'd seriously consider running SWG - a salt water generator.

In the event you're unfamiliar, you add salt to get to about 3200 ppm (about the salinity of a tear...not strong salt like the ocean.) Then the generator turns the salt into chlorine. From a maintenance standpoint, its as easy as it gets, provided you have your parameters under control. I switched to swg last year and love it.

The issue in your case might be where the leak is as you'd not want salt water to be leaching back into the spring or nearby wetland area if you have one, plus you'd also not want a heavy-replenishment diet to maintain the salt level. A second caveat is that some types of stone don't wear as well exposed to salt, but this is a mild level so I'm not sure it would be a problem.

I was just away for 5 days and it was super awesome to tell our house sitter just to check to see that my automated swg was on every day and not to worry about testing beyond a quick check of FC. The pool literally ran and sanitized itself ;)
 
harleysilo said:
Wow awesome pool! Can't wait for pics!

Couple of thoughts...

If I'm paying to stay somewhere I'm not brushing the pool, but I'd put chlorine in it while i was there.
We need to determibe how many gallons you are replacing on a daily/weekly basis? That's going to be the key to this little puzzle.
Click to expand...


I'm not sure if Im responding in the right place, the navigation here isn't the easiest to decipher. Re the water loss, I know its a leak under the rubber near the skimmer box and likely in some area of the pool where it has been patched. Since we are basically recycling water and dont pay for it, we dont mind except when there is a drought and the spring labors to keep up! What I can say is that the pool loses probably 2 inches overall at night. I am going to post some pictures so you get the idea of the size of it. IF we dont have any rain then the hose is refilling pretty much 24/7. Either way its refiling.

IT is raining again today so I am not going to do anything until tomorrow when the pool guy comes for the first time. I am now going to find out how to post photos. Thanks!
 
Here are some pics of the pool. As I mentioned it loses about 2" of water overnight. The spring water is actually potable and we drank it for years until the health department made us put in a well. Until we decide to put in a new liner we are just going to put up with water loss.
The epdm comes up and over the edge of the pool and continues under the stone apron to where the planting are on the far side. That's where the leak is, near the skimmer box for sure and maybe elsewhere.
We don't have a lot of people in the pool usually but do have airbnb guests so obviously it has to be maintained. We are looking for a pool regimen for us to do when we are here, but also one that guests can do if we are not here until the pool guy comes once a week.
I should note that pool service is a problem here. There is a pool service place where we bought our pumps and filter etc but we have had problems with them maintaining it. The last time the guy said he was afraid to vacuum as he thought it might tear the liner (we patch it every year). He's only been doing it for 5 years.... I vacuum it with no problem. Which is why I have a new guy now, un tested! That said, next year is probably the year to re line the pool. or something.
 
You are near one the local wineries with the best views, Bluemont Vineyards.

I strongly suggest that you convert to a SWG as it will make maintaining your pool much easier.

Regardless of method, you need to stop the leak. It will impact your water balance. Since you have stone steps, you need to make sure your calcium hardness levels are high enough to avoid damaging them. Water around here is hard, but not hard enough for stone. So, you will be constantly be adding calcium hardness and CYA. If you convert to a SWG, you will be constantly adding salt.

Maybe you can try to locate the leak and patch it with pool putty. Turn off the pumps and use a little red food coloring to see if you can find the exact location of the leak. You can also turn off the water leveler and let the pool drain down and where it stops will show you the level of the leak. Skimmers are a common area of leaks, so check all around the skimmer. Use pool putty where you suspect that it is leaking. Pool putty is pretty cheap and will pay for itself in chemicals.

Seriously consider getting a SWG. This way you can get a weekly service to check your salt, ph and CYA levels and your tenants will always have a clean and comfortable pool.
 
Beautiful Pool!

The rain you are having today won't affect the testing you could do today with the test you now have in preparation for the meeting with pool boy tomorrow.

I sense that you won't be repairing the leak until you replace the pond liner. Are those stones around the edge set in mortar? Sounds like a BIG job!

If the leak and refill process is to continue you may be the perfect candidate to just use di-chlor (chlorine pucks) to sanitize. I think you would really need a inline chlorinator for that which you don't currently have. The thing is if you fix the leak(s) next year, you'll be able to stop the constant filling, and then I would have to advise against using di-chlor and opt for the SWCG as mentioned above. Di-Chlor contains CYA, which you need up to a certain level to protect your chlorine from the sun. Since you are constantly changing out water due to the leak with some consistent testing you potentially could manage the pool just fine without running into the issues normally associated with di-chlor, namely a CYA level that deters you from adding enough chlorine to effectively sanitize the pool and the resulting algae.

You mentioned you have already tried just using liquid chlorine but it was cumbersome. The addition of the liquid chlorine to the pool can be automated much like the inline chlorinator, and you could be the liquid chlorine in bulk think 55 gallon drum.

Here are some things that would help this conversation along:

-dimensions of the pool (length, width) so we can turn 2" into gallons per day (estimate) of water replacement. How did you come up with the 30K estimate?
-test results of pool water and just the spring water too
-do you understand the relationship of CYA and Chlorine? if not Pool School - Getting Started and Pool School - Pool Chemistry

How is the pools temperature generally? How cold is the spring water? Even if you stopped the leak, you have a free source of good water to add to the pool in the future when the CYA rises too high...
 
Thanks Karen, yes we are near the vineyard you mention, actually can walk to one from here. We did use eco smarte but gave it up for lack of service in the area. Maybe we will do SWG next time around but for now I need to figure out how to deal with the existing problem. OUr water is very low in calcium and I dont care about the stone, we have loads of that. They are set in motar so re doing the entire liner would be a big job as noted! We did let the pool drain down some months ago and patched all the leaks and tears that were visible. However short of taking out the skimmer box and re doing that section, we just cant do that work right now. We just need an interim solution.

What happens if we just put a packet of 68% cal hypo in the pool every day? and then just service once a week.
 
Thank you for the helpful suggestions! I have read about CYA but I dont understand it really. I know it's a stabilizer so the chlorine is more effective and I know it apparently builds up and then can create algae problems. We do get algae but of course It's usually because we not attending to daily chlorine and the weather dumps all kinds of stuff in the pool.

I like the idea of a dispenser in the pool. Can I use the cal hyp pucks that I already have (have the bags too) or should I use the di chlor. I assume they should not be used in combination.

I will measure the pool as best I can but the shape and slope make anything exact almost impossible. At first we thought it was 45k gal but the pool people who have been servicing it say its more like 30k gal. So lets estimate 35k:)

New pool guy coming shortly. What do you suggest I print out for him form this site?***???
I havent tested water yet. I put in 2 bags of cal hypo lat night. It is going to be really hot today.

- - - Updated - - -

The spring water is cold but the black liner speeds up heating. and probably algae... It's perfect to swim in.
 

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Honestly the methods used here at TFP are hard to mix with hiring a pool pro. Pool pros come once a week and dump chems. Dumping in bags of cal-hypo or dichlor once a week can be dangerous especially large swings in PH. PH is important for eye and ears and overall comfort in the water. Most pool pros use test strips which are horribly inaccurate and we like to call them guess strips. The TFP method involves doing your own testing and adding what your pool needs when it needs it.

Since you have high turnover of your water, you could use regular pucks. We would suggest that you do your own testing with a recommended test kit and add what your pool needs. With pucks and high turnover, you might not need to do much to keep your levels in the recommended range.

Post up a full set of results and let us know which kit you have:
FC
CC
PH
TA
CH
CYA

Best of luck!
 
Welcome to the forum!

That is a beautiful pool and view!

The problem with long term Cal-Hypo use is the increase in CH (calcium) levels. As the CH levels rise, Strict management of pH & TA will be needed to prevent scale buildup.

A SWG is really the best 'low maintenance' solution in my opinion. I will never go back to manual chlorine dosing.
 
I'm back again after looking up inline chlorinator which I know nothing about, but can get a Hayward CL200 delivered tomorrow by my best friend amazon. It doesn't say what "installation" is involved. Is this easy? I have only a few days left before my guests take over the pool! Why not get a cheap floater dispenser?

Thanks for your help!
 
Disclaimer: I've never owned nor used an inline chlorinator.

Until you start testing your water, including an OCLT to determine that you have no living algae, we really don't know what your chlorine demand will be. I guess it's possible to use a floater, or multiple floaters, with Di-chlor or Tri-chlor, but it's my understand that the inline chlorinator can hold more chlorine and go longer without additions, and I think you can control the amount of water that flows through it to adjust the chlorine going into your pool (unlike with a floater).
 
Thanks Karen, that's what I thought about floaters. Just ordered two of them and will float my cal hypo tabs til they are finished and then maybe switch to Di or Tri? WHich?

WELL, THE NEW POOL GUY FINALLY TEXTED THAT HIS WIFE WAS SUPPOSED TO RESCHEDULE AS HE HAD A FAMILY EMERGENCY AND IS OUT OF STATE!!! SO NOW I HAVE AN EMERGENCY. GEEZ.

I have the FAS- DPD (OMG) kit and don't even understand the first line!"Fill tube to the desired mark"???Do I want to measure for 0.2 or 0,5 ppm of chlorine? I dont understand the last step multiplication drop equivalence either.

Then it instructs to add 2 dippers of powder and swirl til pink. I guess this means if it doesn't turn pink there is no chlorine? Then it says NOTE if pink disappears add more powder until it turns pink? Do I do this if it doesnt turn pink in the first placeZ?

Any illumination would be much appreciated. I only have til Sunday to solve this.
 
With Dichlor, for every 10ppm of FC you also get 9ppm of CYA. For Trichlor, with every 10ppm of FC you also get 6ppm of CYA.

We recommend the 10ml sample, where each drop equals 0.5ppm and use one heaping dipper when the pool is expected at target FC.

If 2 heaping dippers does not produce any pink at all, assume FC=0.
 
domct203 said:
With Dichlor, for every 10ppm of FC you also get 9ppm of CYA. For Trichlor, with every 10ppm of FC you also get 6ppm of CYA.

We recommend the 10ml sample, where each drop equals 0.5ppm and use one heaping dipper when the pool is expected at target FC.

If 2 heaping dippers does not produce any pink at all, assume FC=0.
Click to expand...


Thank you! That makes it more clear :) Now, I assume if i want more CYA that will lengthen the life of my chlorine which means I might want the Diclor as you suggested.

My calcium is always low in the spring water by the way. So I'm assuming that anything that makes calcium go up will not be a problem.
 

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