Good to hear about the warranty being ok. I've contacted the PB about the terms, and he is willing to work with us. I mentioned to him that I understand he has to look out for himself, but at the same time, I need to make sure I don't put myself in a bind. I already had a meeting set for tomorrow with the PB, so I'll use the beginning of the meeting to discuss terms and move on from there. I'll put together a list of items that I want to include based on the feedback from you guys! Feel free to let me know if I need to add anything or adjust something.
@HermanTX Thanks for chiming in!
I agree that subbing it out to subcontractors is normal, but not subbing out the entire project to another PB!
Here is what I plan on discussing...
Proposed changes to the contract:
- Payment terms are to be paid after each phase of the project, and both parties agree on completion.
- Final payment (10%) will be issued when the following items have been successfully completed and agreed up by both parties:
- Successful pressure test of all plumbing.
- All equipment and controls must meet factory guidelines and be tested and demonstrated in the presence of the owner.
- The fence and lawn properly re-installed.
- The coping and deck completed.
- Inspections passed.
- All warranties for equipment, plaster, and workmanship have been provided.
- The pool holds water.
- Pool finishes must be correct as specified with no indications of improper adhesion.
- If the need to subcontract the entire contract to another PB, prior consent from the owner is required.
Some of these tests may be part of the startup, so we’ll see what he says. I’ll also ask for the past four builds as references.
Other items to note:
- What is the action plan if foreign objects (abandoned pipes, boulder, etc..) are found during excavation? What are the costs associated with resolving the issue?
- What are the model numbers for the equipment?
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I'm going to be as transparent as possible with this forum as I move along this process, so hopefully, someone else will find value from this experience. To start, I did have a side conversation with Chris about the contract because I already signed the contract! So I was a bit freaked out. Thankfully, the PB allowed me to void the contract until we discuss terms. I'm posting the PM's below. Some of the points Chris touched on in the thread, but here you go:
PM from me to Chris:
Hi Chris - yes, your review of the contract helped tremendously. Now I'm terrified. Before I respond back to thread, I wanted to see if we can exchange some PM's. I signed the contract,
, yes, I know... on Thursday night. The contract states I can cancel the contract as long as it's done before midnight on the third business day. So that's Monday.
I am putting together an email to the PB based on your feedback, stating I need to cancel the contract until we can agree on terms, but I need some clarification beforehand. I'm trying to understand what you mean by:
- no retention
- warranty remedies are not defined.
I have not found one PB in my area that doesn't sub out the work, so I am not sure what to say about this. Also, I'm not sure how to phrase the comment: "Don't try to compare structural requirements such as rebar schedule and specs".
PM from Chris to Me:
Tex,
First, let me say I'm not a lawyer just managed a lot of construction for the past 40 years mostly large industrial projects but also a lot of small stuff similar to pools. I think your approach is good but you should try to call him. When I went back to look at the warranty it is actually not too bad. Sorry, I was in a hurry on the way out the door. The more important items are the others. Deal-breakers to me.
Retention is a term that means a portion of the total cost reserved until the pool is completed and a performance test is complete. This way you have some leverage for final repairs. 10% would be my target and in no case less than 5%. There also needs to be a description of what quality the work must meet for payment of each progress payment. The way the contract is written his obligation to perform "good workmanship" is not a requirement for payment. All he has to do is complete the work regardless of quality. For example, we've seen instances of form failure during concrete pour that must be completely redone. You shouldn't have to pay if this is the case.
Performance test should be simple and measurable. I would state something like:
Pool structure must hold water. Conduct a bucket test if needed to verify.
All equipment and controls must be tested and demonstrated in presence of the owner
Pool finishes must be correct as specified with no indications of improper adhesion (this is for the plaster).
I'll correct my post about the warranty issue and I hope you can clear up the rest of this with the builder. Ask him if he really wants you to pay for events like I described. If he says he wouldn't invoice for that tell him that's fine and just to put it in writing. You don't want to be unreasonable but you can't rely on verbal promises. Things will go wrong, hopefully minor. And you should work together to get past them. But you also have to have words in the agreement that require both of you be fair. The words in this agreement are not fair to you on the points I made above. There are a few other points that may have been made on other comments but definitely get model numbers for all the equipment. Also, make sure any decisions you need to make but a certain date are clearly defined. Usually this is around color choices etc.
One more point. Positive information on social media is good but it's not a substitute for checking references with a conversation. This is a pain but worth the effort. You'll either feel way better about the builder or way worse. Either way you need to know, pools are too much money to ignore this step.
PS, retention should not be paid until passing performance test and release of liens. This is your verification he has paid the subcontractors. If they don't get paid they can place a lien on the pool until they are paid..
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