Water is being trucked in! Intellicenter question though

[Justin9314]

I would use a 3way for the 2 skimmers, with 2 valves you could deadhead the pump. I would just leave room on the pad and install heater later with valves. It's hard to anticipate the plumbing with it not there, and different heaters plumb various ways. With a SWG and modern heater with 2" headers I dont bother with bypasses. The flow restriction is almost non existent. Is your only suction the 2 skimmers? I see 3 return lines, how many actual return fittings?

What kind of soil do you have plays into timing. Its gonna rain on you regardless at some point. As long as you have a good operator and plan I would just get started. Everything is gonna take alot longer than you think, a DIY build is alot of work

Thanks for the reply. The pool is setup with 2 returns (skipping main drains) but does have three returns. Is this an issue?
We do have heavy clay in northern Indiana. I have no doubt on how long it’s gonna take. I’m off all week next week but figured it will be a month long project probably. Goal is to get it done before July, that’s when our baby is due. I’m sure the wife wouldn’t be pleased with me working on the pool with a newborn at home lol.

 

[Justin9314]

I was hoping someone could double check my numbers before we start to dig tonight. The plan is to dig a 46' x 26' hole. The shelf should be dug to 52" if my walls will be 48" and the coping will be 4" (concrete)? Basically 52" down from where I need the top of the pool to be. Am I on the right path for this one? @jimmythegreek

Thank you again for all of the help!

 

[JamesW]

The steel that was provided sounds like quality steel. My question is, is it worth adding an additional layer of coating for rust protection?

It might be worthwhile to get some zinc anodes to attach to each wall and maybe connect a few to the bond wire where the bond wire is underground.

https://www.rotometals.com/zinc-anode-3-x-6-hang-overboard-w-copper-wire/

https://www.rotometals.com/zinc-anode-2-5-x-4-5-hang-overboard-with-copper-wire/

 

[duckcmmndr]

I will let @jimmythegreek weigh in on this one too but also give my .02

Every dig really depends on the surrounding terrain and how it is shaped. You don't want the edge of the pool deck to be lower than what's around it. The deck needs to pitch away from the pool at 1/4" per foot. So depending on what elevation you are shooting for...it may not be as simple as adding the 48" wall to the 4" deck thickness to determine the shelf dig depth. If you did that your deck would be level with the existing ground. At the most you would dig the wall depth so that your deck would be up above the grade...but in most cases the top of the walls will be slightly above the existing grade meaning the shelf is dug at a depth less than the wall height. This allows for the deck to fall at that 1/4 per foot away from the pool.

It can be hard to wrap your brain around.

I had a low point between my house and pool that I put a channel drain. I wanted the water to run away from my house and also away from my pool. In my case since I already had a concrete patio that was pitched about 1/8" per foot away from my house...I had to accommodate that and it required a channel drain to catch the water and take it away. That channel drain height is what I used to determine my dig depth. Lets say the channel drain was 6' from where I wanted the edge of the pool to be, that equates to 1.5" of rise from that point. My foam forms made for a 3.5" thickness on top of the walls and I had 42" walls. I used my laser transit to position a brick where I wanted the top of the channel drain to be and another brick where the edge of the pool was going to be at a position 1.5" higher than the top of my low point drain brick. Now that I knew what this number was relative to my laser line...I could simply add 3.5" for my deck height and 42" for my wall height and set my transit stick to that position for my dig depth. For me that put the walls slightly above the existing grade. In my case...the yard sloped downhill from this point the further you got away from the house...so this is the only point I had to worry about. You may have multiple slopes to work with.

You don't want to put the pool in and end up with a heavy rain causing runoff into your pool turning it into a brown mud puddle.

I said all of that to say that we really can't tell you exactly how deep to dig your shelf, it depends on your yard and how it's sloped.

 

[jimmythegreek]

Pick a non movable spot like bottom of a door sill amd set that as your benchmark forn the dig. You want the pool amd deck slightly higher than the surrounding area and grade. Mark out the pool outline then add 2ft all around for the overdig. Make a square clean dig starting with the deep end short wall. Keep it flat at 52" the whole way. When you get a little past the break line for hopper then go back amd mark out the hopper amd carefully shape that out. You want to avoid making a ramp into the pool so keep the ramp behind you in future excavated soil. Do the rest of the shallow floor from above amd move around 3 sides of hopper to shape if needed. I personally overdig the hopper floor amd pour concrete from the collar for that section of floor. Makes a spot to mix the verm and hard edges to float to. Helps go have a guy or two in the hopper shaping it with picks and shovels.

 

[duckcmmndr]

Here is that brick set at the height and location that I wanted the channel drain to be.


It stayed there throughout my whole build.


Drains in place before the deck pour.


And finally the finished product the day it was poured.


As you can see I added a 2nd channel drain between my pool house (left side of picture) and the pool. This was also the same height as the main channel drain.

I hope this helps, you need to get the shelf height correct.

 

[Justin9314]

Thank you for the detailed response! I do have a patio that’s about 4” above grade. By goal was to maintain that. The pool is about 10’ from that patio so my thought was have the pool be about 2” higher than the existing patio with a drain in between the two? On the other side of the pool, the grade has a significant slope away from the pool. I guess maybe the question was the bottom of the shelf would be 52” from that chosen reference point (2” above existing patio)?

I will let @jimmythegreek weigh in on this one too but also give my .02

Every dig really depends on the surrounding terrain and how it is shaped. You don't want the edge of the pool deck to be lower than what's around it. The deck needs to pitch away from the pool at 1/4" per foot. So depending on what elevation you are shooting for...it may not be as simple as adding the 48" wall to the 4" deck thickness to determine the shelf dig depth. If you did that your deck would be level with the existing ground. At the most you would dig the wall depth so that your deck would be up above the grade...but in most cases the top of the walls will be slightly above the existing grade meaning the shelf is dug at a depth less than the wall height. This allows for the deck to fall at that 1/4 per foot away from the pool.

It can be hard to wrap your brain around.

I had a low point between my house and pool that I put a channel drain. I wanted the water to run away from my house and also away from my pool. In my case since I already had a concrete patio that was pitched about 1/8" per foot away from my house...I had to accommodate that and it required a channel drain to catch the water and take it away. That channel drain height is what I used to determine my dig depth. Lets say the channel drain was 6' from where I wanted the edge of the pool to be, that equates to 1.5" of rise from that point. My foam forms made for a 3.5" thickness on top of the walls and I had 42" walls. I used my laser transit to position a brick where I wanted the top of the channel drain to be and another brick where the edge of the pool was going to be at a position 1.5" higher than the top of my low point drain brick. Now that I knew what this number was relative to my laser line...I could simply add 3.5" for my deck height and 42" for my wall height and set my transit stick to that position for my dig depth. For me that put the walls slightly above the existing grade. In my case...the yard sloped downhill from this point the further you got away from the house...so this is the only point I had to worry about. You may have multiple slopes to work with.

You don't want to put the pool in and end up with a heavy rain causing runoff into your pool turning it into a brown mud puddle.

I said all of that to say that we really can't tell you exactly how deep to dig your shelf, it depends on your yard and how it's sloped.

response!

 

[duckcmmndr]

Thank you for the detailed response! I do have a patio that’s about 4” above grade. By goal was to maintain that. The pool is about 10’ from that patio so my thought was have the pool be about 2” higher than the existing patio with a drain in between the two? On the other side of the pool, the grade has a significant slope away from the pool. I guess maybe the question was the bottom of the shelf would be 52” from that chosen reference point (2” above existing patio)?

You are correct..once you establish how high the deck needs to be at the pools edge so that it slopes away...the rest is just adding the wall height and deck thickness. I think your situation is similar to mine and you are on the right track.

 

[Justin9314]

You are correct..once you establish how high the deck needs to be at the pools edge so that it slopes away...the rest is just adding the wall height and deck thickness. I think your situation is similar to mine and you are on the right track.

Thank you both for the help! I just didn't want to make a stupid mistake. I would prefer to only rent the excavator once lol. This was our progress today. Tomorrow hopefully we can finish out the digging.

@jimmythegreek

 

[TLark]

Justin - Looks like you have a good start. Hope the rain doesn’t slow you down today. Where are you at in northern IN? I’m in Fort Wayne and about to start a 20’x40’ from pool warehouse...that is, I will start when the parts damaged during shipping get replaced!

 

[Justin9314]

Justin - Looks like you have a good start. Hope the rain doesn’t slow you down today. Where are you at in northern IN? I’m in Fort Wayne and about to start a 20’x40’ from pool warehouse...that is, I will start when the parts damaged during shipping get replaced!

We got a good jump on it. The dig is complete and the well is dug also. Unfortunately, we did call it due to the rain. I hear ya on the damaged parts. PWH helped me with my shipping claims but you would think they would use a different shipping company for the client experience? I have almost enough steel for two walls haha. Good scrap money I suppose.

I am out in Whitley County. Have you figured out what you are doing for a pool base yet?

 

[Justin9314]

Pick a non movable spot like bottom of a door sill amd set that as your benchmark forn the dig. You want the pool amd deck slightly higher than the surrounding area and grade. Mark out the pool outline then add 2ft all around for the overdig. Make a square clean dig starting with the deep end short wall. Keep it flat at 52" the whole way. When you get a little past the break line for hopper then go back amd mark out the hopper amd carefully shape that out. You want to avoid making a ramp into the pool so keep the ramp behind you in future excavated soil. Do the rest of the shallow floor from above amd move around 3 sides of hopper to shape if needed. I personally overdig the hopper floor amd pour concrete from the collar for that section of floor. Makes a spot to mix the verm and hard edges to float to. Helps go have a guy or two in the hopper shaping it with picks and shovels.

All dug, hope to have the stone delivered on Monday. For the stone on the pool base/ under the steel, do I stick with a 3/4 or use clean stone chips? I am sure the chips are easier to work with but didn't want to cut corners if that wouldn't be acceptable.

 

[jimmythegreek]

Either work fine. I actually use road base usually I like to run the plate over the shelf to pack in anything that moved from the excavator teeth. Anything angular compacts easily that's why its preferred for backfilling and base. With clay soils if you compact you can pump water up sometimes then it complicates things

 

[TLark]

We got a good jump on it. The dig is complete and the well is dug also. Unfortunately, we did call it due to the rain. I hear ya on the damaged parts. PWH helped me with my shipping claims but you would think they would use a different shipping company for the client experience? I have almost enough steel for two walls haha. Good scrap money I suppose.

I am out in Whitley County. Have you figured out what you are doing for a pool base yet?

Shipping problems sure seem to be a trend, I know of someone else local got a PWH kit that had issues also.
I’m going to do a sand floor.

 

[Justin9314]

Either work fine. I actually use road base usually I like to run the plate over the shelf to pack in anything that moved from the excavator teeth. Anything angular compacts easily that's why its preferred for backfilling and base. With clay soils if you compact you can pump water up sometimes then it complicates things

I do have a heavy clay. Should I be compacting mechanically or just with my hand tamper?
Also, I’m working on finishing up my drainage. I plan to use a well that I can drop a pump in. Where do professionals typically source a 8-10” pvc?
Thanks again for the help!

 

[jimmythegreek]

Clean stone hand tamp for panel shelf. You can plate but it must be dry. You can also tighten up soft spots with clean stone but hand tamp. On dry ground you can plate anywhere, just be careful amd watch the ground.
I use 10" minimum so a vertical float model will fit, 12" is good too. Inuse corrugated pvc its black amd ribbed, septic supply house has it near me. Better stone yards will have it too

 

[TLark]

Could try EJ Prescott (ejprescott.com) in Fort Wayne for the pipe.

 

[Justin9314]

Could try EJ Prescott (ejprescott.com) in Fort Wayne for the pipe.

Thank you. Worked out perfect!

 

[Justin9314]

Clean stone hand tamp for panel shelf. You can plate but it must be dry. You can also tighten up soft spots with clean stone but hand tamp. On dry ground you can plate anywhere, just be careful amd watch the ground.
I use 10" minimum so a vertical float model will fit, 12" is good too. Inuse corrugated pvc its black amd ribbed, septic supply house has it near me. Better stone yards will have it too

@jimmythegreek Hey sir, so our excavator overdug the deep end hopper. The one side is overdug by maybe 18-24” and there is no solid base for the walls to go on. Would you attempt to compact stone or just pour concrete and shape the hopper and build a foundation for the walls?

I am hoping the concrete isn’t the only option due to cost. But I don’t want to have a safety issue either.

 

[jimmythegreek]

Not following you. Overdug means too deep. Do you mean too wide? If that's the case the easiest thing is to slide the pool over amd make a new back wall ledge. Then use stone on the slope to fix. Otherwise you got a mess on your hands. Excavators aren't pool diggers. Its an art