New to TFP! Metal issues

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Been testing 4 times a day (with the help of my daughter who is home from college!) since Tuesday. Levels are still all over the place and still cloudy. Keep adding bleach to keep my TC at 20. Brushing &/or vaccuming daily. My steps are all brown stained now as well as my skimmer box. Hopefully it starts to clear soon!
 
A CYA of 50 requires an FC SLAM level of "20". You should increase the FC slightly and continue the SLAM process until you pass the 3 SLAM criteria. Unfortunately, staining is part of the "package" when using water with iron in it. You can place some towels or baffling material in the skimmer to try and catch some of it, but the iron will try to stain. First you need to remove the algae though, then treat the pool stains and iron. Make sure to review the SLAM page (link below) once a day to refresh your memory on the tasks to be performed. Hang in there!
 
Today's CC reading of 5 tells us your water is processing a LOT of stuff, either organic material, products that may have been used from the winter closing, or both. Maintaining the SLAM level and sunlight together will help with that. At the same time, because of any algae, make sure to brush the pool daily, to include any items in the pool. You're approaching a stage where details make the difference. Inspecting ladder rails, behind lights in the niche, ... anything in the water that can be a home to algae. Also worth considering is the filter. Backwash only when it reaches about 25% increase from the clean (starting) pressure. If you haven't performed a deep clean on the filter in a while, that may be something to consider as well soon.
 
I have added about 16 gallons of bleach in 5 days...is that reasonable?
Just tested again
FC 3
CC 18
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Actually, depending on the size of the pool, that's fairly accurate, in some cases maybe even more. In the beginning, a pool can easily gobble-up several gallons the first day before it finally stabilized. Your test results concern me however. Just when it looks like your FC and CC are stabilizing, you post a huge CC spike and that's not normal. So that leads me to asking some questions for you, and I apologize in advance if they seem picky, but it's important:

- For your FC testing, are you using the FAS-DPD (powder & drops)? If so, are you also using the 10ML water sample, one scoop pf powder, the dividing the number of drops by 2? Example - 20 drops = FC of 10?
- From there (for the CC portion), are you adding only 5 drops of the R-0003, then counting the R-0871 drops to also make that sample turn clear? Then dividing that count in half as well?
- Has there ever been anything else added to your water other than the metal treatment products you mentioned in post #1? Anything else we should know about?
- When you add bleach for an FC goal (trying to reach FC of 16 for example)... once you add the bleach, how long before you re-test the water FC level again?

Besides ensuring there are no testing errors, I believe we need to be more aggressive with the product(s) that your bleach is combating. But we'll move forward on the details you provide.
 
I actually bought the TF-100 w/ speed stir kit (the chemistry geek in me needed the speed stir!) I'm adding the powder, then drops (on at a time), then dividing in half. When I add the R-0003 it turns almost magenta with the 1st drop when CC's are high. I then add more R-0871 until clear, then divide by 2.
I added the metal out initially then added Sparkle Up (the pool store sold me)and put some chlorine pucks in my skimmer basket, then I found TFP. After that, I followed your advice and let my chlorine fall below 10. I added muriatic acid to bring my pH down.
After I add bleach, I usually wait about 4 hours to re-test. Last night at 9 pm my FC was 6 and CC was 18. I added 3 gallons of bleach. I tested this morning at 6am and FC 3, CC 20.
I have been buying my bleach (generic Clorox 6%) at a grocery store. I most recently bought the "concentrated" product because they were out of the "classic" (probably because I bought it all). I'm just so frustrated at this point that I am ready to drain it and start all over. I was reading your forums late last night and saw where 1 person had used 72 gallons, so I don't feel as bad now. We bought the salt water system but have not started using it yet because I wanted to get everything perfect before I started messing with figuring that out.
I don't believe it's testing error on my part. I'm a pharmacist and have lab experience (although a few years ago). I compound and use precise measurements.
We did have quite a few leaves in the pool this spring, but I think most of them are out. When I brush I see a few floating here and there and scoop them out. I vacummed manually and had a whole skimmer basket full. My filter hasn't been backwashed in a week because pressure is staying about 18. New sand in filter mid-season last year.
 
Your testing looks good. :goodjob: I think your problem is this:
After I add bleach, I usually wait about 4 hours to re-test.
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What is happening is you add the bleach correctly, but then wait too long to re-add. Then the aggressive nature of the ammonia or whatever is in that water eats-up the chlorine first, causing the spike in CC. In others words, you're feeding the animal. You need to conquer it by re-testing the FC and re-adding bleach to maintain more frequently.

It's quite simply really.... your CYA is 50 so we know your FC should be 20. So add enough bleach to reach 20 then re-test in about 10 minutes. That may seem like it's too quick, but you'd be surprised how aggressive the chemical reaction is. However much FC dropped, re-add bleach to get it back up right away. Continue this for a while and you'll eventually see the battle (and numbers) flip-flop to where the chlorine wins the fight. FC will hold better between 15-20 and the CCs will finally fall to their knees around 1 or so where it should be. But that quick testing cycle is key. It might only take an hour, it may take 2 or so, but you need to have bleach available and the time to stay close.

Having said that, and not being familiar with your area, you can use any brand of bleach. Generic is fine. Just make sure it's not splashless or scented. Always plain/regular. We encourage owners to shop around for the best bargain,, and if you can find regular 8.25% strength or more that's even better. When you use the Poolmath calculator to figure-out your dosage, make sure to manually update the "Weight" (%) field with the type you have. :wink:
 

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Okay, after some more discussions behind the scenes talks here, there's a consensus that the pool store products used before contain various by-products that are making your SLAM more difficult. Those products deplete the FC (Free Chlorine) and create an excessive amount of CCs as the chlorine is oxidized. This should eventually stop and the SLAM begin to work, but it will continue to require quick testing and additions of bleach until the bleach finally eliminates all of those other chemicals previously added.

At some point, you might have to perform a sand "deep clean" to help the filter work better as those products may have compromised the filter's ability to work efficiently. For now, focus on the FC and hit it "quick & consistently" to eliminate those store products and lower the CC level. We'll be watching.
 
So correct me if I'm wrong, but today looks like the first time you actually tried the quick "test and re-add bleach method of bleach (about every 10 min), and went-through 24 gallons of bleach correct? Previously before that, bleach applications were spaced-out much more between dosages which is why we believe it didn't have a chance to work as well to hold the proper FC level. But just for the record, how many gallons (in-all) have you purchased/used so far?
 
I see a slight increase in the FC the longer you do the process, but unfortunately it needs to go higher. There's no doubt the extra chemicals from before are really interfering with the breakdown process. It also sounds like you're about worn-out for the day. I can understand.

How many gallons "total" have you used since you came to us at TFP?
 
Just stumbled back onto this thread to take a peek.

I have a few questions because that is abnormally high cc:

1. When was the last time you added AA and how much?

2. Can you list the specific products you added since opening? Want to check something that might be an alternate cause of initial cloudiness. Eg. If EDTA sequestrant was used and then diphosphonic acid sequestrant...

3. Do you use antifreeze in the lines when you close? If so, who opened the pool and did it happen to get flushed into the pool instead of pumped to waste.

4. Have you used any product with MPS in it - potassium monopersulphate? It will/can create false cc readings.

Either way, to trump this beast you'll need to oxidize whatever is fighting the FC to get a good baseline going forward, but you've been at it a while and if we had an idea on these things it might make as much sense to do a partial drain, then continue a Slam if the ccs don't start dropping soon.

The decision to dilute is usually site specific, meaning water table, cost of water, bans on water, etc are all considerations.

But I'm throwing the idea out there in part knowing that you've also had metal issues, so dilution might save you a spot of future maintenance as well. At the same time, a few more sessions of dosing up might nail it...

Let us know and I'll check back and do a lookup on pool store elixirs ;)
 

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