New pool, possible leak

howardtopher

Member
Sep 22, 2019
22
Chattanooga, TN
New pool owner here, looking for advice or ideas as to what's going on here. Our pool was installed on 8/20/19. It's a 12,000 gallon 15x30 above ground resin pool. Once we got the pool filled up, we immediately noticed a wet spot coming out from under the pool. This spot is on the opposite side from the pump and skimmer (that section is dry). It's important to note that it's been very dry here. At our house, we have measured a total of 1/2 inch of rain in the last 6 weeks.

We talked to the store where we bought the pool and they told us that this is normal as the weight of the pool pushes ground water out and to just keep an eye on it. They also had us stick a piece of tape on the skimmer at the water level to measure how much was lost in a 24 hour period. That came out to 1/4 inch and it was perfectly sunny and mid-90s that day. They told us that was normal and google searches seem to confirm that. So we've just been watching it. After a couple weeks the wet spot started getting smaller so we thought perhaps it really was just ground water seeping out.

Fast forward and this last week we took a trip out of town. I filled the pool up right to the "max" line on the skimmer so it wouldn't get too low while we were gone. We were gone for 5 days total during which it was sunny, low 90s, and zero rain. When we got back, I measured 1 inch of water loss (less than 1/4 inch per day). However, the wet spot is now larger than it's ever been and pushing on the ground causes water to gather next to my finger. In fact, a picture from last night and a picture from this afternoon shows the spot is growing.

I took a paper towel, pushed it on the ground to get it wet, and then squeezed it onto a test strip and it has no free chlorine and no total chlorine in it. The pool tests with 3 ppm of both free and total chlorine. This would indicate that it's not actually pool water (unless the ground acts like a filter and filters it out).

Is this really just ground water? Is it normal to still be getting ground water when it's been this dry and it's been more than a month since installation? You can see in the picture I'm providing that the ground is so dry that it's cracked everywhere. We are about to have landscapers come in and put in a small retaining wall on one side and some river rock around the pool and we'd like to have this figured out before then. We are worried about a soft spot on the ground creating a weak area and possibly structural problems later on down the road. Are we being paranoid?
 

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Welcome to TFP.

It sure sounds like your pool water loss is from evaporation which increases this time of year as you get hot days but cooler nights. Read...


Do you have any irrigation around your?

Just an observation, 3 ppm of FC is low for an outdoor pool. What test kit do you use and how are you maintaining your water chemistry?

You might want to read ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry and our Pool School.

 
We do have irrigation in the yard, but when the installers dug the spot for the pool they cut all that out. We were expecting this as we don't use it and it existed prior to us purchasing the house. The controller is not connected to power so it can't turn on any valves by accident. We don't have any intention of fixing or using the irrigation system. I guess it's possible that there is another irrigation line under the pool we don't know about, but if there is, it's more than 1ft lower than the ones they cut through, which were already 1ft below the surface. (They dug down 2 ft for the pool and the irrigation lines they cut out are in the middle of that.) If it's from an irrigation line then perhaps there's a valve that's stuck a tiny bit open. I can cut the water completely off to it and see if that makes it stop (I just lose my pool fill-up faucet in the meantime).

Right now we are using AquaChek 7-way test strips (https://www.aquachek.com/aquachek-select-kit/) to watch the water levels. We use a Frog Leap infuzer that is continuously feeding chlorine to the pool. The Frog instruction manual says to keep the free chlorine between 0.5-1 ppm (because it uses other minerals as well) and the test strips show that 1-3ppm is the ok range. We've also been taking water samples to the store every couple weeks that they stick in a machine and tell us what to add. The chlorine levels have been fine, we've only had to do ph and alkalinity adjustments.
 
Right now we are using AquaChek 7-way test strips (AquaChek Select Kit | AquaChek Pool & Spa Testing) to watch the water levels. We use a Frog Leap infuzer that is continuously feeding chlorine to the pool. The Frog instruction manual says to keep the free chlorine between 0.5-1 ppm (because it uses other minerals as well) and the test strips show that 1-3ppm is the ok range. We've also been taking water samples to the store every couple weeks that they stick in a machine and tell us what to add. The chlorine levels have been fine, we've only had to do ph and alkalinity adjustments.

I know you stumbled into here for your leak but I will say we do not think highly of the Frog or any mineral system, or of using test strips that are inaccurate and worthless. Eventually you will hit a problem either with silver or copper stains in your pool from the minerals, algae from low chlorine, or illness because the system does not truly sanitize pool water and they give you no scientific way to confirm the pool water is sanitary.

Some things to read...



A search on Frog System using the search at the top of the page will find many threads about it.
 
Thanks for the info to read. I had actually already been searching the forums about the Frog system and seen some of the posts saying "don't do it" before you responded. The posts you linked to provided even more information. I actually left work a little early today so I could come home and remove the mineral pac and the chlorine pac from the frog. So we're not using it anymore (just an empty container in the line now) and I went to the store to buy some bleach to keep the chlorine levels up.

I just mentioned to my wife the other day that I had a hard time distinguishing the colors on the test strips and wanted to research different test systems. The chlorine pads are easy enough to tell the difference, but ph and alkalinity are very similar colors. So, now I've also purchased a TF-100.

I've also downloaded the PoolMath app and got it all set up. Once the test kit comes in I'll start logging data into the app and hopefully get a good handle on this whole thing.

This is very new to both of us. Neither of us grew up with pools and know nothing about their maintenance. I guess we are too trustworthy and honest. Trustworthy because we trusted that the store would be forthcoming with us on the differences between Frog system and no Frog system and pros/cons either way (we did ask a lot of questions). Honest because the first thing I said to my wife when I got home was "I wouldn't sell something to a customer that was going to be bad for them in the long run", to which she responded, "problems are extra business for them." Ugh. At least the frog was only $200, which is a small amount compared to the pool. Not sure it's worth the effort to go argue with them over it.

We've only had the pool for 1 month (to the day) so hopefully we haven't gotten too much metal content and CYA in the water yet. It is about time to close it down so we'll be draining some water out soon, which should help. Right now the water is crystal clear and no signs of stains.

Back to the original post topic, I have completely disconnected the irrigation system from the water line so if this water is from that, we'll know soon. It's supposed to be yet another bone dry week.

Thank you for the help and the nudge in the right direction. One day here has been far more enlightening than the last month of store visits.
 
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You have a sharp wife.

You are on the right track now with your pool care. We are here to help you and have nothing to sell you.

Make sure the beach you get has no additives, not splashless, or have any fragrances, and not Clorox that has Cloromax Technology which are polymers not suitable for pools.
 
I am from a REALLY dry part of the country so don't know your soils, but I would still be suspicious of a wet spot near a pool after a month. organic matter in the soil will burn up any chlorine so I wouldn't expect you to be able to detect any unless the pool water was super high and the leak pretty fast flowing.

if you don't find another solution and you are about to winterize, you could certainly just let the water level drop until it stops (or go ahead and lower it) and watch to see if the wet spot dries up at a certain water level - then check for holes near the new waterline. that is if it is up high on the wall. from your loss rate and the small bit of wet sand it may be a really small one on the bottom. there are dyes you can use, but for a teeny hole you will have to go really slow and not stir the water at all, then be super patient and observant to find where the dye gets sucked into the hole. get some good goggles and a snorkel tube, slather sun screen on your back and spend a few days floating right in that area really looking at the liner.
 
I would check your floor for any divots/channeling that may have occurred. Water is going to travel to the lowest spot and it's right there. It looks like a leak to me. Check your seams. Look for dirt. Holes can look like dirt is the liner was laid on a sand bed. I'd check that area first and move away from it in small sections.
 
It's been two days since disconnecting the irrigation and the wet spot is still there and not any smaller. Has to be a leak.

I've ordered better goggles and a patch kit, should get here Friday. Saturday I'll be going on a leak hunt. With it being what appears to be a small leak, I'm not sure if I'll be able to find it or not.
 

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After 2 hours on Saturday and 3 hours on Sunday, I've been unable to locate a leak. I've called a pool repair company to come in and look for it.

One interesting thing, when I came home from work today the wet spot is about half the size as it was this morning. Is it possible that a piece of dirt or something could have clogged the hole and is preventing water from getting out? Would this hinder the repair person from finding the leak?
 
I have seen small leaks in metal and concrete tanks "self seal" but not in vinyl or plastic. Try brushing the pool and see if leak goes back to "normal" - be sure to tell repair folks about the slow down incident. Keep us updated, I am curious if they find anything.
 
Howard...........first things first.................that is one OH SO CUTE kiddo you have there!! LOVE the smile!!

You are on the right track now! Finding TFP will lower your pool care costs so you can spoil that cutie even more! LOL

I am going to share a set of links I put together for new pool owners. I am going to guess you have already found a good bit of it but don't want to take any chances of missing one:
Print these out:
Pool School - Basic Pool Care Schedule

Pool School - Recommended Levels

Bookmark these:
Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals

Trouble Free Pool

Pool School - ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

Kim:kim:
 
I have seen small leaks in metal and concrete tanks "self seal" but not in vinyl or plastic. Try brushing the pool and see if leak goes back to "normal" - be sure to tell repair folks about the slow down incident. Keep us updated, I am curious if they find anything.

The pool repair person came out yesterday. Short version, he looked at the spot and didn't do any leak hunting. No charge to come out and look/talk. I will bucket test for 3-4 days and then call them back with the results and possibly do a leak hunt then.

Long story, he looked at the wet spot and I showed him pictures of what it was before it got smaller. He poked at it and said it's not saturated, just damp (it's never really been saturated). He said it's either perspiration or a very small pin hole leak. He asked how much water loss there was and I told him I only have to add water once a week and it's usually only about 1-1.25 inches that I have to add. He said that's a normal amount of water for this area. His only way of finding the leak would to be getting his scuba gear on and he felt like he wouldn't have much luck searching for a leak that small, but he would try if I wanted him to. His suggestion was to do a bucket test for a longer period than just one day and see how much water loss there is and to call them back. I'm willing to see how that goes. We're still in the 90s here (crazy) and the pool is still 86, so we have some time before closing it. At least they are willing to work with me instead of just taking my money knowing there's a high likelihood they couldn't fix it. He said if it was his pool, he would just wait and keep an eye on water loss. If the water loss rate ever gets higher then it would be easier to find the hole. He felt it's small enough that there's no worries of structural problems due to soft ground.

In my research I've discovered that hydrophones are a thing. I'm not sure if it would be worth it to try that myself (either a real one or a DIY one). If a leak that small would even pick up.

I am going to share a set of links I put together for new pool owners. I am going to guess you have already found a good bit of it but don't want to take any chances of missing one:

Thanks Kim. I'm already caring for the pool in a completely different way than I was shown how to by the pool store. I actually know the exact chemistry of the water now instead of having to take samples to the store. One month of the Frog system added enough CYA to get me up to 50ppm so I'm glad I stopped using it when I did. I've been using the poolmath app and have my logs tied to my account here as well.
 
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I delayed starting the bucket test a couple days due to some rain. After 48 hours of testing, the inside of the bucket dropped more than the water outside of the bucket. That makes me feel like I did something wrong. Is that a normal occurrence? I would expect either the pool drops more or they drop the same, but not the bucket water dropping more.
 
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