New pool build in Missouri. Finally started. First pool. Lots of pictures!

MUPPPP

Gold Supporter
Feb 7, 2019
54
Missouri
Hello, all. I've been lurking reading as much valuable information as I can from you all, as well as listening to podcasts and watching videos. I've never owned a pool so I came into this with no knowledge. I'm coming to form some opinions as far as what I want. Scary part is we start digging first of March. We got two bids, and were both very close to one another. It's pretty costly, but cheaper than what we almost did, by nearly building a new house and a new pool!

Pool/deck

  • 20x44', 3.5'-8' deep shotcrete pool.
  • Custom shape with rounded end on deep end, linear/flat edge on shallow end. (pics to come)
  • Small sun deck like 6x6'.
  • PebbleSheen Blue Surf with Shimmering Sea additive
  • (Update: Travertine pavers and coping). Pavers, coping, tile unknown as of now (this is the hardest part for us!)
  • No spa.
  • (CANCELLED--Gas firepit, type undecided. Part semicircle built in 24' seat/bench)
  • 9" shotcrete walls/floor, with 12" thick shotcrete beam on top of walls where applicable"(dunno what that means". 1/2" rebar on 9" centers.
  • "2" Schedule 40 PVC plumbing. VGB certified main drain covers and sumps with Hydrostatic valves for main drain". Greek to me.
  • 2 skimmers, 4 returns. This is what was recommended, advice appreciated. Might we need a skimmer in that grotto to prevent stuff from accumulating in that cove?
  • 200' of 6' tall aluminum fencing with two gates.
Water features:

  • (Diving board ancelled, we're now doing a jump rock due to space limitations) Inter-Fab T7 diving board, pebble color
  • Custom RicoRock Waterfall/waterslide/grotto combo with bench in grotto. Limestone color RicoRock. 15' Inter-Fab Garden Ride Slide, pebble color. Something similar to this, with some modifications, to include a more gradual/subtle transition between the rock formation and the pool deck/tile/coping. Advice appreciated here.
  • 4(or more?) GloBrite LED lights with some sort of lighting for/in grotto/waterfall.
  • ColorVision LED bubbler for sundeck.
Equipment:
  • Intellichlor IC60 SWG . PB highly recommended a "standard chlorinator" with ultraviolet, but everything i've read here and listened to and watched has turned me away from having to constantly purchase/transport/store/pour chlorine.
  • Sta-Rite System 3 Modular DE Filter, model S7MD72.
  • Pumps. I'm informed I need one for waterfall thing, and another for pool. They recommended a WhisperFlo and Intelliflo.
  • Heater: Mastertemp 400
  • Vacuum: Dolphin M500
  • Automation: Intellitouch with ScreenLogic2 interface. Don't know much about this stuff yet, but seems cool.
  • Automatic water fill.
One of the biggest things we are worried about is picking a paver/coping style that will match/blend well with the RicoRock water feature. I really want it to flow and not stick out like a sore thumb. This is my biggest fear. I don't want it to look tacky. Any advice/pictures/anything is most welcome. We are meeting the builder tomorrow and I should get my final sketch and will present here for advice. We kind of made this entire plan up as we went along and our pool builder just went with it. So if there are any glaring issues as this thread progresses, constructive criticism is desired. Thank so much to all of you for your contributions here! I look forward to participating.
 
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ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
6,617
Northern NJ
Get the IC60 SWG for your size pool.

Skip the UV. You get all the free UV your pool needs from the sun.

Skip the Kreepy Krawly and get the Dolphin.

You are headed in the right direction with the pumps and automation.
 

kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
39,735
Tallahassee, FL
I can't wait to see the design! I LOVE the deep end and the grotto/slide!

For inside the grotto you do NOT want a skimmer as it has suction. What you can do is have a small return in there that will push stuff out. Once we get a pic of your design we can work with your PB to decide where it will go. You will also want a small light inside the grotto. Oh and a shelf to put drinks on!

-Automatic water fill-instead of it being "automatic" have it being on demand/as needed. The automatic part can hide a leak until your next water bill comes. If you have it where you can turn it on and off your self then you will know how much water your pool is using. I would get one with a timer to make sure you don't forget to shut it off like I have done more than once :roll: Now I set a timer and carry it around with me LOL

-overfill drain-I would have one of these put in also. That way if you get get heavy rain the pool will not overflow. Your PB should know the rules in your area as to where you can send this water.

Make sure you get model numbers for all of the equipment.

Can you share a pic of the yard this pool will be doing in?

Kim:kim:
 

jimim

Bronze Supporter
Jun 20, 2016
2,280
NE/Pa
When I researched pool robots and after talking with the rep for my builder he said the 500 is for large complex pools. He said the 300 was for pools with a lot of free space and gentle slopes on the sides bs corners. He also said the tech on the 300 was where thier line was going in the future.

Just my 2 cents. I have a 300i. From dolphin. Not one of the online premier or diff branded ones. Those tithe same but usually r a year or 2 behind in changes they made with that model. When u dig into the specs. Like the premier that year didn’t have the swivel on the cord yet but same model from dolphin had it. That’s why the different name.

Hello, all. I've been lurking reading as much valuable information as I can from you all, as well as listening to podcasts and watching videos. I've never owned a pool so I came into this with no knowledge. I'm coming to form some opinions as far as what I want. Scary part is we start digging first of March. We got two bids, and were both very close to one another. It's pretty costly, but cheaper than what we almost did, by nearly building a new house and a new pool!

Pool/deck

  • 20x44', 3.5'-8' deep shotcrete pool.
  • Custom shape with rounded end on deep end, linear/flat edge on shallow end. (pics to come)
  • Small sun deck like 6x6'.
  • PebbleSheen Blue Surf (interested in Shimmering Sea and/or Luminous glass bead additives, can't find opinions on Luminous!)
  • Pavers, coping, tile unknown as of now (this is the hardest part for us!)
  • No spa.
  • Gas firepit, type undecided. Part semicircle built in 24' seat/bench.
  • 9" shotcrete walls/floor, "with 12" thick shotcrete beam on top of walls where applicable" (dunno what that means". 1/2" rebar on 9" centers.
  • "2" Schedule 40 PVC plumbing. VGB certified main drain covers and sumps with Hydrostatic valves for main drain". Greek to me.
  • 2 skimmers, 4 returns. This is what was recommended, advice appreciated. Might we need a skimmer in that grotto to prevent stuff from accumulating in that cove?
  • 200' of 6' tall aluminum fencing with two gates.

Water features:

  • Inter-Fab T7 diving board, pebble color
  • Custom RicoRock Waterfall/waterslide/grotto combo with bench in grotto. Limestone color RicoRock. 15' Inter-Fab Garden Ride Slide, pebble color. Something similar to this, with some modifications, to include a more gradual/subtle transition between the rock formation and the pool deck/tile/coping. Advice appreciated here.
  • 4(or more?) GloBrite LED lights with some sort of lighting for/in grotto/waterfall.
  • ColorVision LED bubbler for sundeck.

Equipment:
  • Intellichlor SWG (advice on model welcome). PB highly recommended a "standard chlorinator" with ultraviolet, but everything i've read here and listened to and watched has turned me away from having to constantly purchase/transport/store/pour chlorine. Does Ultraviolet ever add anything to a SWG pool?
  • DE filter, likely Sta-Rite System 3 Modular DE Filter, model S7MD72. PB recommended 520sqft Clean & Clear Pentair filter, but everything I'm reading makes me want a DE filter. The S7MD60/S7MD72 seem soooo easy to maintain when watching a youtube video compared to old DE filters. Price seemed similar to the 520sq ft cartridge filter.
  • Pumps. I'm informed I need one for waterfall thing, and another for pool. They recommended a WhisperFlo and Intelliflo. This is something I haven't had a chance to look into what I want/need.
  • Heater: Natural gas heater, probably the MasterTemp 400 (although ETi 400 was mentioned as a possibility by PB, but it looks like 2x price). I'm more interested in extending pool season than I am in saving on heating costs. I could be convinced to get the Pentair UltraTemp ETi hybrid gas heater/heat pump if somebody thought it would be the best option for me and may save $$ in the long run.
  • Vacuum: Interested in the Dolphin M500 (or the Dolphin Premier). I want the best robot than money can buy (within reason). Is this it? PB recommended Kreepy Krawly Prowler 920, but I think just b/c he sells mostly Pentair stuff. One thing though is we have A LOT of trees around. Should we consider an in ground vacuum type system? Any advice here is welcome.
  • Automation: Intellitouch with ScreenLogic2 interface. Don't know much about this stuff yet, but seems cool.
  • Automatic water fill. (don't know anything about this yet, advice welcome).

One of the biggest things we are worried about is picking a paver/coping style that will match/blend well with the RicoRock water feature. I really want it to flow and not stick out like a sore thumb. This is my biggest fear. I don't want it to look tacky. Any advice/pictures/anything is most welcome. We are meeting the builder tomorrow and I should get my final sketch and will present here for advice. We kind of made this entire plan up as we went along and our pool builder just went with it. So if there are any glaring issues as this thread progresses, constructive criticism is desired. Thank so much to all of you for your contributions here! I look forward to participating.
 

MUPPPP

Gold Supporter
Feb 7, 2019
54
Missouri
Got a drawing and a finalized contract. Hope I'm doing this right! Thanks to everybody for all your contributions in this forum!

Pool Dimensions:

Custom gunite pool per attached drawing dated 2/22/19.

Pool Installation:
9” thick shotcrete walls, with 12” thick shotcrete beam on top of walls where applicable, 9” thick shotcrete floor, 1⁄2” rebar on 9”
centers

Pool Equipment:
Pool includes a Pentair Variable Speed pump, System 3 D.E. Filter, Mastertemp ASME 400 gas heater with gas line from house,
valves for all plumbing lines, M500 Dolphin Robotic Vacuum, all standard maintenance tools, start-up chemicals, Extended three-
year warranty on all equipment with new pool.

Sanitation Systems:
Pentair IC-60 Salt System.

Pool Lighting:
Included are a quantity of four (4) low voltage color changing LED lights with transformer.

Plumbing:
2” and 3” Schedule 40 PVC plumbing, Quantity two skimmers and 6 returns in pool, plus VGB Certified main drain covers and
sumps, with Hydrostatic valves for main drain.

Automatic Water Fill
Automatic fill included for maintaining water depth. Includes water supply from accessible hose bib on back of house but does not
include cutting concrete if necessary.

Pool Finish
Finish to be Pebble Sheen Blue Surf plaster with added Shimmering Seas abalone shell.

Pool / Spa Tile:
Includes ceramic tile at waterline where standard coping is used, plus highlight tiles at 8” centers on steps

Cover:
Includes tan mesh winter safety cover with brass deck anchors.

Coping /Decking:
Includes 1’ border of Travertine Walnut and Rico Rock Limestone Coping. Rico Rock coping to be at Rico Rock structure areas.
Includes 900 square feet of Travertine Ivory paver stones.

Fencing:
200’ of 6’ tall aluminum fencing with two gates is included. Fence is required by local city or county ordinance.

Gravel Fill:
Includes clean gravel base under pool, and for backfill around pool. To prevent damage from freeze /thaw conditions, we will not apply gunite shell direct to soil.

Retaining Walls:
Sandstone Versa-Block retaining walls included as required with crushed gravel base, drains, geogrid for stability, wall caps, and
clean gravel backfill. Includes engineering design, and geo-testing.

Fire-Pit / Seat Wall
Not Included

Waterfall / Slide / Grotto Structure:
Includes Rico Rock structure with waterfall, 15’ Garden Ride slide with pebble color, Separate Waterfall Feature pump, Waterfall
lighting, jump rock, Planter areas in Rico Rock structure. For safety please do not use slide and jump rock at the same time.

Landscaping:
Includes finish grading, plus sod on all disturbed areas

Excess dirt:
Excess excavated dirt to be hauled off

Electrical Allowance:
An allowance of $3,500 is included for electrical, with actual amount based on inspection and quotation by certified electrician.
Electrical bonding grid to be included in electrical allowance.

Exclusions: breaking and haul off solid rock if necessary, propane tanks, repair of irrigation system, remove of underground
obstructions, construction on unstable soils, tree removal


Here's the pool layout. Unfortunately our PB doesn't have the 3D pool rendering software to give us a better picture of what this is going to look like, but I have been obsessing over it enough that I think I can picture it. Not shown on this picture is a mini-grotto/bench in the wall underneath the overhanging waterfall. I think we are going to add like 300 more sq feet of pavers with planter space and make the back yard fence bigger with a change order.

poola.jpg
 
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MUPPPP

Gold Supporter
Feb 7, 2019
54
Missouri
I can't wait to see the design! I LOVE the deep end and the grotto/slide!

For inside the grotto you do NOT want a skimmer as it has suction. What you can do is have a small return in there that will push stuff out. Once we get a pic of your design we can work with your PB to decide where it will go. You will also want a small light inside the grotto. Oh and a shelf to put drinks on!

-Automatic water fill-instead of it being "automatic" have it being on demand/as needed. The automatic part can hide a leak until your next water bill comes. If you have it where you can turn it on and off your self then you will know how much water your pool is using. I would get one with a timer to make sure you don't forget to shut it off like I have done more than once :roll: Now I set a timer and carry it around with me LOL

-overfill drain-I would have one of these put in also. That way if you get get heavy rain the pool will not overflow. Your PB should know the rules in your area as to where you can send this water.

Make sure you get model numbers for all of the equipment.

Can you share a pic of the yard this pool will be doing in?

Kim:kim:
Here are the few pics I could find quickly of our back yard.
 

Attachments

scdaren

Bronze Supporter
May 20, 2018
334
Clovis, CA
I would recommend more seating in the pool, maybe a long bench along that straight bottom wall? We did a bench all along one side of our pool, and it's our favorite feature.
 

kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
39,735
Tallahassee, FL
I am starting at the top and working my way down. I will post comments as I come across something that needs a comment. Here we go:

-pump-model number needed
-filter- brand and model number needed
-gas line-do you already have gas at the house? Is the ??? (drawing a blank on name) thing the gas goes through big enough? I have seen where people have had to do an upgrade. Don't want that charge to come as a surprise
-"valves for all plumbing lines"-what kind of valves? Not all valves are crated equal. You do NOT want plan ball valves as they will break over time. Pentair makes some good valves.
-main drains-here is a link to my favorite ones Channel Pebble Top Drain Covers — Color Match Pool Fittings
-auto fills-already talked about above
-plaster-LOVE that color!!!!
-tiles-any idea what color you want? I would love to help you pick it out! aka spend your money LOL
-Separate Waterfall Feature pump, Waterfall light-more details needed such as model numbers and brand
-jump rock-who gets to pick it out?

That is quite a slope you having going on there! LOVE the yard! You going to have to make sure the pool is far enough away from those launching points decks as I KNOW someone will feel the need to try it (my husband would be one! :roll:)

Kim:kim:
 

YippeeSkippy

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jan 17, 2012
10,544
Evans, Georgia
I would recommend more seating in the pool, maybe a long bench along that straight bottom wall? We did a bench all along one side of our pool, and it's our favorite feature.
Absolutely! I tend to poo-poo over build of seating in pools (fight the urge to be pool potatoes!) but this pool would be ideal for one just where you suggest. I'd love to sit on the side there watching kids go down that slide :)

Maddie :flower:
 

Rancho Cost-a-Lotta

Silver Supporter
Apr 10, 2018
802
Rancho Cucamonga, CA
MUPPPP...Our pool layout is similar to yours. We opted for lots of seating and I wouldn't change a thing. We like the seating under the waterfall. The seating on the opposite end of the slide acts as a step to allow the kids to get out and run back up the slide stairs. The seating along the straight wall is 11' feet long. Its a great place to relax with a drink and gives my toddler an alternate place to stand and move around.
 

Attachments

PoolGate

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jun 7, 2017
3,345
Damascus, MD
I didn't see it specifically called out in your equipment list but make sure to specify that all valves to be Jandy never-lubes.
 

bmoreswim

Mod Squad
Gold Supporter
Platinum Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 16, 2012
5,160
Central MD
+1 on a bench on the straight pool wall. Our pool is a little smaller but has a lot of benches and we love them (plenty of pics in my signature link to build). A straight wall bench would allow folks to be in the pool and facing back to the house talking with guests who are on the deck lounging.

And I'm with Kim on the color. Blue Smurf is gorgeous. And the channel drains - no chance for your robot to get stuck and they look more sleek (wish I had them).

Doing a little more thinking on the design. I really like most of it. However there was something about it that was not coming together for me regarding the curves and corners and how it relates to your very square house. For me, the one very distinct point by the steps looks out of place. However, instead of making it round, I felt like squaring off that end of the pool, in various ways, and enlarging the shelf felt right. The shelf was rather small for a pool that large. And also with the shelf being the main entry point, it would be less usable as a shelf during gatherings because people would need to be walking on it so it would be tight if there were loungers there. Here's a thought that you can most likely just ignore, but sometimes I like to think through what I would do with a certain design and setting if it were my pool. The smaller curved step design is also copyrighted by @SuzfromTexas. :) Though hers was next to a round spa so even more super cool.

 
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MUPPPP

Gold Supporter
Feb 7, 2019
54
Missouri
We really appreciate all the advice on here! We liked the odd design we came up with after consideration of the advice in this thread so we decided to keep our original plans. But based on the advice here we decided to add a 6' bench to the shallow end of the pool.

We broke ground Monday, 4/8/19. There is an update to this thread that I started a separate thread on regarding a planning issue in which there was an unexpected sewer line through our property, but we got it sorted out (34' sewer easement halts our dig). We had a few scares with the dig in that the soil was much more damp than we expected, and the walls were caving in quite a bit more than we were comfortable with (it got quite close to our deck!) but I think that the caving has stopped.

This is the final drawing with the pool and retaining wall tilted slightly to fit the sewer easement. The other pics are from the Nest camera I installed and the last picture is showing how close the caving walls got to our deck.

I also purchased a Brinno Time Lapse camera that I put in and am going to try to make a Time Lapse video of the whole project, if I have it set up correctly.





pool final drawing.jpg

day 1.jpg

day 2.jpg

day 3.jpg

day 5.jpg

IMG_5622.JPG
 
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Rich D

Bronze Supporter
Aug 3, 2018
302
MA
Great design.. This will a awesome pool...

The collapsing walls is a indication (not a guarantee) that there was a previous excavation in that area. Hopefully the PB did his due diligence and ensured they dug to undisturbed soil. It is in there best interest to do this so do not get overly concerned but do make sure you document as much of the Build as possible with plenty of pics..

Edit..

After looking at the pics again it does look like that could have been just a overexcavation of the footings for the deck which would be 4' at most so it should be a non issue.
 
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MUPPPP

Gold Supporter
Feb 7, 2019
54
Missouri
Fortunately, the wall by the deck has held (so far), even despite two big rainstorms. We finally have the entire pool framed. Next comes rebar.

97865
 
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