Intellicenter Test request - Heater Bypass Valve

Mycall9550

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
238
Houston
Howdy IC users, wondering if someone with a heater and a valve can confirm the function of the BP_VLV programming when used with heat? I'd like to know if the IC integrates any delays into the programming when calling for heat and an actuator is connected to the BP_VLV connection.


Background, I am re-plumbing the pad and replacing the heater. I wanted to use this config, but since I do not have an IC and only a EasyTouch I wanted to see the behavior of the valve with the IC.
Ex: When heat is called, does the valve open for heater (Bypass closed), wait 30 seconds, then enable heat?
When turning off the spa, does the IC system cooldown heater by pumping water for N Minutes then close heater (Bypass open)?


Slightly more detail here Automated Heater Bypass
 

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Turbo1Ton

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I think it is going to be tough, as this requires someone with the valve actuator, that is likely already wired up, to tear into their system and pull the cable out of the IC panel and reroute to the heater just for a test. Not saying that I didn't consider it, but when I realized exactly what was entailed, I hesitated. If someone has an extra actuator laying around, that would be easier. But as pricey as they are, I doubt many people have them laying around.

I may play around with it this weekend, but I haven't committed to anything yet as I have a fairly busy weekend. I would like to understand how this bypass setup works as opposed to the way I have set mine up. Will be happy to post my findings if I do anything.

--Jeff
 

Mycall9550

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
238
Houston
Yeah @Turbo1Ton ! Way to step up, I know it's not an easy ask. If you think about it, we're just moving a cable right? I know that itslef is a chore. Trust me.
Essentially, the ask is to move the valve connector from the board's RETURN to BP_VLV. We just have to see what it does.
No need to move the actuator from, say the return diverter (Pool/Spa mode), to the heater bypass. It's more to verify the logic programmed into the IntelliCenter.

Sample Test Plan:
  1. Stage the connections: Move from RETURN to BP_VLV.
  2. Call for heat and monitor the valve (ex. Spa mode), let heater run hot (10min?)
    1. Does it move immediately?
    2. Any delay between actuation and call for heat?
  3. Change to Pool mode
    1. Does it move immediately?
    2. Any delay between heater shutoff and valve rotation?
Only real risk here is at the start draining the spa early (suction would be on spa, but return on pool (and not yet to spa mode)).

My expectation is it would not have any delays, but the instructions, which I included, are only for an IC. Since this is referenced in the heater manual, and there is a valve dedicated to automate, I dont see why others cannot replicate so long as they timing of valve and heat are factored.

One thing we cannot test, is if the Intellivalve would be partially open?

2020-02-10_16-48-26-jpg.127314
 

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wgipe

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I actually have a new IC and already have an actuator sitting on the bypass for that very purpose. Water has not yet been filled to the skimmers so I can’t test until that happens but I’d be happy to report back when I do. Right now I have that valve connected to the first valve control. I didn’t know there was a dedicated bypass connection - cool. We may have water filled yet this week so perhaps I can play with it this weekend.
C2C9B856-6F2F-45EE-A1AF-7E7B9AA686CE.jpeg
 

Mycall9550

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
238
Houston
I love that plumbing, you should see my ch it show. They must have been paid a bonus for every 90* past a quantity of 10. Perfect bypass config!
 

Turbo1Ton

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Well, bad news. Had a few hours free this evening and went to take a look at this and possibly try and check it out. My heater board doesn't have that BP_VLV connector on it. Looks like that manual was written in September of 2020, which means that feature is likely only available on the late model heaters. Mine is an early 2019 build.

Looks like @wgipe may be your only hope.

pc help GIF


--Jeff
 

wgipe

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I love that plumbing, you should see my ch it show. They must have been paid a bonus for every 90* past a quantity of 10. Perfect bypass config!
Thanks man! I am somewhat of a perfectionist, so I built the pool house and did all the equipment myself. 😬
I should have some time this weekend to check to see of I have the BP port on the board. I bought my heater last May, so it may or may not. If so, I can reroute the valve cable in 15 minutes. I’d love it if that worked.
 

Mycall9550

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
238
Houston
My apologies @Turbo1Ton , my first run at the manual and I read it as IC panel and not heater PCB.
So that may be a + for me if it is present when delivered, but I dont have the heater yet. Bonus if it does, because I do not have the IC controller.
 

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Turbo1Ton

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No apologies necessary! I was hoping to figure out a better way to run my system! But alas, I'll have to stick to the way I've got it set up currently.

The one thing that I didn't see was if it was possible for that bypass to have freeze protection on it so that the bypass would allow flow through the heater if the temps dropped. Currently the way mine is setup, I have freeze protection on it so that it will allow flow through the heater if temps get too low. The dead leg between the diverter valve and where it tees back in, I'm not so worried about, as it is open on one end.

--Jeff
 

Mycall9550

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
238
Houston
While more complicated, one way if you have free relay's (via transformer) is to connect the valve to a relay and assign it with freeze protection. Problably in the same boat as I, but I placed too much reliance on freeze protection which is only good if there is electricity. I think I saw in the VSF pumps, they too can broker the bypass valve. But if you have an IC or ET, Im not exactly sure how that works. My understanding is you move the control from the pump to the automation system.

edit/ I guess that goes back to the intellicenter if it can actuate based on my original plan. See post: Automated Heater Bypass
 
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Turbo1Ton

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Oh, I currently have freeze protection on the heater bypass circuit. No additional relay required.

I read your other thread, earlier. Just now re-reading it, I realized that you and Jim mentioned a 'Pool and Spa heat active' command. I am going to have to see if IC has this command. I didn't notice it when I was doing my initial setup.

Might be worthwhile to give Pentair tech support a call and discuss with them what they 'think' it will do.

--Jeff
 

Mycall9550

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
238
Houston
Im hoping the new heater will have the bypass valve on the back of the PCB, would love to not have to use 1 of the 2 Valve controls I am limited to.
Good luck on the support call, I'm out of support. I dont trust the pool company's to give a knowledgeable answer. I find I educate them, but this one store the tech just wont give in a a full DE filter clean vs a backwash. He seems to think you can get the grids clean with a backwash. Oy vey
 

wgipe

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So....are we talking about the circuit board on the back of the control panel? If so, there is no connector that would mate to the valve connector on my heater version. :(
 

Turbo1Ton

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That's where it appears it should be, according to the instructions on the bypass kit. Figures Pentair would develop instructions to something that they haven't actually built yet.

--Jeff
 

wgipe

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That's where it appears it should be, according to the instructions on the bypass kit. Figures Pentair would develop instructions to something that they haven't actually built yet.

--Jeff
...and they sell auto over expansion boards for the IntelliCenter while refusing to release the manual because it hasn’t been through legal. Took me 2-3 hours on the phone with them to finally g we t them to agree to release it to me.
 
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Mycall9550

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
238
Houston
I don't know what to say. I get page references getting out of place, but what a miss on their part.
That said, the Pentair Mastertemp 400K manual shows the connection on the back of the PCB. Reading further into the manual it states the logic on pg 47:
BP-VALVE (By-pass Valve):
Enabled/DisabledBy-pass Valve Description

The purpose of the automatic BPVALVE (bypass valve) feature is to by-pass the flow of water from the heater inlet to the heater outlet when the heater is not firing. There is a minimal amount of water flow through the heater when the heater is not firing, and a maximum water flow through the heater when the heater is firing. For more information about Manual By-Pass and Automatic By-Pass valves, see page 14-15.

By-Pass Enabled
When the BYPASS VALVE feature is enabled and there is a call for heat, the by-pass valve closes to allow water to flow through the heater. It takes 30 seconds for the bypass valve to rotate to the closed position. This allows the valve to complete rotation so there is sufficient water flow and pressure to prevent the water pressure switch from trigging an error. When the call for heat ends, the water flow continues through the heat exchanger for a cool down period of one minute. After the cool down period, the by-pass valve will rotate so that water no longer flows through the heater.

By-Pass Disabled
When the BYPASS VALVE feature is disabled, there is no automatic switching of the by-pass valve when the heater starts a heating cycle. The valve stays in the position and water always flows through the heater.
At least the manual states the expected logic.
I'd still love to see this implemented, and even more for it to work correctly. Will wait and see.

Page 15 bypass reference is attached in post 1.
Heater PCB board attached below with BP_VLV Connection call out (see manual page 40).
 

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