Help Switching To SWG / Start Up Process

[parkinsmith]

It is time to switch over to the SWG from the chlorinator for my startup process . I am in need of some help. I am trying to learn the BEST way to do this. I have some questions and would be grateful for any help and advice that can be provided. Any helpful links would also be great.

I have a 15k Pool with a Hayward SWG TCELL 925 controlled by the Pro Logic Panel.

1. Are there optimum chemical ranges that the pool should be in BEFORE adding the salt and turning on the SWG? My CYA is starting to get high from chlorinator pucks its at 100 right now, FC was 9.5 , PH 7.6
2. When determining how many pounds of salt to add for a start up I know I need to look at the manual for the SWG and all it says is ideal range 2700-3400 ppm how do I figure out how much salt needs to be added to achieve this range ?
3. I read that range settings should be based on how long and speeds you run your pump at . I am not sure what I will run pump at for fall and winter as this is the first season with the pool so how do I set this at the start and when /how do I need to change it ? ( I am in TX)
3. Best way to add salt? I assume not all at once ? Do it in stages ?
4. Does the pump run while adding ?
5. How long to run the pump after adding 24/7 ? For a bit .
6. Does salt need constant adjusting like chlorine ?

 

[Flying Tivo]

1. You need to lower CYA at least 70ppm so that would be about 30% drain.
2. Use poolmath app to figure out how much salt to add, add 80% and then check levels, then add the rest if needed. Your pool may aready have salt.
3. Look at the Wiki to determine how long to run, a pool usually needs 2-4ppm of FC a day.
4. yes leave the pump running while you add salt, and wait at least 48 hrs to start the SWG
5.48hrs
6. No unless dilution occurs due to heavy rainfall.

 

[jdlangley1]

Make sure you test your current salt level in your pool before adding anything. I recently converted my pool to salt and had around 1500 ppm of salt already in it from adding liquid chlorine and Muratic acid.

 

[pjt]

Are there optimum chemical ranges that the pool should be in BEFORE adding the salt and turning on the SWG? My CYA is starting to get high from chlorinator pucks its at 100 right now, FC was 9.5 , PH 7.6

For TX, I would target a CYA of 80. If you can do a small partial drain and fill, that would be ideal. How's the rest of your chemistry (TA, CH)? Share your PoolMath logs.

When determining how many pounds of salt to add for a start up I know I need to look at the manual for the SWG and all it says is ideal range 2700-3400 ppm how do I figure out how much salt needs to be added to achieve this range ?

I would target 3000. Before adding salt, test your water with a K-1766 first. To estimate the amount of salt needed, use PoolMath: "Effect of Adding" --> "Salt". Are you confident in the accuracy of your pool volume?

I read that range settings should be based on how long and speeds you run your pump at . I am not sure what I will run pump at for fall and winter as this is the first season with the pool so how do I set this at the start and when /how do I need to change it ? ( I am in TX)

I think you're asking how long to run your pump and what your SWG % should be. Pump RPM doesn't affect chlorine output as long as the flow switch is closed. Use PoolMath to assist: "Effects of Adding" --> "SWG". Use the magnifying glass to find your SWG and its daily chlorine production.

Best way to add salt? I assume not all at once ? Do it in stages ?

Add a little less salt than PoolMath calls for, wait 24 hours, then retest with the K-1766. Add more salt if needed. It's easy to add salt, but draining is needed to remove salt. Make sure the SWG is off before adding salt and stays off until it's thoroughly mixed (>24 hours). Use high quality salt with no additives. I use Diamond Crystal Solar Naturals water softener salt, but there are many other quality salts.

Does the pump run while adding ?

Yes. Make sure the SWG is off.

How long to run the pump after adding 24/7 ? For a bit

Run the pump with the SWG off for at least 24 hours after adding the salt.

Does salt need constant adjusting like chlorine ?

No. Salt only decreases through overflow or splashout.

 

[parkinsmith]

For TX, I would target a CYA of 80. If you can do a small partial drain and fill, that would be ideal. How's the rest of your chemistry (TA, CH)? Share your PoolMath logs.


I would target 3000. Before adding salt, test your water with a K-1766 first. To estimate the amount of salt needed, use PoolMath: "Effect of Adding" --> "Salt". Are you confident in the accuracy of your pool volume?


I think you're asking how long to run your pump and what your SWG % should be. Pump RPM doesn't affect chlorine output as long as the flow switch is closed. Use PoolMath to assist: "Effects of Adding" --> "SWG". Use the magnifying glass to find your SWG and its daily chlorine production.


Add a little less salt than PoolMath calls for, wait 24 hours, then retest with the K-1766. Add more salt if needed. It's easy to add salt, but draining is needed to remove salt. Make sure the SWG is off before adding salt and stays off until it's thoroughly mixed (>24 hours). Use high quality salt with no additives. I use Diamond Crystal Solar Naturals water softener salt, but there are many other quality salts.


Yes. Make sure the SWG is off.


Run the pump with the SWG off for at least 24 hours after adding the salt.


No. Salt only decreases through overflow or splashout.

Thank you for the very helpful info!

The PB is sending their pool service company out to switch over to the salt tomorrow however the water is not balanced , I plan to not have them add salt if the water is out of balance . I am assuming it is critical to have the water in balance before adding salt?

The numbers from the other day were FC 9.5, PH 7.6, TA 80, CH 110 ( low) CYA 100.

I am adding a little water today and will test again later this evening and include the salt test to see if there is any in the water.

Question : When you say "as long as the flow switch is closed" does that mean that if it is closed the speed and duration I run the pump at does not matter as it will not affect the SWG ? So no adjustments to settings will need to be made?

 

[pjt]

I am assuming it is critical to have the water in balance before adding salt?

If you're going to perform a partial drain & fill, do that before adding salt. Are you confident that your CYA is not over 100? A CYA level of 100 is not ideal, but can be managed. The CYA level will slowly go down over time, and in a few months you'll be at 80.

If you're not going to drain & fill, it's no problem to add salt. CH can be increased after the salt is added.

TA 80, CH 110 ( low)

What's the TA and CH of your fill water?

if it is closed the speed and duration I run the pump at does not matter as it will not affect the SWG ?

As long as the flow switch is closed, your pump RPM doesn't affect SWG output. The amount of FC generated is a function of your pump run time and your SWG %. Use PoolMath to assist: "Effects of Adding" --> "SWG". Use the magnifying glass to find your SWG and its daily chlorine production.

So no adjustments to settings will need to be made?

Start with a pump run time and SWG % that will daily increase the FC by ~4. Measure your FC several times a week and make adjustments from there. You'll make seasonal adjustments to your generation (more in the summer, less in the winter). Error on the side of generating more FC than not enough.

 

[parkinsmith]

If you're going to perform a partial drain & fill, do that before adding salt. Are you confident that your CYA is not over 100? A CYA level of 100 is not ideal, but can be managed. The CYA level will slowly go down over time, and in a few months you'll be at 80.

If you're not going to drain & fill, it's no problem to add salt. CH can be increased after the salt is added.


What's the TA and CH of your fill water?


As long as the flow switch is closed, your pump RPM doesn't affect SWG output. The amount of FC generated is a function of your pump run time and your SWG %. Use PoolMath to assist: "Effects of Adding" --> "SWG". Use the magnifying glass to find your SWG and its daily chlorine production.


Start with a pump run time and SWG % that will daily increase the FC by ~4. Measure your FC several times a week and make adjustments from there. You'll make seasonal adjustments to your generation (more in the summer, less in the winter). Error on the side of generating more FC than not enough.

Hi
I tested my water this AM. I did put some water in yesterday as the pool was a little low and it knocked back the CYA a bit . Here are the numbers .
Salt 600ppm , FC 6 , CC 0 , PH 7.8, TA 80, CH 120, CYA 70 ( used taykor kit for this )
The TA and CH of the fill water was CH 12 and TA 250 ( that was back a month ago when I was getting ready to fill).

I used the pool math app and don't think I see my SWG on the list . I have a Hayward Turbo 925 all that is listed is for T Cell is a T-Cell -5 any idea how I can find the daily production so I can calculate the daily generation? The manual is lame only two pages and does not provide that info .

I am going to want to run my pump 24/7 and in late fall and winter at much lower speeds. Right now it's at 80% 24/7 just to get started , it is still hot here in TX.

Trying to figure out what percentage to set the SWG at for start .

 

[mknauss]

I used the pool math app and don't think I see my SWG on the list . I have a Hayward Turbo 925

You have an equivalent to a T9. That is 25K rated. If you say it is a T5 - that is 20 K rated.

 

[pjt]

CYA 70

Did you drain some of your water? CYA won't quickly decrease from 100 to 70 unless water was drained or there's testing error.

CH of the fill water was CH 12

Is that a typo? You can't measure 12.

I used the pool math app

Would you please enable sharing of your PoolMath logs?

any idea how I can find the daily production so I can calculate the daily generation?

Contact Hayward. This listing shows 1.32 lbs/day, but it's best to get data from the manufacturer. Salt Cell Replacement, T-Cell, Hayward (TCELL925-W)

I am going to want to run my pump 24/7 and in late fall and winter at much lower speeds.

Low speed 24/7 operation with a SWG is great. Why would you decrease the RPM in the late fall and winter and increase during the other times of the year? You can keep a constant low RPM year round. I operate 24/7 at 1,000 RPM, which is enough to satisfy my SWG and enables good skimming. My pump consumes ~70 watts, which is ~$5 in electricity every month.

Right now it's at 80% 24/7 just to get started

Using PoolMath (at 1.32 lbs/day), that would raise your FC by 8.4 daily. Set your cell to 40% output, and that should generate ~4 FC every day. Measure and make small adjustments from there.

 

[parkinsmith]

Did you drain some of your water? CYA won't quickly decrease from 100 to 70 unless water was drained or there's testing error.


Is that a typo? You can't measure 12.


Would you please enable sharing of your PoolMath logs?


Contact Hayward. This listing shows 1.32 lbs/day, but it's best to get data from the manufacturer. Salt Cell Replacement, T-Cell, Hayward (TCELL925-W)


Low speed 24/7 operation with a SWG is great. Why would you decrease the RPM in the late fall and winter and increase during the other times of the year? You can keep a constant low RPM year round. I operate 24/7 at 1,000 RPM, which is enough to satisfy my SWG and enables good skimming. My pump consumes ~70 watts, which is ~$5 in electricity every month.


Using PoolMath (at 1.32 lbs/day), that would raise your FC by 8.4 daily. Set your cell to 40% output, and that should generate ~4 FC every day. Measure and make small adjustments from there.

Hi , sorry for my delayed response , my husband just had a hip replacement a week ago and I have been caring for him while trying to get the pool going for the first time.

So here is where I am at. The pool serv company came out , showed me how to engage /disengage the SWG, set teh % etc, They added (6) 40 lb bags of salt to start , I waited 24 hrs and then turned on the SWG . This morning the system said it was 2400ppm , my Taylor kit says it's 2200. ( Is it common for the Taylor kit to give a different reading than the digital reading on the system ? If so, which would you say is more accurate ? In any event I need to add more salt . Which I will do today but add one less bag than the app says so I can still go slow .

My PH tested high this AM at 8.0 ( it was 7.8 Wednesday before adding the salt ) so I need to add MA. I am not sure if I should add the MA or the Salt first ? How long to wait in between adding each ?

I have a check system light on and low salt warning , I assume this is because the salt has not yet reached the minimum level ? Will the light go off once the system has the correct level of salt ?

Today I did enable the sharing of logs not not sure how it works as I am new at this.

With regard to the CYA , it had been hot here and I needed to add water to the pool to get the level back up so I did and then got that lower CYA reading ( today it was 60). One thing I have noticed is that I get a different number than when the pool serv tested it . I test with a new taylor kit and they have a tayor kit as well.

As far as the first test of the fill water , I did not yet have a test kit and I took the fill water to Leslies to be tested. I have attached the report from that test and it does say 12 next to Calcium Hardness . It is 120 today and I need to add some .

Thanks again for all your guidance, it has been a HUGE help !

Jen

 

[pjt]

Is it common for the Taylor kit to give a different reading than the digital reading on the system ?

Yes.

which would you say is more accurate ?

The Taylor K-1766. However, if the SWG is happy with its measurement of salt, it will generate chlorine.

In any event I need to add more salt

Yes. Add two more 40 lb bags of salt, let everything dissolve and mix for >24 hours, then test again.

I am not sure if I should add the MA or the Salt first ?

Doesn't matter.

How long to wait in between adding each ?

No waiting required.

I have a check system light on and low salt warning , I assume this is because the salt has not yet reached the minimum level ?

Yes. This is to be expected.

Will the light go off once the system has the correct level of salt ?

Yes.

Today I did enable the sharing of logs not not sure how it works as I am new at this.

It's working, I can see your logs. Hover your mouse over someone's name or avatar and you'll see a blue button that says "PoolMath Logs". Try it on my name (or your name).

got that lower CYA reading ( today it was 60)

No rush adding the CYA. We're in autumn now, the days are shorter and the sun is less intense. It's much more important to keep CYA up in the summer.

As far as the first test of the fill water , I did not yet have a test kit and I took the fill water to Leslies to be tested. I have attached the report from that test and it does say 12 next to Calcium Hardness . It is 120 today and I need to add some .

Pool store testing is counterproductive. What is your fill water TA and CH measured with your K-2006?

Pentair Auto Chlorine Feeder

Are you keeping this or removing it?

 

[parkinsmith]

Yes.


The Taylor K-1766. However, if the SWG is happy with its measurement of salt, it will generate chlorine.


Yes. Add two more 40 lb bags of salt, let everything dissolve and mix for >24 hours, then test again.


Doesn't matter.


No waiting required.


Yes. This is to be expected.


Yes.


It's working, I can see your logs. Hover your mouse over someone's name or avatar and you'll see a blue button that says "PoolMath Logs". Try it on my name (or your name).


No rush adding the CYA. We're in autumn now, the days are shorter and the sun is less intense. It's much more important to keep CYA up in the summer.


Pool store testing is counterproductive. What is your fill water TA and CH measured with your K-2006?


Are you keeping this or removing it?

Thanks for getting back to me ! GREAT and very helpful info.
I will test my fill water with my kit tomorrow and let you know. The Chlorinator is plumbed into everything BUT I really don't like using those tabs . I was thinking of keeping it off and just using liquid when its too cold for the SWG to work . Thoughts ? I have another question , when looking at the Pool Math app when it shows how much MA to add to lower PH it says Add 13 oz or 1 cup 5 oz BY VOLUME to reach the target . What does that mean , how do I calculate the 13 oz by volume. Not sure how to calculate by volume . My pool is 15, 000 gallons.

 

[mknauss]

Add 13 oz or 1 cup 5 oz BY VOLUME to reach the target

Use a plastic measuring cup. Measure out 13 oz.

Or just use a short pour from the jug. The amount does not need to be that exact.

 

[pjt]

BUT I really don't like using those tabs

Good. Once your SWG is online, you'll never/seldom need them again. Don't add any new tabs. Completely use up whatever's in the tab feeder. When it starts to leak, remove it. Or, you can remove it once all the tabs are dissolved.

using liquid when its too cold for the SWG to work

That's what most people do, including me. FC demand in the winter is very low. Last winter, I used a grand total of one gallon of LC for the entire season.

how do I calculate the 13 oz by volume

When pouring, visualize filling a 12 oz soda can. You don't need to be that precise. You can always add more if needed. Pour straight from the jug into the pool: Adding Muriatic

 

[parkinsmith]

Good. Once your SWG is online, you'll never/seldom need them again. Don't add any new tabs. Completely use up whatever's in the tab feeder. When it starts to leak, remove it. Or, you can remove it once all the tabs are dissolved.


That's what most people do, including me. FC demand in the winter is very low. Last winter, I used a grand total of one gallon of LC for the entire season.


When pouring, visualize filling a 12 oz soda can. You don't need to be that precise. You can always add more if needed. Pour straight from the jug into the pool: Adding Muriatic

Soda can trick very helpful ! Thanks for the info on the chlorine. I HATE that tab thing ! A few more questions, when adding just a bag or two of salt do you need to wait 24 hrs to turn the SWG back on ? Also I have gotten high PH readings ever since I have been adding salt. The Taylor test says it's at 8.0 as that is the top number on the Taylor tester the color is super bright pink . Does the salt drive up the PH? Is it possible it is higher than the 8.0 and I need to be adding more MA ? How do I test to see if it's higher than the max on the Taylor test ?

 

[parkinsmith]

Use a plastic measuring cup. Measure out 13 oz.

Or just use a short pour from the jug. The amount does not need to be that exact.

Thank you . super helpful info .

 

[pjt]

Soda can trick very helpful

Another technique is estimating using the gallon jug. A gallon is 128 oz. So, 12 oz is ~1/10th of a jug, 32 oz is 1/4 jug, etc..

when adding just a bag or two of salt do you need to wait 24 hrs to turn the SWG back on ?

If it's just a bag or two, waiting 24 hours is ideal, but not a hard requirement. Keep the SWG off for a few hours until the salt is dissolved and thoroughly mixed.

Also I have gotten high PH readings ever since I have been adding salt.

Trichlor tabs are acidic. Once you stop using them, you'll notice pH rise. Lowering your TA down towards 50 will slow the pH rise. You'll want to add a little calcium to bring up your CH.

Does the salt drive up the PH?

No.

Is it possible it is higher than the 8.0 and I need to be adding more MA ? How do I test to see if it's higher than the max on the Taylor test ?

Possibly. You can add enough MA to lower the pH by ~0.3, wait >30 minutes and remeasure. If you're confident your pH is 8.0, that's fine. Your CSI is good. Over time, your pH will probably settle in the high 7s.

 

[parkinsmith]

Another technique is estimating using the gallon jug. A gallon is 128 oz. So, 12 oz is ~1/10th of a jug, 32 oz is 1/4 jug, etc..


If it's just a bag or two, waiting 24 hours is ideal, but not a hard requirement. Keep the SWG off for a few hours until the salt is dissolved and thoroughly mixed.


Trichlor tabs are acidic. Once you stop using them, you'll notice pH rise. Lowering your TA down towards 50 will slow the pH rise. You'll want to add a little calcium to bring up your CH.


No.


Possibly. You can add enough MA to lower the pH by ~0.3, wait >30 minutes and remeasure. If you're confident your pH is 8.0, that's fine. Your CSI is good. Over time, your pH will probably settle in the high 7s.

Thanks for the info , I thought about marking the MA gallons with a sharpie until I get the hang of it . Will test PH again tomorrow . I know it is at least 8.0 at last test. I added MA again and will see what happens . Interesting about the tabs. I knew something was going on but was not sure what the culprit was . The rise in PH does coincide with stopping the use of the tabs . Thanks again for all this valuable info !

 

[parkinsmith]

HI , I have been monitoring my water since I got the SWG going and the Chlorine level is drifting up , today it was 13.5. I have the SWG set at 40% , do you think I need to adjust this percentage ? Three days ago it was 8. The PH is still high so I will be adding more MA . I have logged the latest results in the app . Also my SWG digital read out showing 3200 , Taylor test kit showing 2800. Just wondering what advice you might have to help me get everything in balance.