Filter "exploited"

southflorida427

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2017
80
Miami FL
Don't even know where to start here. Well, see the pictures.

Some background story:
- Both the filter encasing and the cartridge not more than 3 months of usage.
- Pool recently resurfaced (November 2018)
- Big areas of decoloration after the 30-day curing process (proper chemistry kept and daily brushing)
- Both pool builder and material (NPT quartzscapes) representative came to inspect. "you need a scaling treatment"
- I did the scaling treatment using Jacks Magic #2. Keep chemistry and followed instructions per specs. Specs also call for adding their sequestering agent (Magenta stuff) AND keep low pH, low alkalinity, and low chlorine.
- After two weeks not much changed. Contacted Jacks Magic representative. "Add more magenta stuff (sequestering) and let's keep a close eye on it. While on it try our filter stuff to better capture those particles the agent is encapsulating". I have to be honest, I don't know how he convinced me on this one, I should've known better.
- The last filter clean no more than two weeks ago. (as specs call for cleaning filter regularly, along with 24/7 pump)
- Of course in the middle of this, algae bloom because Chlorine needed to be kept very low per "specs". Shocked with liquid clorine with eyes closed. Couldn't do SLAM because per Jacks Magic rep the free chlorine read would false read because of the scale treatment. I'm still fighting algae...

and then......today......... when I went to clean the filter, I noticed it was almost over 10 psi over normal clean psi (red line)...opened, and this is what I came to.....

I'll post test later on today, the last set of tests was alkalinity around 20, pH around 6.5, calcium around 400, cya 60, cl don't know how to test. I know my numbers are not where they should be but again, following the directions on the Scale treatment specs (they ask for free chlorine between 1-3, pH low in the 6s, alkalinity low between 20-30, calcium increasing "is a good sing, the treatment is attacking the scale" said the rep).

Ideas on why this filter exploited? (or imploded?).

PS; needed to vent this out...thnx for reading...

4qnY9HHXSq+gZ6T1TLdcIQ.jpgbTVDcTG+TNqEkpRPPEPROw.jpg1V1f9TRAQ46qd8Z2DseOIQ.jpgCvhZXDggT4OaTXsR879IuQ.jpglnfjkfxET8+2+NbuYG8Ipw.jpgokDCC1IkTdyDAjqu70i7uA.jpg
 

JamesW

TFP Expert
Mar 2, 2011
17,358
Are the inlet and outlet plumbed correctly?

Did someone add de to the filter?

What was the filter pressure?
 
Last edited:

Jimrahbe

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 7, 2014
15,773
Bedford, TX
427,

Not trying to pile on, but I think it is pretty evident looking at the pics...

With all the "stuff" you have been adding to your pool and you have algae, you need to be cleaning your small cartridge filter every couple of days if not more...

The filter just can't support the amount of gunk it is collecting.

Let's see what our other members have to say...

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
  • Like
Reactions: setsailsoon

kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
43,249
Tallahassee, FL
Well it tired to do it's job! WOW! You have been dealing with a lot THEN this??? OUCH! I have a big sad for you. I would share these pics with them and see what they have to say. I am so sorry this happened to you :(
 
  • Like
Reactions: southflorida427

southflorida427

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2017
80
Miami FL
Are the inlet and outlet plumbed correctly?

Did someone add de to the filter?

What was the filter pressure?
I added the “the filter fiber stuff” a product by Jacks Magic. I suspect of it, bur can’t realy know for sure.

Filter is properly instaled. I’ll grt back to you on the PSI as soon I get back home. It was 10 over the “clean” PSI.
 

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
12,889
Northern NJ
Looks like the filter clogged solid and the water pressure crushed the filter. Shows you the power of the pump and the lack of compressibility of water.

There was probably a point where the filter pressure spiked real high as the filter clogged and then once the filter split the pressure dropped with water flowing again. Better the filter media split then the case explode to release the pressure.
 
  • Like
Reactions: setsailsoon

JamesW

TFP Expert
Mar 2, 2011
17,358
That type of damage typically points to the inlet and outlet being reversed. Double check that the plumbing is correct.

The dirt seems to be all on the outside, which would indicate correct plumbing, but double check anyway.

The Whisperflo is a high head pump, which means that it can produce a lot of pressure, which can crush a filter cartridge.

It might just be an overpressure issue.

Algae can quickly clog a cartridge, especially if it's undersized.

Adding a filter aid only makes the problem worse. Filter aid is usually not a good idea, especially when there is a lot of stuff going into the filter.

If filter aid is going to be used, it should only be used on clear water.
 

sktn77a

Gold Supporter
May 16, 2010
1,487
Chapel Hill, NC
"Big areas of decoloration after the 30-day curing process (proper chemistry kept and daily brushing). Both pool builder and material (NPT quartzscapes) representative came to inspect. "you need a scaling treatment"

"You need a scaling treatment?" If you've got scaling within 30 days (I very much doubt that's what it is), he should be attending to it. What you most likely have is a plastering deficiency. Search on this forum for plaster mottling.
 

southflorida427

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2017
80
Miami FL
I t
"Big areas of decoloration after the 30-day curing process (proper chemistry kept and daily brushing). Both pool builder and material (NPT quartzscapes) representative came to inspect. "you need a scaling treatment"

"You need a scaling treatment?" If you've got scaling within 30 days (I very much doubt that's what it is), he should be attending to it. What you most likely have is a plastering deficiency. Search on this forum for plaster mottling.
That’s a whole different story. I complained, threy came to “inspect”. This is what they concluded needed to be done. They are not taking the blame. Only thing left is to lawyer up and to be honest for a 3k$ resurface job I’m not sure it’s worth it. They know that also, that’s why this stories are always like this...
 

southflorida427

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2017
80
Miami FL
That type of damage typically points to the inlet and outlet being reversed. Double check that the plumbing is correct.

The dirt seems to be all on the outside, which would indicate correct plumbing, but double check anyway.

The Whisperflo is a high head pump, which means that it can produce a lot of pressure, which can crush a filter cartridge.

It might just be an overpressure issue.

Algae can quickly clog a cartridge, especially if it's undersized.

Adding a filter aid only makes the problem worse. Filter aid is usually not a good idea, especially when there is a lot of stuff going into the filter.

If filter aid is going to be used, it should only be used on clear water.
This filter has the the top opening as the inlet. Bottom opening is to pool. Outlet of pump correctly piped to filter upper opening.

I had a small 90sq hayward filter. Same whisperflow. While on the renovation job I replaced the filter by this 200sq. Same pump was used. I never had an issue with the filter cartridge/pressure with the small 90sq.
 

southflorida427

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2017
80
Miami FL
I t


That’s a whole different story. I complained, threy came to “inspect”. This is what they concluded needed to be done. They are not taking the blame. Only thing left is to lawyer up and to be honest for a 3k$ resurface job I’m not sure it’s worth it. They know that also, that’s why this stories are always like this...
Oh, forgot to mention, I was alto totally skeptical about it. When they came to “inspect” the show me: took me to one of the areas, he applied the powder; inmediately started to react and the whitish came off. Maybe a lucky spot. But after seeying that I had to give it a try...
 

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
16,219
Tucson, AZ
Poor plaster job created mottling.

Plaster sub, NPT and pool builder are playing a game of “cover my a _ _” by pointing to NPC technical literature that says plaster discolorations and variations are a water chemistry problem so that blame can be shifted to the pool owner. There is ample evidence that poor plaster workmanship is the cause of these issues but the industry will protect their own.

Pool owner is sent on a wild goose chase using chemical treatments that are inappropriate for the issues at hand. Said chemical treatments have now caused physical equipment damage.

The solution - cut bait & go home. Pay the PB for his work, send him home and take charge of the pool. Get the filter operational, stop ALL scale treatments and deal with the algae issue. Rebalance thexwster after algae is gone and simply learn to live with the plaster surface you have....”embrace the entropy”....
 

southflorida427

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2017
80
Miami FL
Poor plaster job created mottling.

Plaster sub, NPT and pool builder are playing a game of “cover my a _ _” by pointing to NPC technical literature that says plaster discolorations and variations are a water chemistry problem so that blame can be shifted to the pool owner. There is ample evidence that poor plaster workmanship is the cause of these issues but the industry will protect their own.

Pool owner is sent on a wild goose chase using chemical treatments that are inappropriate for the issues at hand. Said chemical treatments have now caused physical equipment damage.

The solution - cut bait & go home. Pay the PB for his work, send him home and take charge of the pool. Get the filter operational, stop ALL scale treatments and deal with the algae issue. Rebalance thexwster after algae is gone and simply learn to live with the plaster surface you have....”embrace the entropy”....
Unfortunately I think you are 100% right. Exactly how I feel; exactly what I think it’s happening. Sad that it’s like that.

I was already on the verge; just waiting for the clorine to stop false reading to go back to normal business....but then today the filter cartrige exploited/imploded.
 

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
16,219
Tucson, AZ
If you stop using the filter fiber stuff from Jacks, you should be able to SLAM and get the algae cleared up fast. Their scale chemicals should only affect the CC and total chlorine reading. If you use the DPD-FAS titration test, you can at least get the FC reading correct. You should also bring your alkalinity back up a bit higher to get the pH to at least 7.2. At your current levels, the water is very aggressive towards plaster and you’ll only etching the surface the longer it’s allowed to stay as low as it is.
 
  • Like
Reactions: southflorida427

southflorida427

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2017
80
Miami FL
If you stop using the filter fiber stuff from Jacks, you should be able to SLAM and get the algae cleared up fast. Their scale chemicals should only affect the CC and total chlorine reading. If you use the DPD-FAS titration test, you can at least get the FC reading correct. You should also bring your alkalinity back up a bit higher to get the pH to at least 7.2. At your current levels, the water is very aggressive towards plaster and you’ll only etching the surface the longer it’s allowed to stay as low as it is.
Well, no cartridge in stock around my area. Ended up ordering online.

Any concern with running the pump thru the filter without a cartridge until Thursday (will it damage my equipment or piping)? I want to have the water moving to start mixing all the baking soda, acid and cl I'm going to pour.