FC and CC?

Patsy B

Active member
Jul 12, 2020
27
Orlando/FL
Hello all,
I have been doing what a couple of folks had suggested on here is adding liquid chlorine regularly. We did have some rain over the past few days and when I checked yesterday FC was super low. So I added chlorine last night and today it is 10.5ppm. I do have 0 CC so the TC is 10.5.
I also checked the daily PH it is around 7.3 or 7.4

Is this safe to swim in? I need to get in and scrub a bit of algae off and can't reach it without getting in.
 

Patsy B

Active member
Jul 12, 2020
27
Orlando/FL
Why can't you drain your pool right now? FYI, @mknauss can help you with this: you can exchange water to solve for excess CYA without dropping the water level at all...
I rent the house and maintain the pool (landlord would do it but I want to). I did tell him that these forum members told me to drain the pool due to high CYA. When he asked me what the CYA is because he has the pool store test for that he said his is that as well and everyone says that is normal. @mknauss has already given me good advise. I did read something about exchange water in Pool School. We just emptied a few inches of water the other day as we had several days of afternoon gulley wash rain. Just turn off pump, push lever, turn on pump and it goes out into the street, when done, turn off pump, turn off lever. Pretty easy. I need to review the Pool School again on how to exchange water. See what's involved. In the meantime, I will wait for the chlorine to drop to comfortable swimming level.

Off to school thanks
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
6,903
Central California
If you can convince your landlord to let you turn your pool into a TFP (Trouble Free Pool), you would be doing him (and yourself) a massive favor and you will both LOVE the pool when it's done. Draining the way you're describing will work, but it'll take a long time and a lot of water. The "no drain exchange" method uses a little more water than a true drain would but it is more involved than what you are describing. It's about taking water out from one level (top or bottom) and putting it back in at the opposite level. The method describes which way to do it (top or bottom). Personally, if I can help it, will never drain my pool. I'll use the exchange method because I believe it to be safer than removing water (the water is technically part of the structure of a pool). But if your landlord is game, and understands the relatively minor risk of removing water, then that is the fastest/easiest way to getting it done.

For some ammo, this high CYA state you're in is a real problem, and will continue to get worse and cause you more and more trouble and expense unless it is corrected (including no longer using tabs). It can't be ignored. It won't go away on its own. Your landlord needs to understand that and let you fix it. It's not like "Oh, that carpet looks OK for a while." or "Hah, I'll paint in a year or two." No, it's more like the toilet is leaking all over the floor and has to be fixed right now.
 
Last edited:

Patsy B

Active member
Jul 12, 2020
27
Orlando/FL
If you can convince your landlord to let you turn your pool into a TFP (Trouble Free Pool), you would be doing him (and yourself) a massive favor and you will both LOVE the pool when it's done. Draining the way you're describing will work, but it'll take a long time and a lot of water. The "no drain exchange" method uses a little more water than a true drain would but it is more involved than what you are describing. It's about taking water out from one level (top or bottom) and putting it back in at the opposite level. The method describes which way to do it (top or bottom). Personally, if I can help it, will never drain my pool. I'll use the exchange method because I believe it to be safer than removing water (the water is technically part of the structure of a pool). But if your landlord is game, and understands the relatively minor risk of removing water, then that is the fastest/easiest way to getting it done.

For some ammo, this high CYA state you're in is a real problem, and will continue to get worse and cause you more and more trouble and expense unless it is corrected (including no longer using tabs). It can't be ignored. It won't go away on its own. Your landlord needs to understand that let you fix it. It's not like "Oh, that carpet looks OK for a while." or "Hah, I'll paint in a year or two." No, it's more like the toilet is leaking all over the floor and has to be fixed right now.
I did a search on the drain exchange and someone in another post had asked about it and a link was provided, but it wasn't very detailed. I just didn't understand. Do you have a link that you can provide, maybe it was not the detailed version. FYI: I stopped using tabs, as well as powdered shock and only use liquid chlorine for close to two weeks now maybe less.
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
6,903
Central California
I stopped using tabs, as well as powdered shock and only use liquid chlorine for close to two weeks now maybe less.
Excellent. Just want to make sure you and the landlord understand: you can't go back to tabs once you get your CYA back down. You can use tabs for temp use, once in a while (like if you're away for a few days) but they can't be used in a long term way if you want to avoid where you're at now. They are not sustainable and it is unfortunate that they are still being pushed on unsuspecting pool owners by profit-driven pool stores and pool guys that can only come by once a week.
 
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Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
6,903
Central California
Once we get the landlord on board about the exchange, and you get the pool TFP beautiful, then we'll start in on him about putting in an SWG. They have a substantial upfront cost, and have to be replaced eventually, but it's been proven that the total cost is less than the total cost of the liquid chlorine purchases they replace (and way less than tabs and the subsequent water replacement from using them). But we'll fight that battle after we take this first hill!! ;)
 
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Patsy B

Active member
Jul 12, 2020
27
Orlando/FL
Question,
My FC today is 8.5 and TC = 9.0
I also did the daily test - PH is good. Since the CYA is over 100 - is there any point in testing the daily chlorine. Since I have been putting in liquid chlorine - the CL BR with the daily test has been high. Today with the FC of 8.5 the CL BR is 5 10. Is there any point in doing daily since I need to keep a fairly high level of chlorne. Also no one really answered my initial question which is with a high CYA of over 100 and chlorine 8.5 (yesterday it was 10.5) - is it safe to swim?
 

Patsy B

Active member
Jul 12, 2020
27
Orlando/FL
Question,
My FC today is 8.5 and TC = 9.0
I also did the daily test - PH is good. Since the CYA is over 100 - is there any point in testing the daily chlorine. Since I have been putting in liquid chlorine - the CL BR with the daily test has been high. Today with the FC of 8.5 the CL BR is 5 10. Is there any point in doing daily since I need to keep a fairly high level of chlorne. Also no one really answered my initial question which is with a high CYA of over 100 and chlorine 8.5 (yesterday it was 10.5) - is it safe to swim?
After doing a search on 'safe to swim' I read some responses to others questions on this topic. Seems anything at the min and up to slam is safe to swim based on the CYA chart. Since my CYA is over 100 (last check around 120 to 130) what would the suggested highest level be for swimming?
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
6,903
Central California
Best I leave the chemistry stuff to others. You don't have to take the basket out of the skimmer, and the pump has to be off. Just place the hose end in there, just under the water line, and trap the hose in place some how. If the skimmer lid is not heavy enough, use a brick or rock, or bucket of water, whatever. The idea of using the skimmer, I think, is that it will introduce the water to just the top layer of the pool while disturbing the rest of the pool as little as possible. You're not pumping water down the skimmer pipe, the water should gently flow out into the pool, out though the skimmer's weir door, and, hopefully, stay near the top while you suck out the bad juju from the bottom at the same time. If you just placed the hose in the main pool, it could push the new water down below the surface and mess up how this is supposed to work.
 
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HermanTX

Gold Supporter
May 20, 2020
690
Katy TX
I think the concern I would have with swimming is that at such high CYA level, the chart becomes questionable. If you just interpolate the chart further, just using basic math, you would need minimum FC of 12 or higher at 130 CYA. There is no science if that is truly the minimum to kill bacteria. So it is back to an earlier question, can you exchange 20-30% of water just to get it down to CYA of 100? At least there is data at that level to provide you confidence on proper FC levels. I don't think anyone will give you a firm yes or no on swimming if there is no science to back up the recommendation. Sorry to be vague but the primary recommendation is to exchange water to lower CYA to level that enables one to use the CYA/FC chart.
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
6,903
Central California
I'm seein' the flip side. You've rented a house that includes a pool. Unless your Agreement says otherwise, the landlord has to maintain the property as originally presented (I'm a landlord, BTW). You can no longer safely swim in the pool (that's a fact, proven by the CYA test "evidence" that shows it's no longer possible to keep the pool properly sanitized with chlorine). And in CA, at least, there is no wording in an Agreement that can negate the Landlord's responsibility to immediately address unsafe conditions. That's your leverage with the landlord to have the pool made safe, right away. If he knows you're still swimming in the pool, then, in his eyes, you don't really have a legit reason to demand he fix the pool. So whether it's actually safe or not (which is debatable), you're better off staying out of the pool. Now, I'm not suggesting to go at this guy guns blazing, you know best what he will respond to, but you do have ammo if you need it. Why not start the exchange today? Let's get this done and you back in the pool!
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
6,903
Central California
Show him this chart:


And that his pool is literally "off the chart." Point him to the asterisks that show that CYA 60 is the highest recommenced amount. Personally, I wouldn't settle for getting the pool back down to 100, just so you can get back on the chart. Do it once, do it right, I always say. Exchange water so that the CYA is 60, at most, which is a good number if you think there's any chance he'll go for the SWG, because an SWG needs about CYA 70 (so you'd have to add a little back in).
 
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Patsy B

Active member
Jul 12, 2020
27
Orlando/FL
Thank you all for your responses. The landlord lives next to me and they are our acquaintances or kind of friends. We have socialized previous to Covid. I told him about the CYA etc. and I also showed him my kit. I am going to let him check his chemicals as he has the same size pool etc. It will be interesting to see if his CYA is above 60 as well. I will show him the chart and also other discussions on CYA. In the meantime I'm going to keep the FC at around 12 to 16.
 
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