CYA 50 Standard Go Bad?

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
Almost exactly a year ago, I purchased the CYA Standard from TFTestkits. When I received it, I used it to ensure that I knew what it looked like to get a CYA of 50. It worked great and I was confident in my testing.

Today, I was questioning if my pool CYA was 40 or 50, so I brought out the CYA standard. However this time when I used it, the solution never went cloudy and basically registered NO CYA. I attempted this a second time since I had a lot left from my CYA standard with the same results.

My question is whether there is an expiration on the CYA 50 Standard? There is nothing written on the bottle, but it is very apparent that mine went bad (i.e., now registers no CYA). Anyone have this same problem?
 

Jimrahbe

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 7, 2014
19,494
Bedford, TX
HD,

Just to make sure.. you used the standard as if it were your pool water.. you filled the bottle to the lower line and added your test kit reagent to the top line.. and then followed the normal CYA tests...???

I'll see if I can get one of our chemical experts to chime in...

Thanks,

Jim R.
 

OTPirate

Admin
In The Industry
Oct 2, 2013
1,569
Creedmoor, NC
Hey Holydoc! Taylor Technologies, whom we get all of our chemistry from has a blanket recommendation to replace reagents annually. I will replace any reagent if ordered within the year, no questions asked, just email me at [email protected]. Here is Taylor's statement:

ll reagents have a shelf life, whether they are liquids, powders, crystals, tablets, or test-strip pads. If kept dry, powders and crystals are very stable; acids are also long lived. Date of manufacture is not the controlling factor when it comes to shelf life—storage conditions are more important. As with all perishables, reagents are sensitive to environmental influences and will last longer under controlled conditions.

To this end, we recommend:
Storing reagents at a consistent temperature in the range of 36°–85°F (2°–29°C); extreme temperature fluctuation, say from a refrigerator to a hot car trunk, causes reagents to deteriorate.
Keeping them out of prolonged direct sunlight. (Note: their brown plastic bottles help protect very light-sensitive reagents.)
Segregating reagents from containers of treatment chemicals.
Replacing caps immediately and tightening them carefully so that exposure to air and humidity is limited.
Avoiding switching bottle caps, placing bottle caps on soiled surfaces, repouring reagents into contaminated containers, or touching test strip pads.
Taylor formulates its reagents to remain effective for at least one year, with only very few exceptions (molybdenum indicator in liquid form is one; after four months old it should be tested against a standard periodically). As a general precaution, replace all reagents more than one year old, or at the beginning of a new testing season.
 

AUSpool

Bronze Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
TFP Guide
Sep 23, 2015
754
Brisbane, Australia.
Is it possible for a CYA standard solution to loose its CYA or integrity over time? I think so, yes. Does the solution have a preservative or anti microbial agent? Are there similarities between an exposed CYA sample with no FC and little oxygen left for a year and CYA disappearance from a covered pool left over winter with no FC and little oxygen?

I would toss it and get a fresh standard.
 

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
HD,

Just to make sure.. you used the standard as if it were your pool water.. you filled the bottle to the lower line and added your test kit reagent to the top line.. and then followed the normal CYA tests...???

I'll see if I can get one of our chemical experts to chime in...

Thanks,

Jim R.
Jim,

That is correct. I have been doing this for over a year now. I have become pretty proficient at it. ;)
 

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
Hey Holydoc! Taylor Technologies, whom we get all of our chemistry from has a blanket recommendation to replace reagents annually. I will replace any reagent if ordered within the year, no questions asked, just email me at [email protected]. Here is Taylor's statement:

ll reagents have a shelf life, whether they are liquids, powders, crystals, tablets, or test-strip pads. If kept dry, powders and crystals are very stable; acids are also long lived. Date of manufacture is not the controlling factor when it comes to shelf life—storage conditions are more important. As with all perishables, reagents are sensitive to environmental influences and will last longer under controlled conditions.

To this end, we recommend:
Storing reagents at a consistent temperature in the range of 36°–85°F (2°–29°C); extreme temperature fluctuation, say from a refrigerator to a hot car trunk, causes reagents to deteriorate.
Keeping them out of prolonged direct sunlight. (Note: their brown plastic bottles help protect very light-sensitive reagents.)
Segregating reagents from containers of treatment chemicals.
Replacing caps immediately and tightening them carefully so that exposure to air and humidity is limited.
Avoiding switching bottle caps, placing bottle caps on soiled surfaces, repouring reagents into contaminated containers, or touching test strip pads.
Taylor formulates its reagents to remain effective for at least one year, with only very few exceptions (molybdenum indicator in liquid form is one; after four months old it should be tested against a standard periodically). As a general precaution, replace all reagents more than one year old, or at the beginning of a new testing season.
OT,

My word, I am not asking for any replacements. No it has not been a year yet, but it is pretty darn close. :)

No..no... I just wanted to know if this is a common problem and something I should expect. Since there was no expiration date on the reagent, I never expected it would go from 50 CYA to zero. I was just surprised.

As for sending out a new one. Not necessary at all. I definitely know and have experienced the absolute marvelous customer service from TFTestkits. I probably should not have even mentioned the name of who I got it from, since I was wondering about the longevity of the chemical and not the reputation of a company.

- - - Updated - - -

Is it possible for a CYA standard solution to loose its CYA or integrity over time? I think so, yes. Does the solution have a preservative or anti microbial agent? Are there similarities between an exposed CYA sample with no FC and little oxygen left for a year and CYA disappearance from a covered pool left over winter with no FC and little oxygen?

I would toss it and get a fresh standard.
Probably do need to order a new one. I see they have the 2 ounce one now instead of the 8 ounce. That will keep me from keeping it too long! LOL
 

OTPirate

Admin
In The Industry
Oct 2, 2013
1,569
Creedmoor, NC
Holydoc, I just looked your order up, and it has been just shy of one year, so I'd like to send you a replacement. That's our policy. I really don't mind, as I think the standard is beneficial, and I want to stand behind my policy. Let me know if there are any issues when you receive it. Thank you for your business!
 

griffths

LifeTime Supporter
May 2, 2011
171
Long Grove, IL
Just to add my .02 here. I was cleaning up the pool supply cabinet and came across some total alkalinity and calcium hardness standard solution I purchased in 2013 and thought I would see if it was still good and to my surprise it was still on the money. CH solution turned blue at 200 PPM as it should.

All of this is stored in my basement at a fairly constant 65-70 degrees and no direct sunlight. My experience shouldn't be taken as an endorsement to hold on to/use testing reagents / standards solution this long, but rather just a data point on what is possible with proper storage conditions.

I would never trust my daily/weekly testing results using testing supplies that old, however in this case I knew what the answer was supposed to be before I started so I was confident with the results of the test.

Regards,
 

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
Holydoc, I just looked your order up, and it has been just shy of one year, so I'd like to send you a replacement. That's our policy. I really don't mind, as I think the standard is beneficial, and I want to stand behind my policy. Let me know if there are any issues when you receive it. Thank you for your business!
Rebecca, I really was just wondering if the Standard completely loosing its CYA after a certain time was normal. From the direct messages I received, I am starting to believe it is.

Secondly, I have never had a company so focused on customer satisfaction as TFTestkits. I really was not seeking a replacement. But I will shut up before you hit me in the head with your Policy Stick and just humbly say Thank You.

- - - Updated - - -

Just to add my .02 here. I was cleaning up the pool supply cabinet and came across some total alkalinity and calcium hardness standard solution I purchased in 2013 and thought I would see if it was still good and to my surprise it was still on the money. CH solution turned blue at 200 PPM as it should.

All of this is stored in my basement at a fairly constant 65-70 degrees and no direct sunlight. My experience shouldn't be taken as an endorsement to hold on to/use testing reagents / standards solution this long, but rather just a data point on what is possible with proper storage conditions.

I would never trust my daily/weekly testing results using testing supplies that old, however in this case I knew what the answer was supposed to be before I started so I was confident with the results of the test.

Regards,
Jay,

Yes, I noticed on TFTestkits website that they now offer Standards for CYA, pH, CH, and TA both individually and as a set.

TFTestkits.net

What a great set to get if you are just starting out for less than $20.

Luckily I had no trouble with the ones that change color. However that dang disappearing DOT.... Grrr.
 

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
OK, I received my CYA Standard yesterday from TFTestkits. Thank you so much!

Earlier last month, I had tested my CYA and came up with a CYA of 40, so I placed in a floater duck with some pucks to raise the CYA to 50. Once my CYA reached the 50 mark, I removed the pucks and started back on regular Chlorine. However as soon as I did that, I noticed the pool started loosing its luster.

Thanks to Rebecca at TFTestkits for insisting (i.e., hitting me with a Policy Stick) on sending me a new CYA Standard. By using the CYA Standard, I quickly discovered that I had been misreading the test and that my pool CYA = 70 and not 50. I immediately slammed last night, vacuumed up the dead algae this afternoon, and now my pool's luster is returning. I am continuing the SLAM until I reach the criteria and no residual dead algae forms.

I just wanted to thank TFTestkits and recommend to everyone to purchase a CYA Standard so that you can have something to compare against. The CYA test is without question the hardest and most subjective of all the pool tests. This is one that you want to get as close as possible. After over a year of doing that test, I thought I had it down pat. I was wrong.

For me it was not a disappearing dot. It was a barely visible dot. Made the difference between a sparkling TFP pool and a dull one.