Closing difficulties with cartridge filter and pool level above equipment

Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
Thanks, that makes sense because that side of the pool had to be built up with fill dirt after the plumbing was done. It wasn’t a lot of water just enough to make me worry. I am really trying not to lower the water below the returns because then the tanning ledge is completely exposed due to the deep end returns being lower than the shallow. This also makes it more difficult to pour in antifreeze. I was thinking of making a few snorkel like devices with threaded ends and just pouring in there and leaving them for the winter. Does anyone do this?
 

Newdude

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2019
1,167
NY
I got about 6 ft of clear 1 inch tubing at the hardware store. I duct tape a funnel to one end and snake the other a few feet into all my pipes to pour the antifreeze. Your snorkle idea is cool and would work. Would work even better if you capped them after the antifreeze went in, that way the water could rise all winter and not overflow the snorkel.
 

Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
Thanks, my returns are still underwater otherwise I would do the same. I was thinking a piece of pvc as a snorkel and leaving it there until the spring.
 

wireform

Silver Supporter
In The Industry
Aug 15, 2017
486
Spring Valley, NY
You can utilize the 11/2" threads. Screw a fitting in with those threads and shortly after transition to a union and after the union come up and out above the water which will the capped with a removable pvc configuration like a threaded cap or plug. All will need to be water tight and you should be able to leave it till opening day. The purpose of the pvc union is you will have to 90° it up from there this way as you snug up the union you can orient the pipe upward.
 
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Pool_Medic

In The Industry
Apr 1, 2018
1,175
Bangor Maine
Wrong, vertical pipes will come clear of all but a little vapour left. Turning the cyclone off intermittently will allow water to run to a low section which can be blow out once turned back on. What plugs are you using?
 
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Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
I am using the rubber stopper plugs.

Any concerns on the PVC snorkels cracking? We do get single digits a few nights a year and 20s fairly regularly over a couple of weeks.
 

Newdude

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2019
1,167
NY
Wrong, vertical pipes will come clear of all but a little vapour left. Turning the cyclone off intermittently will allow water to run to a low section which can be blow out once turned back on. What plugs are you using?

This will help get a little more out but there will always be some left. Especially for the captain blowing uphill 5 feet above the equptment. At some point, most of it will be out but a gallon or two will burp at the low spot, which will be below the frost line for most people.
 
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Newdude

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2019
1,167
NY
Add in a few 90 degree elbows and a T between the return outlets (for most pools anyway) and you will never blow it all out. The water drops alone throughout the length of the pipe will ultimately rejoin as a gallon or more.
 
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Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
Add in a few 90 degree elbows and a T between the return outlets (for most pools anyway) and you will never blow it all out. The water drops alone throughout the length of the pipe will ultimately rejoin as a gallon or more.
The four return jets I am having trouble with are all in the same 2 inch line from the pump so that probably makes sense.

Here is a shot of the plumbing during construction. The top pipe is connected to the air blower and the bottom is the water supply.
 

Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
The more I think about this the more I wonder if I pushed water into the air blower line back towards the equipment. I did turn the air blower on but not until after I was running the Cyclone for a good 5-10 minutes. I wonder if running the air blower first for a few minutes and then the Cyclone after would help.
There is no valve for the air blower so I can’t turn it off to isolate just the water supply side.
 

Newdude

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2019
1,167
NY
Take the vertical pipe at the center of your pic as an example.... it has a 90 in the dirt, another 90 and a horizontal piece, another 90 and another vertical AND then a T and more legs with caps 1 ft past the returns. Just those end caps will hold a few gallons combined. You’ll never get it all. If you kill pressure and wait a minute some of it will recollect and then you can push more of the recollection out once or twice but at some point, The air just rushes by all the small pools. It’s usually fine as it is but the antifreeze is always a good failsafe. I don’t know enough about your configuration or spa blowers to have any advice on those but maybe an expert will.
 
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Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
Good news using the tips provided in this thread. I was able to fab up some “snorkels” that cost way too much and took way too long to assemble the parts list at Lowe’s but I am confident that I was able to remove all but a non-harmful amount of water. With the help of my 4 year old son and turning the air blower and Cyclone on and off repeatedly, I was able to blow out nearly all of the water. I am leaving the “snorkels” capped for a few days to make sure the Teflon-taped PVC threads are water tight and then I will pour in some antifreeze and call it good.

I had a hard time with the “snorkel” parts because I wanted to be able to reuse them so this meant I needed a few threaded parts so that I could tighten the elbow into the pool wall. I had planned to have the top of the “snorkels” above the coping but due to variances in the stone size and pool wall, I did have to cut a couple of them down to below the coping so I could screw in the vertical pipe. I am satisfied so far and this will go soooooo much quicker next year.

I will say this—I don’t know how I would’ve done this without the Cyclone and hose fitting in the top of my pool pump cover. I tried avoiding both of those and cost myself many, many hours of frustration. Lesson learned.

Here’s a shot of a couple of “snorkels” in action while I was still clearing water. I’ll get some better pics of the whole assembly soon.
 

Newdude

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2019
1,167
NY
Nice job Captain. The first year is the hardest figuring out what works on your setup. You may re-engineer something in a few years, but it will be for fun, not necessity.
 

Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
I am using a PVC cap with a slip fitting. There should be no pressure so no reason to glue it, not to mention I want to reuse it to pour antifreeze in each year. Even with 3 capped and the Cyclone running, the cap doesn't pop off anyway.

I will post a pic of all the parts soon.
 

Captchaos

Bronze Supporter
Jul 18, 2017
279
Maryland
Please be careful of those snorkels, ice can and will move or break them off.
Interesting. Have you seen this happen? I did use schedule 40 PVC thinking it would be fine as long as there wasn’t water inside of the pipes. I figured there would be enough room for the pool water to expand if it did freeze.
 

Pool_Medic

In The Industry
Apr 1, 2018
1,175
Bangor Maine
No, I haven’t seen it happen because I’ve never in my years seen a pool in freezing areas with a pool closed this way. It’s not the expansion that’s the concern, it’s the ice shifting with the winds before or after that huge ice cube has frozen itself to the walls.
 

Newdude

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2019
1,167
NY
Nice catch PM. the ice block melts from the sides first and then free floats until it fully melts. Even if it only shifted an inch that is a lot of force on the snorkels and returns.