Concrete pool up north

[Henry Porter]

hi there!!
I have already made a few post in this beautyful site, that I've stumbled upon from a swedish poolforum a few days ago. I must say that I'm totally blown away by the projects you post in here. It's already yield us inspiration to add what you call a tanning ledge in one part of our pool. That is someting we never would have thought of if it wasn't for your postings, so thank you all

One think I have noticed since I have spent some time in here is that the way you build your pools in warmer climates are quite different compared to the way we have to construct our. So that gave me the idea that I could start a log in here aswell even if the project itself is nothing fancy at all. But it might be interesting for some to see the difference in wich way we build and reinforce our pools.

Our family have decided to build a concrete pool which is not the most usual way to build a pool here. Since it's not very common with concrete as a material in pools it's very expensive to have them build. So that is the reason I have to do all the work myself. I don't mind it really, I have always liked to do thing with my hands and it's a good opportunity to learn new things.
I'm a father of two daughters so we are all very excited to get this dream become true to next summer. i'm pretty sure that it will be ready by then. You probably already figured that English is not my mothers tounge, so you have to bare with me 8) 8)

Here comes some pics from the first couple of weeks in the end of August. I was only allowed post three at the time so I come back tomorrow for some more.

BTW thanks Cobra46 for your input in Eggmans thread. I've read part of your log yesterday and what a pool you building.... very, very nice!!

Regards
[attachment=2:1jbxl1gk]grävning1.jpg[/attachment:1jbxl1gk]
[attachment=1:1jbxl1gk]Färdig gropIMG_2654.jpg[/attachment:1jbxl1gk]
[attachment=0:1jbxl1gk]makadam 8-161.jpg[/attachment:1jbxl1gk]

 

[frankthailand]

Hello Henry
Looking good so far, looks like it is going to be a very tidy worksite, i am sure everybody here will be interested how things are done over there. Keep those picts coming
Cheers and happy future swims
Frankie

 

[Henry Porter]

Thanks Frank!
I wish I were where you are at the moment, the constant raining start getting on my nerves right now. Have tons of job to do, but not much is getting done due to the rain and the lack of daylight. I can't complain to much though, we had very good weather when we started and it just the last couple of weeks this has started. But you know how it is when you have something going.. you really want to get started and get things done.

Last picture shows 150mm macadam wich lays on a ground fabric that shall prevent the macadam get mixed with the soil.
upon that macadam have I put 100mm isolation and on that the rebars. I have used both pre-weld carpets made of 6mm bars and 10mm singel bars. The reinforcements is put in two layers( stretch side and preassure side of the cast). The vertical bars that goes up in the walls are connected in both the preassure and stretch side of the cast, so the pool are protected agains strech in the walls both when the pool is full and empty.

[attachment=2:mlfxzcpy]Kantbalk1.jpg[/attachment:mlfxzcpy]
[attachment=1:mlfxzcpy]Huvudarmering2.jpg[/attachment:mlfxzcpy]
[attachment=0:mlfxzcpy]Färdigarmerat1.jpg[/attachment:mlfxzcpy]

 

[duraleigh]

Henry,

Yours is a fascinating pool build. The quality of the work is amazing and the construction techniques are even more amazing. Thank you for sharing with us. :-D

 

[Henry Porter]

Ohh..thanks alot for your kind words duraleigh I really appreciate it!!

Came in from a short session in the pit a minute ago, even if I don't get much done during the weekdays it's still brings me a good feeling that I have achived something at least. little by littel and we soon will be there.... That is our motto right now.
If the weather treats me well I think I could get the frame ready within two or three rain free weekends from now. So the new time frame will be to have the concrete in before christmas.

The concrete I used for the bottom is with a WCT of 0,49 with an air pore additive( free translation from swedish )
Anyway the concrete is suppose to be watertight itself beacuse of it's low water cement number(0,49). It is so tight that water only can suck in the first couple of millimiters of the cast. We layed 200 thick cast that we vibrated down. All rebars are placed with atleast an 40mm thick layer of concrete for protection against corrosion.
Right after we poured the conrete I applied an watersealing strip where the walls are going to be placed, to seale the joint that will be inbetween the bottom and the walls. I use a product that is pretty new here but have been used for a long time in other parts of Europe(I think it's common in the US aswell) called syncoflex. That do the job that traditional bentonite clay stripes does with the exception that it don't have to be protected from water meanwhile I build.
[attachment=2:3irhic3p]betong i formen t1.jpg[/attachment:3irhic3p]
[attachment=1:3irhic3p]armering innersidaIMG_2876.jpg[/attachment:3irhic3p]
[attachment=0:3irhic3p]armering innersidaIMG_2877.jpg[/attachment:3irhic3p]

 

[Casey]

How very intresting! I can't wait to see the finished product! I'm betting you can't either! Keep the pics coming! 8)

You are doing a super job!

 

[no-mas]

Henry,
The quality of your build is seemingly outstanding I look forward to seeing the progress.
Slow and steady wins the race.

 

[duraleigh]

Henry,

That is much more rebar than we would use here in the US. I'm curious what prompted you to do that much. I have several other questions but I'll do them one or two at a time.

Again, the work is meticulous......very, very nice.

 

[Guest]

Incredible build! You said that concrete is not the usual pool construction material. I am curious what is. Over here concrete/plaster, vinyl, and fiberglass are the usual pool construction methods.

 

[Henry Porter]

Hi poolfriends 8)

Not much happens at the moment when it comes to pool building. This is beacuse endless raining. I hope for some weather improvements tomorrow since saturday and sunday are the only days of the week that I can get something done. I hope you're right jmas65 that it's the slow and steady course that will win the race for us :-D Beacuse as it looks right now it gonna be very slow and hopefully somewhat steady.

Waterbear! From my understanding liner pools is the most common way to build pools i sweden by far. They are normally bought in a kit which contains everything you need to get going. One of the bigger manufactors have their poolframe made of boards, that material is flexible enough to stand against movements in the ground. but other manufactors use other materials like stainless steel. Some also made their pool frame with bricks.
Glassfibre pools has also grown in number the last couple of years as it seems. If I would estimate how many of the total amounts of pools that are made with concrete I don't think it could be more than 5%.

Duraleigh! Yes I think I'm at the higher level of the range when it comes to the concentration of my reinforcements. But since I don''t have the knowledge to do a proper calculation on my own(wich is quite complicated). I decided to build the pool so there would be no doubt that it is to little rebars.
To build a concrete form that is suppose to be water tight itself is not an easy thing to do. And bare in mind that my pool must stand against freezing and thawing that I don't think the average pool in the US is constructed for.

I must admit that I'm little surprised that you finds my insignificant little project interesting despite all the overwhelming projects that are posted in here. I hesitated more that once if I should put up a log of my own in here. But I'm very glad I did.
I learn so much by reading your logs, yesterday I've found out about smokers. I saw the picture that shows Kurstys outdoor kitchen, and there it was! The big green egg on one of his benches. I never seen one before and since the plan is to build a small outdoor kitchen of our own, this item will be very high up on the list of wanted tings. I have never seen anything like that here in sweden. And the whole family are rellay in to grill our food in the summmer so the egg would suit us perfectly.

This two pictures is taken today. From now on I will post an update with pictures every sunday. Hopefully there would be somethingnew to show then. I hope I can get up a few more tomorrow if the weather treats us right.

Have a nice weekend everybody!!
[attachment=1:2vybbd1d]Form 1 IMG_2926.gif[/attachment:2vybbd1d]
[attachment=0:2vybbd1d]Form 1 IMG_2927.gif[/attachment:2vybbd1d]

 

[Henry Porter]

I have prepared the reinforcements for the lamps and skimmers that I'm plan to mount this weekend. I welded extra bars where I'm gonna put them in. In that way everything stays stabil.
I have also prepared my lamps and skimmers and the returns with the syncoflex sealing, that are pressed on to the surface after a primer coat have been applied. This make the the joint to the concrete water tight.
[attachment=0:387nld5p]Seal IMG_2931.gif[/attachment:387nld5p]

 

[Henry Porter]

I have nothing new to show at the moment. I'm working on the pool every weekend and some evenings in the week though, but things running slowly at the moment. I have more or less welded all the horizontal bars on the outside, so I can start work on the outer wall side next weekend. When that is done it should be ready to put the concrete in, approx 1,5 months after schedule
It's my first poolbuild so I'm gonna let it take the time it takes. I have plenty of time!! The only thing that worries me a little is that I need to let the concrete rest for at least a few months before I apply the tiles and paint on it, but the best would be to let it rest for 6 months. If I gonna have time to do so I think I need to finsish the walls before christmas. Shoulden't be impossible to achieve.
I must admitt that I didn't really take under consideration that our days are so much shorter in this season, so I get much less is done on a weekend.

 

[waste]

Henry, as I haven't officially given my "welcome to TFP!!", please allow me to do it now

I too am intrigued with your build and think that what you've posted so far is great Though I've been out of the building 'crete pools for 14 years, I think that your rebar arrangement, while a LOT more than we used to use in Va. is going to serve your pool well, under the harsher conditions you'll likely encounter in Sweden.

Have you given any thought to running your plumbing plans by Mas985 or JasonLion? Those 2 could tell you the best way to plumb the pool for your system!

I thank you for posting your project here for us all to enjoy and also hope that the rain will let up so you can finish the project in a timely manner 8)

(As you may know, I've been a little busy trying to tell folks how to build their own liner pool- with any luck I'll finish my project before you finish yours )

Ted

 

[Henry Porter]

Thanks alot Ted I appreciate it :-D

No I haven't gone in to the plumbing yet when it comes to pump and filters. So I need all help I can get in that department. The only thing that's decided is that I have one bottom outflow that will work together with two skimmers(those are already bought and hopefully soon mounted) together with two inflows.
I'm gonna build a technique room ounderground so I get as little way as possible for the pump on the "suction side". Everything will be assembled in that room, pump, filter, saltwater-clorinator, electrical cabinet for both running the equipment and for the lightning. Everything except for the device I need to heat the water. I'm gonna use a heat exchanger that I will connect to my warming pan in my house. So I will pump the water from the underground room to my house(that is no more than 15m) to heat the water.
I have only checked very briefly what hoses I need when it comes to material and dimensions. I don't know if this term is the same in english, but I have been recommended a hose called PEM, 2" should be enough for my purpose have I been told.
I would love to get some help from here when the times come to do the plumbing.
And btw Ted all your four threads in DIY pools are very interesting to follow. I'm learning new things every day in here. I think it's time for me to be a lifetime supporter of this site 8)

 

[spishex]

Henry,

Great project! Thanks for keeping us filled in.

What size is the heater for your home that you will be hooking the pool into?

Tim

 

[Pisces]

Henry, I'm so glad you posted your pictures and pool build! It's really incredible that you've done this yourself! 99.9% of us building pools would never even try something like that...especially one that complicated. Looking forward to many more progress pictures. I know the days are shorter now..but you're going to have a beautiful pool...and the satisfaction of knowing you did the work yourself. Wish I knew enough about building to ask you a nice technical question...ha ha! Great job. I'm really amazed.

 

[Henry Porter]

Hi Tim! I'm sorry fo my absence.
I use a fuel wood pan to heat our house that has an effect of 30kw.
The pan is connected to a water tank of 2400 litre that I heat to 90 degree C. That last 24 hours for us in the winter(if it's really cold) to get the house nice and warm and for tapwater, when it's little milder I usually heat every other day. In the summer once a week is enough for tapwater, so there should be plenty of time to heat poolwater with the pan.

Pisces thanks for your inspiring words :-D
I can assure you that is not that complicated once you get down to it as it looks from a distance. What's have been the hardest part so far is to collect information about the right procedure to reinforce a pooltype like our.
I've spent many long hours infront of the computer without find adequate information. Finally I had to book an appointment at our local university where I meet up with a person who teach in construction. That helped me somewhat, but the biggest help have I got from a person who's post in a forum for DIY builders I've read. I was so impressed by his knowledge so I've pm him and asked if he could help me with my poolbuild. He turned out to be a very helpful and nice gentleman. Hi is a retired constructor who has worked with concrete constructions all his life. What he don't know about constructions is not worth knowing, so it was a lucky shoot that I made contact with him :-D

I have come a little but further down the road in my build. Haven't take any new pictures though. I will take new ones next sunday, hopefully there will be further progress by then.
Instead of building pictures you get two on what will help us to get a nice and warm pool next year
[attachment=1:27p9htvh]Heating systemIMG_2940.gif[/attachment:27p9htvh]
[attachment=0:27p9htvh]Heating systemIMG_2947.gif[/attachment:27p9htvh]

 

[spishex]

30kw = about 100k BTU's

Dedicated completely to the pool that is only enough to raise roughly 50,000 litres by .5 celsius in one hour (12,000 gallons 1 degree F in one hour for us). Your pool will soak that up very quickly in cool months! Any idea what the final volume of the pool will be?

Thanks for another fascinating update!

 

[Henry Porter]

Thanks for another fascinating update!

*smiling* hahaha Tim just hang in there and sooner than you know I will have the abllity to express myself so you guys actually knows what I'm saying 8)

Your calculation pretty much match my own thinking of how many hour I need to heat my pan to get a certain increase in temperature.
As I said do I have 2400litre water, it takes me approximately 4hours to increase that wolume 50 degrees(from 35-40 to 85-90).
50X2400=12K litres of water that I heat 1degree in 4 hours time. So I get 30K litres one degree in one hours time. Do you dig what I say 8)
I'm just kidding Tim, but it's exactly the same figure you came up with. So to the question is if it's enough for a pool with 55-60K water. Haven't done a proper calculation since I don't know what kind of stairs I'm gonna build. I had a drawing but since I saw the way you build your pools I changed the plan. But around that volume is it anyhow.

Tim! Let's say I put in one load of wood in the pan and that increase the temperature around 2-2,5degrees isn't that pretty good. My plan is to keep the pool warm from beginning of May to the end of August. The whole pool will be isolated and I will use poolcover every night when the temperature drops. I think(take notice that I say Think..) 25-26 degrees is plausible for a pool my size wtihout heating during summer months, where I live. So from my way of thinking I can pretty easy get 29 degrees which I'm more than happy to swim in.
It remains to see if theory match reality in the end, experience says that it's not always so.....

Regards Mats

 

[duraleigh]

Mats/Henry,

I would get an engineer to help with some BTU calculations to heat your pool.

I planned to heat my pool from a wood-fired furnace similar to yours. I quickly found out that it would require a wood furnace roughly four times larger than it takes to heat my house. I have a large pool (170,000 litres) but a large house as well. Without getting into calculating the differences in our situations, just keep in mind it takes tremendously more energy to heat water (and retain that heat) than it does the air in your house. I failed to understand that thoproughly and my pool heater was a failure.

BTW, even if my heater was large enough, I decided I didn't want to cut that much wood....it was a bunch.

I really like the looks of that wood heater.......much more sophisticated than what you see here in the US.