Pool Store BS-ing Me?

[ThinkPad]

I went to Leslie's today to check out their store and chlorine program, and I was talking with an employee there. She told me to try to avoid liquid chlorine, because it "adds salt to your pool which does nothing for it". Now, I already knew it adds salt (thanks to Pool Math), but doesn't salt make the water a little softer? It wouldn't really matter to me about her mentioning that, until she told me to use calcium hypochlorite. I asked her "doesn't it add calcium to the pool", and she said no. I always thought it added calcium to the pool and increased calcium hardness. Isn't that worse for the pool than the salt?

She also told me to try phosphate remover. Is this necessary if I don't have algae growing? Can someone explain to me what exactly phosphates do to the pool besides feeding algae and causing cloudy water. Is it worth using? She also said she would test my water for phosphates, and it looked like she was going to do it with a test kit. Are there any test kits that test for phosphates?

I just looked at Pool Math again and noticed that cal-hypo also adds more salt! Am I missing something, or is this total ****. She seemed to know a little more than me, and was very helpful and kind.

 

[northrn]

The amount of salt added from using liquid chlorine is insignificant. Calcium in a vinyl liner pool only matters if the levels are high. Calcium levels in plaster pools does matter and I'm sure someone with more knowledge about such things will be along shortly to go more in depth. Phosphate remover for an algae-less pool is also inconsequential. If you have no algae to feed, the amount of algae food doesn't matter.

I'm glad she was kind. However, kind doesn't equal educated.

:lookhere: Pool School

It has all the information you could ever want to know about pools, chemicals, chemical effects, etc. Happy reading!

 

[JohnT]

It's all baloney. If you need calcium, use cal hypo. If you need CYA, use trichlor or dichlor. If you don't need any of those, use liquid. The salt is good within reason.

Phosphate removers are simply a way for pool stores to make money off of people. They created a problem and sell the solution.

 

[ThinkPad]

I've already read most of the pool school articles, but thanks. I've heard that calcium buildups can clog cartridge filters, is this true?

I do have a question about the salt. Does the salt stay in the water a while into some of the water is removed? If so, what level should I want the salt around? I usually put about 34 of salt in my pool per week (a Pool Math number). Is this something to even care about?

Oh, before I forget again, she also mentioned something about increasing the TDS (total dissolved solids) with the liquid chlorine. Does the liquid chlorine affect the TDS enough to care about?

 

[JasonLion]

It is possible for calcium to clog a filter, but it is unusual. Normally you would have to have very severe calcium scaling on the pool before anything would happen to the filter.

Salt accumulates in the water, up to a point, from all forms of chlorine. Chlorine turns into salt after it gets used up. The rate of addition is very slow, and there is almost always enough splash out or other water replacement to prevent the salt level from getting even to SWG level, let alone something that would be a problem.

TDS should be totally ignored. It has no effect on the pool. Even if you did care about TDS, liquid chlorine wouldn't raise it enough to make any difference.

 

[Vyrolan]

She told me to try to avoid liquid chlorine, because it "adds salt to your pool which does nothing for it". Now, I already knew it adds salt (thanks to Pool Math), but doesn't salt make the water a little softer?

I just looked at Pool Math again and noticed that cal-hypo also adds more salt! Am I missing something, or is this total ****. She seemed to know a little more than me, and was very helpful and kind.

All chlorine adds salt...liquid, cal-hypo, lithium-hypo, trichlor, dichlor...whatever....they all add salt. It seems that's just something they try to tell people to get them to buy stuff like the pucks which they can make more money on (especially when the downsides get out of control and they can start selling you "fixes").

Does the salt stay in the water a while into some of the water is removed?

Yes...it will be there until the water is replaced.

If so, what level should I want the salt around?

If you don't use a SWG (device to create chlorine using the salt), then salt doesn't really matter (unless it got crazy stupid high)...some people do add salt for that "softer" feel...and they want around 2000ppm for that...

I usually put about 34 of salt in my pool per week (a Pool Math number). Is this something to even care about?

Adding 34 per week and assuming absolutely zero water replacement, you're 3 years or longer from reaching levels used by SWG pools, and those pools are only like 10% of the salt compared to ocean water. So essentially, no, it is nothing to worry about...

Oh, before I forget again, she also mentioned something about increasing the TDS (total dissolved solids) with the liquid chlorine. Does the liquid chlorine affect the TDS enough to care about?

No...TDS isn't something you should worry about unless it gets astronomical. Liquid chlorine is the purest (aside from very dangerous-to-use chlorine gas) form that you can use....it adds the minimal amount of "extra stuff"...the idea that she's trying to tell you it adds bad things compared to other stuff (cal-hypo LOL) is just completely backwards and wrong. You almost got pool stored, but luckily you knew to ask here.

 

[tim5055]

They created a problem and sell the solution.

 

[ThinkPad]

Alright everyone, thank you very much. I guess I should really start expecting this off pool stores. I feel that my local Ace (where I currently shop) is a little better at not selling you as much unnecessary items than full on pool stores.

Also, do Leslie's test pool water with test kits or a computer like Ace. I find Ace's computer test to be a little off.

 

[EVChargeGuy]

Kinda like someone selling Crack on the street corner knowing that once you use it you have to come back!

 

[JasonLion]

Different Leslie's stores use different test systems. A fair number use Taylor drop tests, but even so they tend to rush the test and get inconsistent results, which also varies depending on who is helping you.

 

[tim5055]

Alright everyone, thank you very much. I guess I should really start expecting this off pool stores. I feel that my local Ace (where I currently shop) is a little better at not selling you as much unnecessary items than full on pool stores.

Also, do Leslie's test pool water with test kits or a computer like Ace. I find Ace's computer test to be a little off.

The whole idea of this site is to teach YOU how to test and maintain YOUR pool. Once you acquire the knowledge where you shop no is longer part of the equation. You will be able to buy what you need wher it is least expensive, be it acid from Lowes or bleach from WalMart.

 

[ThinkPad]

Yes I understand. I wasn't planning on having them test my water regularly. I was just wanting to see how accurate theirs are compared to other methods.

 

[Isaac-1]

As a general rule of thumb pool store testing is worth less than what you pay for it, do your own testing, get to the point where you are confident in your results, and if you feel like it some time down the road take a sample to 2 or 3 pool stores and see for yourself how much they vary.

 

[ThinkPad]

My pool store testing is free, there is no way I would pay for that. My local Leslie's does testing using a test kit. I currently do my own testing, but only with test strips. Once I run out of those, I'm so getting a test kit.

 

[Smykowski]

There are a lot of posts where members get their water tested at the pool store "just to see how it compares." I really don't understand why. With the exception of sheer entertainment value, once you have a Taylor drop-based kit, there's no reason to ever let a pool store touch your water again.

 

[ThinkPad]

I'm mostly just curious which pool store is better at testing. And I'm wanting to see how far off they are from test strips (which aren't super accurate already).

 

[tim5055]

I'm mostly just curious which pool store is better at testing. And I'm wanting to see how far off they are from test strips (which aren't super accurate already).

I think it is going to vary not by the store, but by the actual person who does the test. I do my own testing, but to amuse myself at time I will take samples in to see how they match up. Going to the same two stores I have seen the results vary depending on who did the work. One store uses a computerized system and the other hand tests using Taylor chemicals.

Between high school kids working in the pool store for the summer and people doing the tests quickly you end up with poor results from their testing. A seasoned employee taking their time can provide excellent results. But, you can never be sure which you are getting

 

[ThinkPad]

Yes, that is true about the person doing the test. Fortunately there are no high schoolers that I saw at the pool stores. I wish us high schoolers were able to get more jobs; I've applied for 12+ jobs over the summer, and called the locations, with never being accepted. Most of the time it was because of child labor laws. At Leslie's there was only one person in the store assisting customers yesterday, so I wouldn't be surprised if she rushed.

 

[Vyrolan]

...pool store testing is worth less than what you pay for it...

My pool store testing is free...

These statements are not in conflict with each other...the latter merely provides emphasis for the former.

 

[Beens]

I think when she told you that bleach (sodium hypochlorite) adds salt and then turned right around and said that cal-hypo (calcium hypochlorite) doesn't add calcium...well that right there is a great tip off that she really just doesn't know.

A lot of people in retail have just enough knowledge to be dangerous.

Definitely best to have your own test kit and know for yourself rather than trusting someone else!