chlorine acid vanish, CYA vanished, bad pH reagent and non-ergonomic spoon

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engrav

engrav

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Jul 4, 2012
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Whidbey Island, WA
Hi
Am following TFP advice and pool is fine and pretty much matches PoolMath.
FC 5
CC 0
pH 7.6
TA 80
CH 250
CYA 30
But it soaks up chlorine and acid like a sponge. Am using 5.25% bleach from local hardware.
So set out to find stronger chlorine and found the HASA web site
<http://media.hasapool.com/productpages/P-1.pdf>
seems like an Ok company

where I see recommended
FC 1.5 to 3
CYA 60 to 80

the TFP chlorine/CYA chart shows at 60 CYA a min FC of 5

so am confused? how to explain the different recommendations?

Thank you
 
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Re: confused about HASA web site info

A large number of companies publish recommended levels that date back 60 years or more to the time before anyone knew what CYA did. These outdated recommendations just get copied from place to place, and no one ever bothers to update them to actually work with CYA.
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

thank you, I suspected same

so then
is there any way to reduce the powerful suck of chlorine and acid
to reduce it from 1.5 gal 5.25% bleach and 1 pt acid / day
or
is that just the cost of doing business in the summer, the cost of enjoying grand baby giggles
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

engrav said:
thank you, I suspected same

so then
is there any way to reduce the powerful suck of chlorine and acid
to reduce it from 1.5 gal 5.25% bleach and 1 pt acid / day
or
is that just the cost of doing business in the summer, the cost of enjoying grand baby giggles
Click to expand...
That's a BIG pool. 2.5 gallons of 5.25% is only 2.7 ppm/ day chlorine. That's not bad if the pool gets a lot of use
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

You shouldn't need to add acid daily (weekly), and chlorine is a daily chore, but looks like you have a SWCG, so that task should be done automatically. With a SWCG you should have a higher CYA level (70-80).
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

bobodaclown said:
You shouldn't need to add acid daily (weekly), and chlorine is a daily chore, but looks like you have a SWCG, so that task should be done automatically. With a SWCG you should have a higher CYA level (70-80).
Click to expand...

as above, Ok a BIG pool and it will suck up stuff, got it; so must figure out how to avoid ≥45 empty bleach bottles / month; will search for a 12.5% bleach method

but I do need to add acid all the time; diary shows I added acid 6/26 6/28 6/30 7/2 7/4 and 7/7 (I guess not quite daily)

SWCG? do not have that; if something wrong in my signature I should fix that
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

With only 30ppm CYA, you will be losing a lot to the sun. Try raising it to 40ppm and see how it behaves.
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

is there any way to reduce the powerful suck of chlorine and acid
Click to expand...
read "The ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry" up in Pool School.....all those answers are there. I will add that chlorine consumption is driven by two things ONLY. UV on the pool water and organic materials in the pool water. There is NOTHING else that consumes your chlorine and a principle that many of us "seasoned" pool nerds" often forget
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

duraleigh said:
read "The ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry" up in Pool School.....all those answers are there. I will add that chlorine consumption is driven by two things ONLY. UV on the pool water and organic materials in the pool water. There is NOTHING else that consumes your chlorine and a principle that many of us "seasoned" pool nerds" often forget
Click to expand...

Hi
Have read it many times and in accord, moved from swamp with two dead rats to a pristine beauty (IMO)

Have now moved from how to fix to how to reduce the acid/chlorine burden; cannot process 45 empty bleach bottles each month

I like Richard320's signature

Richard320 said is a BIG pool; ok then gotta just suck it up so to speak

JohnT said bump CYA to 40; could do that

several have said get higher % chlorine; could do that

jblizzle said test OCLT at higher FC; could do that

ABC says high TA cause up drift of pH but I do not have "high" TA
but then 257WbyMag said in another thread let TA drop to 70 or 60; could do that

there is a Rainbow turned off; could drop in a tab or two

so will try all these tweaks thank you but
after I jump in tomorrow to remind myself why I am doing this
 

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Re: confused about HASA web site info

My pool is 44k gallons. If you are on the bottle (bleach), you might consider going salt. Buying bleach and daily maintenance of a large pool takes a lot of effort. Standing by the pool and adding the bleach might not be that different than a small pool, but buying and hauling bleach bottles got old for me really quickly.
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

RobbieH said:
My pool is 44k gallons. If you are on the bottle (bleach), you might consider going salt. Buying bleach and daily maintenance of a large pool takes a lot of effort. Standing by the pool and adding the bleach might not be that different than a small pool, but buying and hauling bleach bottles got old for me really quickly.
Click to expand...

that may be the long term answer

but will try the little tweaks over the next weeks

thanks again
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

Hi
Just bought some 12.5% liquid chlorine. Should reduce the # of empty bottles.
Nice store, no retail fancy stuff, just a pool service. And the man seemed quite knowledgeable. He also suggested SWG.

pH of the stuff is 11.2
this might explain my acid burden

he said several of his commercial pools with liquid feeders also have acid feeders

several tfp threads comment on this as well

so maybe I do not have two problems, just one; jugs and jugs of liquid chlorine
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

The pH from adding liquid chlorine ends up being almost neutral. The pH is shifted back as the chlorine is consumed.

Anything that aerates the water, including splashing, drives up pH and necessitates adding acid. Bubblers, waterfalls, negative edge pool, etc.
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

so I set out to work on the tweaks to see if can fix too many empty bleach bottles and too many additions of acid

started by tracking FC today, very sunny day

here it is
5:00 FC11
8:45 FC 8
12:00 FC 6
1:44 FC 4
3:45 FC 3.5
5:50 FC 2.5

I also had not tested CYA for a couple of weeks so did same and found that
little black spot shows even if comparator full so not much CYA

I don’t have liquid CYA out here so
at this point I turned on the Rainbow with 5 tabs and setting 3 since the tabs have CYA

then
8:44 FC 2.5 (of course sun is gone now)

will see what happens tomorrow

as per another thread, my funky too intense pH color discussed in Oct last has returned so pH as the FC declined was doubtful; but it did not change as FC declined, funky at the start, funky at the end
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

with 5 tabs in the Rainbow and setting 3
FC stayed between 2.5 and 4 all day, even with hot sun
NO EMPTY BLEACH BOTTLES! PRAISE THE LORD!

and CYA should have gone up a little (still < 30 however)

will leave the Rainbow run all weekend and get some liquid CYA tomorrow in Bellevue
also new bottle of R0004

pH test remained funky all day so not reporting, did not change as FC went down, have ordered TF-100, then can compare to K-2005

by the way, IMO the little blue spoon is poorly designed
if you lay it flat side down, it is hard to pick up
since the handle is flat, it is hard to rotate to dump
since all other stuff is so slick, seems tftestkits.net oughta get a new spoon
could be called the troublefreespoon
 
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Re: confused about HASA web site info

You can modify your scoop to make it easier to handle. Either wrap the end in electrical tape so it gives it a little bulk and lifts it off the flat surface, or use a lighter to soften the end of the handle for about a second and bend it slightly up. Hold it in the desired position and blow on it to cool the plastic. It will hold the new shape. Just did this to mine as an example.
pimp scoop small (600x800).jpg
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

Hi
about the chlorine acid sink
pool is doing fine with Rainbow on 3 with 5 tabs
this AM FC 3.5 and no empty bleach bottles

pH still funky but 7.8 with 3 drops
CYA still <30

will get new R0004 and liquid CYA today

as for the spoon
will try your bend it up fix

person at TFtestkits replied no one else has complained so spoon unlikely to be changed
but now there are 3 and 3≠ 0
 
Re: confused about HASA web site info

Well, he doesn't make the spoons and if you do a google search you will see there is not a lot of diversity of design in the tiny scoop market. That leaves it up to the user to make the modifications they need to optimize function.
 

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