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SDH

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Aug 10, 2013
20
Rosedale, LA
Backstory (skip if you don't care):

I have inherited care of my in-laws' 40 year-old pool for my kids to use. I was in the midst of turning it from green to blue when a valve went bad (I think). I got the pool blue, but couldn't finish vacuuming before I had my issue, so there's still a lot of debris on the bottom. At the moment, I appear to have full suction from the main drain but none from the skimmer - at least I have circulation so my chems are staying in range.

I thought the line was clogged but I blew it out with a bladder and saw water topping out of the pump basket, so I'm now convinced that the old, brass ball valve is stripped...the main drain valve is on its last leg as well. I should also note that there are a good many tiny bubbles coming out of the return jets, so seems there may be an air leak suction-side somewhere (I'm hoping its the valves). I've tied plastic bags around the pump fittings to no avail. In any case, I'll probably just be re-plumbing the entire suction side of the pad (see below).

  • The filter is a Hayward S-310S sand filter
  • The old brass pump has Premeir stamped on the side, but the tags on the motor have been completely wiped away so I can't make out the HP.
  • There is an Intec Water Doctor I system installed (copper ionization - the clear PVC you see in the pic has the copper bars inside).
  • All 1.5" pipes and fittings (I had NOTHING to do with this setup)


My thoughts:

  • I've just purchased two Jandy NeverLube 2-ports to replace the brass valves on the skimmer and main lines. I opted for two of these instead of one 3-port so that I could close them off while emptying the pump basket, hoping to avoid losing prime while doing so. Thoughts?
  • I want to install unions wherever they would be of any benefit - new to this, so don't know what I don't know...ya know?
  • I'm thinking about installing a short length of clear PVC (http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=39378&catid=592) on either side of the pump to monitor flow because this old pump doesn't have a clear basket lid


My questions:

  • First of all, how would you re-plumb this (suction side)
  • Didn't I read somewhere that there should be some minimum pipe distance leading into the pump? What is it? Should I push the pump back to allow for it?

Thanks in advance! Enjoying the forums.

Scott
 

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:wave: Welcome to TFP!!!!

I would probably plumb the suction side just like it is now. Just be sure to use schedule 40 PVC and not the non-pressure rated drain fittings that look like are currently in use.

There is not much concern with a minimum pipe length in front of the modern pumps, unless you go with a reall big pump which is just a waste of money. If you are concerned, you could rotate the pump 90 degrees CW and move it toward the filter and add another 90 turn to the suction line.

Are you going to upgrade the pump? If so, now would be a good time while you are doing the plumbing. Some pumps use unions to connect already.

BTW, cut that copper thing out and recycle it. Just begging for staining and green hair.
 
jblizzle said:
Are you going to upgrade the pump? If so, now would be a good time while you are doing the plumbing. Some pumps use unions to connect already.
Click to expand...


Thanks, Jason! No, because it isn't my pool (and because I've already spent $350 on a Kreepy Krauly, $100 on Jandy valves, plus a couple hundred on chems and PVC) I'm not to anxious to spend several hundred dollars on a new pump just yet.

jblizzle said:
BTW, cut that copper thing out and recycle it. Just begging for staining and green hair.
Click to expand...

Actually, we've been using this pool for many, many years with the copper ionization with absolutely no green hair (a lot of us are blonds and auburns by the way) and I've not noticed any staining (not that it would matter much in this old pool). It does a great job as an algaecide and it's super cheap to dump a gallon or two of Clorox per week for oxidation of remaining organic matter. In fact, I'm so happy with it that I may give it some consideration for my own pool someday.
 
FYI, the copper does little to provide protection from bacteria and viruses ... that is what chlorine is required for. And if you have to have chlorine anyway, why add the copper? If you are not maintaining adequate FC in the pool as a function of your CYA level, then the pool may not be considered safe from a disease point of view. Not having algae is only one thing to consider.
 
jblizzle said:
FYI, the copper does little to provide protection from bacteria and viruses ... that is what chlorine is required for. And if you have to have chlorine anyway, why add the copper? If you are not maintaining adequate FC in the pool as a function of your CYA level, then the pool may not be considered safe from a disease point of view. Not having algae is only one thing to consider.
Click to expand...

Perhaps, but haven't had any issues before. The test kit sold for the copper system doesn't even include testers for chlorine, just recommendations of Clorox additive for residual contaminants outside algae. Have to keep in mind, too, that we grew up swimming in bayous down here! Lol

I'm several years away from planning my own pool, but I'll definitely dig into all the options before then.
 
I'll just add my two cents. Just because something hasn't happened before doesn't mean it won't happen eventually. I, as well as everyone else involved, got some infection from an improperly sanitized hot tub and some point of infection resulting in all of us getting quite painful bumps and trips to the doctor for antibiotics. I think the doctor said it was Folliculitis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-tub_folliculitis) but I don't think it was.

Regardless, pathogens aren't something you want to mess around with, even if the chances are remote. There can be far nastier things that you don't want infecting the people using your pool.

The people who make those additive systems generally do so on questionable or unsound science and do have an ulterior motive - selling you stuff. If you can do it on bleach alone (as we all do) why even pay for the extra stuff, and maybe not be as safe. I'm sure ChemGeek could stop in and tell you all about how those systems don't live up to their claims.

That being said, it's obviously your pool and decision. I have a co-worker who has a pool and who insists he can just keep chlorine tabs in the floater and that's all the maintenance his pool needs. He said he didn't even check the chlorine levels last year. He seemed kind of irritated I suggested getting a proper test kit because 'he's been doing this for years without problems' so I just kind of dropped it.

Me? I like the solid science these guys put out there and even though this is my first summer with a pool, I've been able to keep it open for a couple months now with perfect water, perfect chemical levels and only a couple minutes a day of testing and adding my 24-32oz of value-brand bleach. The best part is I know it's safe and I'll never have to worry about even seeing a speck of algae.

These are terrible quality pictures but this is what my pool looks like with the help of these guys. I was stunned the other night when I went out at night and saw how clear the water was with the pump off and no wind (finally!). I should have set up the good camera...

Y0FQA8ql.jpg


This is the drain through 8 feet of water

Cr2tQBWl.jpg


If I could just keep the blasted earthworms from crawling in there every time it rains... :)
 
chjade84 said:
I'll just add my two cents. Just because something hasn't happened before doesn't mean it won't happen eventually. I, as well as everyone else involved, got some infection from an improperly sanitized hot tub and some point of infection resulting in all of us getting quite painful bumps and trips to the doctor for antibiotics. I think the doctor said it was Folliculitis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-tub_folliculitis) but I don't think it was.

Regardless, pathogens aren't something you want to mess around with, even if the chances are remote. There can be far nastier things that you don't want infecting the people using your pool.

The people who make those additive systems generally do so on questionable or unsound science and do have an ulterior motive - selling you stuff. If you can do it on bleach alone (as we all do) why even pay for the extra stuff, and maybe not be as safe. I'm sure ChemGeek could stop in and tell you all about how those systems don't live up to their claims.
Click to expand...

I appreciate the 2 cents! I'm certainly not one to turn my nose up at good science, and am an eager learner. In fact, after Jason's post, I spent some time reading other threads on the subject (including ChemGeek) and am actually quite concerned now.

As I mentioned above, I had nothing to do with the installation of this pool or it's equipment. It's just been the family pool for generations and left to the care of whomever felt like doing anything with it in any given summer. Several years ago, probably prompted by our parents getting tired of maintaining it and based on the promises of the salesman and testimony of another family pool owner, they installed the Water Doctor. We've had no issues and the pool water is always very clear, but who knows what's lurking in there.

Speaking of, is there a way to test the water for pathogens, etc..? I just told my nieces the pool was good to go, and now I'm having second thoughts...

I've just discovered this site, and just discovered the pool school. I'll be spending lots of time on here now and greatly appreciate everyone's kind help.

Scott

PS - pool looks great; good job!
 
I am glad to see that you had an open mind and took the initiative to do some further investigation. Often members come ask one question, and we feel the need to point out other potential issues that new members should be aware of.

If you can get a read for the CYA level, then using the FC/CYA Chart, you can see your required FC levels. As long as the FC is > than the minimum listed for your CYA and the water is clear enough to see the bottom, the pool should be safe.
 

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Thanks! I'm glad you are doing the research for yourself. That's the first step in taking control of your pool! :)

I don't think a pathogen test is possible. Fortunately, if you have your Free Chlorine at the recommended levels on the FC/CYA chart jblizzle linked you have very little to worry about. Remember, they have been using Chlorine as the almost universal sanitizer for municipal drinking water since around the 1940's - at least in the US. It's very good at what it does.
 
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