Help with wide mouth skimmer install

[imcj]

Hello,
Well, I got brave and finally installed the wide mouth skimmer yesterday. It came with a diagram, but no real instructions as far as I'm concerned, so I did the best I could. I am including pictures to help you visualize what I am talking about. Well, I've never attached pics before, so I am going to try. First of all, I had an over the wall skimmer before which I just hung over the pool to show you. I don't know the actual names of things, but the part that stuck out of the pool wall before where I could open or close the water flow I just jerry-rigged attached it to the bottom with an attachment that I had sitting in a box since there were no instructions on how to attach it to my pump. The other pictures are just to show you what I have. Now, the problem...it is leaking even though the screws are very tight, and yes I did include the white gasket part between, and the biggest problem is my pump does not work when I turn it on. It just comes on, but now water is flowing through and back into the pool. I knew I wasn't an expert at this, but I figured I'd better try since I'm the only one to do it. Please give me some suggestions. Thank you.

 

[Charlie_R]

I am assuming that you made sure the valve is open, and that you've bled out the air from the hose to the pump. Water level should be in the middle of the opening, or even a bit higher towards the upper 1/3.

For the leak, you may need to loosen and the retighten the screws. Loosen them about 2 turns, then tighten them 1/4 turn at a time in a cross pattern until they are tight.

Good thinking on the use of the small to large Intex adapters!

 

[imcj]

Thanks on the positive on the adapters. I figured somebody would think I was nuts, but it was what I had on hand. I did make sure the valve was open and bled the air and got the water level up. When I first turn on the pump, the return shoots water into the pool, but only one quick burst then nothing. Would the height of my new skimmer make the rest not work properly. I hope I didn't place it too high. If I kept it as low as the previous one the water would only go a little above my waist. Please tell me I didn't do it all wrong. I need to figure this out pretty quickly since our temps have been close to 90 and my water quality will be compromised very soon. Any other ideas?

 

[Charlie_R]

It sounds like a suction side leak, a large one at that.

The only thing I can think of offhand, is bleed the air out of the hose again, then pour water on the adapter while someone else turns the pump on. If it sucks the water in, see if you can find a way to seal it. If that turns out to be the problem, maybe you have an old bicycle inner tube you can cover the stem from the skimmer then put the adapter over that. Check also that the vacuum break valve on the intake isn't stuck open.

 

[imcj]

I removed this thing from the skimmer. I was told it goes above the basket, but when I removed it, the water shoots out of the return into the pool at first as it did before. Then it comes in like a garden hose turned way down. At least coming into the pool now instead of nothing, but it not enough to move the water or allow my swg to run.

 

[Charlie_R]

That is your vacuum plate, for attaching your hose to when vacuuming your pool. Used only when cleaning. You didn't say that was in there....

Anyway, you probably still have a suction side leak somewhere, ore aren't able to get all the air out of your hose between the skimmer and the pump. Keep looking, and check all connections.

 

[imcj]

Thanks. I didn't remember it was in there...plus, I didn't know what it was! Thanks for clarifying. That would definitely make a difference. See, never listen to others, come straight here!!

I went out and cannot find anything wrong!! This is when I want to say I don't know enough to do this thing and want to just close it up. This will be the 4th summer having this pool, and you guys always help me so much! Maybe I should've just left the over the wall skimmer. I just didn't want to have to replace it again, and it already had a crack in it.

Could I have placed it too high, or keep searching for that leak? :sigh: Thanks!

 

[Divin Dave]

That thing in the picture is the vacuum plate. It isnt needed for skimming. Generally you only need it when vacuuming. When time to vacuum, put that in, prime the vacuum hose and stick in on the pipe of the vacuum plate. (You dont actually have to have a vacuum plate to vacuum, but thats what it's for.)

Still sounds like you may have an air leak. When you look into the lid of the pump, do you see bubbles? If so you have air in the suction line.
Did you put water on the fitting while pump is running? If you do that and you have a suction leak, the water will be sucked into the fitting through the leaky spot.

Also check the lid on the pump and make sure the Oring isnt leaking. Squirt water around the lid too, if the water is sucked in, then the O ring isnt sealing right.
Check the drain plugs on the pump also. Squirt water on those.

It may be the pump isn't fully primed yet? Try releasing the pressure valve for just a second and then close a few times as water is flowing through the pump and filter. If there is air releasing, then there is still air in the system for some reason.
To tell if its just prime, continue to open and close the release valve on the filter until there is no more air coming out, just a lot of water...at this time, there should not be very many bubbles visible in the pump. Now close the valve and let it run. If the bubbles come back and the flow decreases, there is a suction leak (or a vortex). If not, and you have good flow, then the pump just wasnt primed.

Also, was everything working fine before you put the skimmer on or is this the firtst time of the season you have turned it on?

Also, the water level of the pool should 1/2 to 2/3 up the opening of the skimmer. Is it?
Look into the top of the skimmer. Tell us if you see a vortex if so, then the water level in the pool may not be high enough. There should not be a vortex.
If there is, then you need to raise the water level in the pool.

I am curious though, is your return line higher than the skimmer or is it under the water line?

 

[f3justusc]

Often times, air gets in the line when I am vacuuming and it takes many tries to bleed it out. I also wonder if your pump hasn't run into an issue because it wasn't pumping anything. I would test the pump without it being connected to the skimmer. If it's the pump upgrade to the 2650 sand filter/pump. You won't be sorry. That pump that you have looks like the 1500 and I ran into a situation where it wouldn't pump. I got it pumping again but I keep it as a back up to the back up. Lol.

I was looking at the pic from my phone. What I thought was the "1500 pump" is in fact, your sand filter. Ignore that part.

 

[mrmacdad12]

Hello,
Well, I got brave and finally installed the wide mouth skimmer yesterday. It came with a diagram, but no real instructions as far as I'm concerned, so I did the best I could. I am including pictures to help you visualize what I am talking about. Well, I've never attached pics before, so I am going to try. First of all, I had an over the wall skimmer before which I just hung over the pool to show you. I don't know the actual names of things, but the part that stuck out of the pool wall before where I could open or close the water flow I just jerry-rigged attached it to the bottom with an attachment that I had sitting in a box since there were no instructions on how to attach it to my pump. The other pictures are just to show you what I have. Now, the problem...it is leaking even though the screws are very tight, and yes I did include the white gasket part between, and the biggest problem is my pump does not work when I turn it on. It just comes on, but now water is flowing through and back into the pool. I knew I wasn't an expert at this, but I figured I'd better try since I'm the only one to do it. Please give me some suggestions. Thank you.

The problem you are having is in fact a suction side leak, as Charlie has said.

The problem is the intex twist style valve that you are using in conjunction with the intex "type B" (large to small) adapters.

See what is happening is all the adapter you have before the twist valve is creating enough restriction to activate the (ANTI-SUCTION) safety valve which is installed in the twist style valve. There should have been 2 clear plastic plugs to place over the nipples on the twist valves so as to no have this happen. There is nothing wrong with your pump, it is the valve allowing air in when your pump gos to pull suction. Eliminate the valve and just hose clamp the hose to the barbed fitting that should have been included with your skimmer. Your pump should then work just fine.

For installing a shut off valve you can try to use the intex twist valve you have attached directly to your pump intake and use the hose clamp on the other end attached to your barbed fitting on your skimmer. this still may activate the anti suction valve on the intex twist valve.

to eliminate the intex valve all together you might be able to use all threaded connections provided you can find a threaded male PVC adapter that will thread into the bottom of your skimmer. from there you can use a slip fit on one end and threaded on the other end PVC ball valve and screw your barbed skimmer fitting into the ball valve and clamp your hose to the barb.

 

[imcj]

Well, I had to leave for church and it got dark on me, so I will check out all that you all said tomorrow after work. I can't thank you enough. I will be sure to post after replacing the twist valve with the hose and clamp and anticipating good news! I appreciate you guys so much!

 

[imcj]

I can't get this thing to work! I didn't find a barbed fitting with the items with the skimmer. Is there a picture on the site that you can direct me to so I can see what my finished product should look like and go from there? thanks.

 

[Charlie_R]

Here's an idea. Have someone hold a large bowl or pan on the inside of the pool, over the opening of the skimmer. Remove the valve, and attach the hose directly to the type "B" adapter you have on your barb fitting -- that is the piece sticking out of your skimmer bottom with the threads going into the skimmer -- then try the pump, with the bowl removed of course. This will eliminate the valve and anti-suction as a source of the problem.

If this works, then you will know that mrmacdad12 was right.

There is an alternative to using the Intex valve. Check out this thread for a way around this. While your prices may be different in your area, the total cost of my adapter came in at about $30. The most expensive part was the valve, at $16.

 

[imcj]

I now have only a hose clamped to the skimmer which goes to my pump. It is still doing the same thing. I took a short video to show you what is happening, but I can't upload anything else. I don't know how to delete the pics I have so I have room to upload this. Anyway, I can see through the clear reservoir on the pump that it is full of water, when I turn the pump on, the water rushes in which is normal, but then after about a second, the water level drops and not enough pressure for the water to push into the pool. I took off the valve. ???

 

[Charlie_R]

You can upload your video to YouTube or Vimeo, and link to it in a post.

 

[imcj]

OK, the setup isn't the problem. I opened the skimmer and noticed that even with a high level of water in the pool there wasn't a huge amount in the skimmer itself so I looked at it more closely. It does not sit level. I held it down on the side away from the pool to allow more water to fill it and voila! Working perfectly. Wow, amazing to feel the relief. I always brag about this site, and now there's just more to brag about. Now the problem is how to keep it level. I have a couple of red bricks sitting on it right now, but I'd like a long term remedy.

 

[mrmacdad12]

OK, the setup isn't the problem. I opened the skimmer and noticed that even with a high level of water in the pool there wasn't a huge amount in the skimmer itself so I looked at it more closely. It does not sit level. I held it down on the side away from the pool to allow more water to fill it and voila! Working perfectly. Wow, amazing to feel the relief. I always brag about this site, and now there's just more to brag about. Now the problem is how to keep it level. I have a couple of red bricks sitting on it right now, but I'd like a long term remedy.

Glad you figured it out. I totally forgot that you have a rectangular pool. pump sucking the skimmer dry that will cause air or low flow to your pre filter pump basket. sounds like you may need to add a additional inlet for your pump to keep it filled with water.

You still may run into issues with the intex twist valve later down the road. I had problems with the valve allowing air in when I was vacuuming. there was little clear plastic plugs to cover the valve but they were misplaced.

if you are still running with no valve on your inlet to your pump, you should be able to connect the valve to pump, then your hose to the valve, to the "b type" adapter, or just directly hose clamp the hose onto the skimmer. if that works. you will atleast have a shut off so you can clean the pump basket if need be.

 

[imcj]

Great idea. Thank you!