replaster start-up

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C

calstar

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2014
104
santa barbara, california
Perfect timing novca, my new plaster(also medium gray) is finished and the pool is filling. I've been given the Hamilton index acid start-up to follow, 4gal of muriatic per 10,000gal, 15,000 gal pool = 6gal acid. I was thinking that was high("thats how we've always done it" says the plasterer) but looks like its close to what you're doing so I'm good with that. Seeing that you're 5 days ahead of me it will be a great help to me to keep track of your progress, I'm sure I'll have many of the same questions. BTW mine is a re-plaster as well, not a new pool.

couple of questions:

Novca or JasonLion, how do you put the acid into the pool? Is it best to mix the acid with water(acid into a bucket with water) before pouring it into the pool, or is it fine to walk the pool perimeter and pour directly from the gallon jugs of acid?

Novca"
At the end of the 3rd day I added some trichlor pucks in a floater to start gently introducing some chlorine and CYA."

On the direction sheet I have it says if the weather is warm(it is, mid 70s) use a floater with pucks, but the plasterer said "we never do that any more" so...?

thanks,

Brian
 
New plaster questions

Don't want to be redundant(I've asked similar/same in the this thread http://www.troublefreepool.com/thre...-Pool-Calculator-extremes?p=612238#post612238 ) but I'll be adding acid (following the Hamilton index acid start up as directed by the plasterer) and brushing somewhere around 1:00 am tonight and am hoping to get some basic info asap.

I've been given the Hamilton index acid start-up to follow, 4gal of muriatic per 10,000gal, 15,000 gal pool = 6gal acid.

How do you put the acid into the pool? Is it best to mix the acid with water(acid into a bucket with water) before pouring it into the pool, or is it fine to walk the pool perimeter and pour directly from the gallon jugs of acid?

Do you brush just before or just after adding the acid?

thanks a lot,

Brian
 
Re: New plaster questions

You want to pour slowly in front of a return jet in the deep end with the pump running. Then brush to be sure no acid is pooling on the bottom.

Although I have no idea what that startup procedure is.
 
My pool was re-plastered(quartz sand, medium gray) march 18, fill completed that evening, acid added(6gal for 15000 pool as instructed) brushed immediately. March 19 brushed in AM and evening. Today, march 20, no plaster dust is visible and water is crystal clear, brushed and could not see any dust dust raised from the brushing.

I tested my TA with the 100 test kit, looked to be 10 or 20(one or two drops), tested CA and its 300+-, ph was light yellow(below any reading on the scale).

Instruction steps 4, 5 below were given to me,the color looks like it is as intended, should I stop the acid process(using generic other than Easy pH)? Plasterer said wait a week before leaving on the 18th. I haven't called him yet as his verbal instructions differed from the written sheet, which surprisingly he was not familiar with(!!), thought I'd check here before calling him.

The colored sentence in step 5 does not say what "is needed", I assume its when the ph reaches 7.2. I'm new on TFP but with my limited reading of threads it seems like I should not stop the acid process now on day 3.

Also, should I continue to brush even with the absence of dust?

thanks, Brian



STEP 4
Brush pool at least once daily, mainly in areas of white deposits
and avoid darker areas. AS SOON AS ANY PART OF THE POOL
TURNS DARK, OR TO THE INTENDED COLOR, STOP THE ACID
PROCESS BY GOING TO STEP 5.
STEP 5
First, test your pool with a base demand test and calculate the
amount of neutralizer that the pool needs. Then use a 4 or 5
gallon plastic pail, dip into the pool and fill with pool water. Add
1 or 2 bags of EASY pH®
stir COMPLETELY to dissolve. Broadcast
neutralizing SOLUTION out over the top of the pool BRUSH
IMMEDIATELY! Repeat this procedure until all of the neutralizing
chemicals needed, are into the pool. Wait 24 hours and retest
pool. REPEAT STEP 5 IF NECESSARY.
 
If the surface looks right now then it is probably best to stop the acid now. Additional use of acid will make the surface rougher and just slightly lower the lifetime of the surface. Just be sure you like the way it looks before neutralizing the acid.

I imagine they are assuming that you do a base demand test to see how much EASY pH to add. If you don't have a base demand test, and I don't see why they would assume you do, you add enough to raise PH by perhaps 0.4, mix it in, wait half an hour, test the PH again, and repeat as needed until the PH is 7.0 or higher.

It should be fine to use borax instead of EASY pH.

You should continue brushing daily until at least a week after the plaster was applied (unless they tell you otherwise).
 
PH during re-plaster start-up

At 10 PM tonight(march 21) it will be 3 full days(24 hr periods) since I added acid(6gal, 15000 ig pool) to begin the acid start-up process. I just(march 21 AM) tested the ph(using a newish Blue Lab ph pen and calibrated just before testing) and its 5.9. Is this a normal reading for 3 days into the process(from the tap its 7.9+-)? Water is crystal clear, no plaster dust visible and brushing daily.

thanks,

Brian
 

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JasonLion said:
Does the surface not look right yet? Or is there some other reason you haven't neutralized the acid?
Click to expand...

Yeah, I have the borax now but I can't seem to work the calculator. I'm also confused by your statement to novca:

When doing an acid startup with fresh plaster you don't normally neutralize the acid, the plaster curing takes care of that automatically. The PH should come back into range on it's own within one to three days

I was waiting for the third full day to see where the ph would end up. TA a few minutes ago was 30, ph still at 5.9, CA 300+-, total dissolved solids(Blue Lab ppm meter) 570.

Should I add a pound for starters and see what the ph is? My understanding is to mix the borax with water(in a 5 gal bucket) and broadcast over the surface. Since my pump/filter is not yet working due to low ph do I brush after broadcasting the borax to circulate it?

thanks, Brian
 
There are many different kinds of startups, yours appears to have used more acid than I am used to. I imagine that is a way to save them from coming back later and adding more acid later, which is the most common approach (because it gives them more control over the process).

I would start with a whole box of borax, pre-mix with water in a bucket, pour the mixture slowly while walking around the edge of the pool, and then brush the entire pool to help it mix into the water. Wait at least half an hour after you are done brushing before measuring the PH again.
 
JasonLion said:
,,,,I imagine that is a way to save them from coming back later and adding more acid later, which is the most common approach (because it gives them more control over the process).
Click to expand...

I am "them":confused:, they do not do start-ups. The plasterer gave me instructions which differed from the written sheet emailed from their office, then it was pretty much "you're on your own". Anyway, no biggie.

I added two 4lb boxes, each box was separated into approx 1lb portions, mixed with 5gal water and poured along the edges and broadcast into the middle, followed by brushing. Waited 30 min after the first box and tested, TA 30, ph 6.1. Second box was then added using the same method, brushed, waited another 30 and tested, TA 40, ph 6.3. Just finished the second test, its a little before 10PM now and I'm going to bed, will continue in the AM. Looks like I need to add at least 3(probably 4 to get to 7.1) more of the 4lb boxes if the ph rises .2 per box as it did for the first 2 boxes.

to be continued,

Brian
 
When I say "them" I am talking about the authors of the sheet, who I imagine used to do some of the work themselves before pushing the entire process onto the owner. That is how I interpret things anyway. There isn't really enough evidence to be certain either way, and at this point it doesn't really matter.

You seem to be moving along well.

PoolMath says two and a half more boxes to get to 7.0, though it can be off a bit when the PH is that extreme. You should stop adding borax when the PH gets up to 7.0 or higher. Plaster curing will take it up the rest of the way over time.
 
Added 2 more boxes this AM and the ph only climbed .1 per box! My TA is now 60 which I think is closing in on my target of 70-80 so do I continue to raise the ph and deal with the TA later?

At the rate I'm going I'll run out of the boxes of Borax I have(6 total, I took all to be had in the 2 stores that stocked it), can I switch to soda ash without problems to continue?

thanks, Brian
 
JasonLion said:
When TA gets up to 80 or 90 you can switch to aeration to raise PH.
Click to expand...

Does this apply if I'm not yet at 7.0? Can I turn the pump/filter on at 7.0 to facilitate aeration? After reading some of the cya start-up threads I put a 3" trichlor puck in a floater(inside a sock) to get a little cya and chlorine into the water, that OK?

I realize I'm asking a lot of questions since I'm new to pool maintenance(the right way at least) and greatly appreciate the help/knowledge shared. I have read just about all of the pool school I find lots of info/answers there, but it really helps me when I can get an answer to specific questions I'm uncertain about.

Just took readings from the latest box of Borax added; TA 70, ph up another .1 to 6.7. Going to add another box now.

Brian

Brian
 

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