Jandy Lite 2 and SWG, is it ok?

[RUSigX]

Hello! I just bought a new house and have inherited a 27,000 gallon pool. It's a SWG pool and it's concrete. The previous owner said in 2006, he spent $80k plus on it including the retaining wall and pavers.

I have a really nice pool guy that's been here a few times helping me get the pool up and running as it was somewhat neglected for the last few years. The pool has a Jandy Lite 2 400,000 BTU heater on it, model # LD400N. The pool guy is telling me that the heater has cast iron headers on it and that's not a good match for my SWG pool. The heater is a 2006 model and he does not recommend using it with an SWG pool and to only use it with a chlorine pool.

After a search on the internet I couldnt find much but it seems other's use Jandy heaters on SWG pools. I think I read somewhere that a SWG pool has a salt saturation of 3,000 PPM and the ocean is 35,000 PPM but not sure. Is it safe to be using this heater with my SWG pool or did the previous owner get screwed around on the installation? Pool guy is also telling me that since the heater hasn't been used in several years it will also probably need a $400-$500 regulator maybe???? He said the rubber things inside deteriorate when they are not used. I cant remember if it was the regulator or not.

My pool guy says my in-line chlorinator looks old as well and that we should just make the pool a chlorine pool for the remainder of the season and if I want we can turn it back into a SWG pool when I open it back up in the spring. Thoughts on going this route?

As pool is filling after cleaning
[attachment=0:26d4g0bt]IMG_0480.JPG[/attachment:26d4g0bt]

 

[DorsalSpine]

Hello! I just bought a new house and have inherited a 27,000 gallon pool. It's a SWG pool and it's concrete. The previous owner said in 2006, he spent $80k plus on it including the retaining wall and pavers.

I have a really nice pool guy that's been here a few times helping me get the pool up and running as it was somewhat neglected for the last few years. The pool has a Jandy Lite 2 400,000 BTU heater on it, model # LD400N. The pool guy is telling me that the heater has cast iron headers on it and that's not a good match for my SWG pool. The heater is a 2006 model and he does not recommend using it with an SWG pool and to only use it with a chlorine pool.

After a search on the internet I couldnt find much but it seems other's use Jandy heaters on SWG pools. I think I read somewhere that a SWG pool has a salt saturation of 3,000 PPM and the ocean is 35,000 PPM but not sure. Is it safe to be using this heater with my SWG pool or did the previous owner get screwed around on the installation? Pool guy is also telling me that since the heater hasn't been used in several years it will also probably need a $400-$500 regulator maybe???? He said the rubber things inside deteriorate when they are not used. I cant remember if it was the regulator or not.

My pool guy says my in-line chlorinator looks old as well and that we should just make the pool a chlorine pool for the remainder of the season and if I want we can turn it back into a SWG pool when I open it back up in the spring. Thoughts on going this route?

As pool is filling after cleaning
[attachment=0:2w9lcdja]IMG_0480.JPG[/attachment:2w9lcdja]

I can't speak to the heater since I don't have one. Chlorine for the rest of the season is not a bad idea. It will give you time to research further. Read pool school and the CYA/Chlorine relationship, it will explain how water chemistry works.

You have a beautiful pool and new water. It would be a shame to follow the typical pool store advice and end up with a CYA problem down the road.

 

[ps0303]

Oh boy here we go with the pool guys telling people to upgrade. I've worked on this heater on salt generator and chlorine pools. A salt system isn't going to hurt the heater. The biggest issue with this heater is the cast iron header and that if you don't have water flowing thru it on a regular basis, the header will create rust and then when you do go to use it, you will get rust on the pool. This happens regardless of the pool being salt or chlorine. Try the unit and see if it works. If it doesn't work, hire a licensed repair person to look at it. Not all pool guys are licensed or knowledgeable on pool heaters.

There is a huge misconception about pool heaters and SWG systems. So many people think you have to buy special units or pay for cupro nickel heat exchangers. It all boils down to keeping your pool water balanced properly. Any unbalanced pool, salt or chlorine, will ruin equipment. So keep your pool water balanced properly and you will be OK.

So just because the chlorinator looks "old" he says you should replace it? Sounds to me that the pool guy is looking to make some extra $$. I would be very leery of this guy.

 

[duraleigh]

ps0303,

That is an excellent, informative post.

 

[techguy]

It appears this pool guy is not looking out for your best interests. He is looking to make money. I am paying you for your professional opinion, not an opportunity to find a way to sell something. Things fail... Then you replace it. I know sometimes you replace items before failure but old is not a reason, most of the time.

 

[RUSigX]

ps0303 and techguy, thank you for the reply's!

Please let me clarify, when we were looking at the clorinator we both noticed that it had paint on it like the rest of the pipes and we know the pool was installed in 2006-2007 time frame. He also stated that the dial inside the box was turned up pretty high so he said that with the dial turned up and the paint on it, it was probably the original and possibly on its way out. He said they usually last 3-6 years depending on use. He advised me to go chlorine since we are at the end of the season and then if I want to go SWG next year try it out and see what happens rather than having to possibly buy a new one now and then it just sits there under warranty all winter.

Back to the heater, he cut the pipe coming out of it as it did not have a shut off valve although it did have one coming in. He put a shut off valve on the pipe out but has not replaced the outflow pipe yet. I'm sure there is probably some rust in it as it looked like some rusty water in the pipe. What's the best option to get that cleaned out. I can have him test the unit as well to see if its working.

Thanks again!

 

[ps0303]

Can you take a picture of this setup/heater? As for the valve on the incoming, that's a way that some people "bypass" the heater. It does prevent water from flowing thru the unit even if there is no valve on the out side of the header.

No real way to clean all of the rust out other than flushing the pipes by running the unit. Keep in mind that in order to test the unit, it has to be hooked into the plumbing of the pool. That is the best way to test it. Yeah you can jump out the pressure switch and see if it tries to fire but it's usually best to have it all hooked up correctly.

As for the salt chlorinator, again it all has to do with how well the pool is maintained. I have seen salt cells last longer than one would expect and it is all do to the pool being maintained correctly. Plus if you get a cell that is for a slightly larger pool than what you have, you can run the cell at a lower percentage and get a longer life out of it. What brand is this salt system? You can add chlorine at any time even if the salt system was working. For example, if you have an algae issue you can shock a salt pool with liquid chlorine shock. It won't hurt anything.

 

[ping]

What is preventing the SWG from turning on? Just because the dial was turned to a high setting does not mean the unit was on it's way out. They might of had a short run time on the pump and they needed to turn the SWG up so it would make enough chlorine for the pump run time. Make sure the cell is clean and turn it on and test to see if it is making chlorine. You can loosen a fitting after the cell so it will leak a little water and if the chlorine reading measures higher with that water compared to the water in the pool, then the cell is working. If it is not working, then use liquid chlorine during the winter and in the spring decide if you want to continue with liquid or get the SWG working.

If you turn on the pump will the water run through the heater with the outlet pipe off? That might be a good way to flush the heater without the rusted water returning to the pool. Other than that, I'm not sure what to use to clean the header.

 

[RUSigX]

I would assume there is nothing preventing us from turning it on. Pool guy also suggested buying a bigger cell if it needs to be replaced. The salt system is an Aqua Rite with a Goldline cell.

First pic you can see the filter, Polaris pump, new 1.5hp Century pool pump (old Hayward super pump was locked up), and the Jandy heater on the end. You can also see the new cutoff on the hot water return but the pipe coming from the heater hasnt been hooked back up yet.
[attachment=2:bo5x13ev]IMG_0493.JPG[/attachment:bo5x13ev]

You can see section of pipe missing that returns hot water and that the colder water valve going is is turned off.
[attachment=1:bo5x13ev]IMG_0494.JPG[/attachment:bo5x13ev]

This pic is just the other side of the water heater.
[attachment=0:bo5x13ev]IMG_0495.JPG[/attachment:bo5x13ev]

 

[ps0303]

I always hate it when people paint the PVC. Unless it's for solar panels just leave it white. Anyway, in order to really test the heater you should hook it back into the pool.

As for the salt system, turn it on and see if it generates chlorine. Of course you would need to add salt to your pool first. First take a salt reading of the water before you add any salt. Some people just start dumping in salt only to find out they put too much in because the water already had a high level of salt in it. Then you have to dump water and add fresh back in. So do a salt reading first before adding any.

 

[RUSigX]

Well we got the heater plumbed back up and water has been circulating through it for about a week or so now. It looks like the natural gas valve may be bad but was going to see if I could get a confirmation from you guys. I know the unit hasn't been used in a probably 4 years (still looks really good). It's a 2006 model Jandy Lite2 400k BTU Natural Gas. We bled the gas line and turned the unit on and it tried to light but all it would do was burn a little across the back burners and then click off. The pool guy said the valve wasnt letting enough gas through and was shutting itself off. It would do this three times then the safety feature would shut the unit off. We cycled it through this many times and he was sure the gas valve was bad as they tended to go bad when they sat for long periods of time.

He quoted me $600 to replace it ($450 for the valve and $75/hour labor and tax). I can purchase the part off Amazon and have it sitting at my door for $182 and put it on myself. Before I replaced the valve I just wanted to make sure this couldnt be something else. The unit seems to be working fine, it's doing everything it can to start, but it seems it's just not letting enough gas through to fire up. Sometimes it would flame across all burners in the back, other times just a little flame.

 

[techguy]

I am not an expert in pool heaters but did ok in HVAC parts for several years. The tech should be able determine if its the valve or something else. I think in this case, he is guilty of being a parts changer. This is where you start replacing parts and stop when it works. Gas valves can be tested and for $600, I would expect better. I also don't recommend replacing it yourself. What will he say if he replaces the valve and figures out it was not the valve and was a simple sensor? Sorry, just my opinion without knowledge.

 

[ps0303]

My guess is he's not a real gas repair guy or he would have a manometer that they could use to test the gas pressure coming into the valve and then on the manifold side to see if you have the right pressure on the burner side. One thing to consider is pulling the burner tray and look at the burners to see if they are in good shape. This can also be a cause of them burning bad.

 

[techguy]

All it takes is one spider to mess up an entire burner rack.

 

[RUSigX]

Looks like I need to go dl the manual and take this unit apart and clean it out before moving forward. Are there any major sensors I should take note of?

 

[RUSigX]

I made sure the burner was clean and I blew everything out using an air compressor. When I turn the unit it I can see the glow from the igniter which lasts for awhile then I hear a click and maybe 5-7 seconds after that the unit tries to light. Sometimes there are flames across all burners and sometimes only across two of the middle burners. Just when it looks like it may start up I hear a click and it shuts off. It does this 3 times and then I get the 3 flashing lights and have to turn the unit off and on again to reset.

 

[techguy]

Did yuo find the manual? Many times they will have a troubleshooting flow chart where it lists the steps in ignition. It sould like you are getting some gas out of the valve but it is timing out before ignition. If the controller opens the valve, the heater has x seconds to get up to yyy degrees before the timeout occurs and you are getting a full lock out after three failed ignition cycles.

 

[RUSigX]

I found a copy of the manual here:
Edit - updated to the correct link.
http://www.parts4heating.com/v/vspfiles ... andyLD.pdf

I agree with what you said above, my assumption is that I'm not getting enough gas constantly to get up to the proper temp before it times out so I figured the gas valve is bad or there is a bad sensor?

 

[techguy]

Not a technician but gas valves are difficult to test without the proper tools or knowledge but don't fail often.

 

[ps0303]

You really need to get a pressure reading of the gas before the valve and then on the other side after it ignites. This will indicate how the well valve is working. Constant gas as you mentioned has nothing to do with it getting up to temp. More than anything if the flow is not great enoug or too great, the flame sensor might not indicate that the burners lit.