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Thread: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

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    dattia's Avatar
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    Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    Hi all, Dawn from PA here. I have been fighting with my pool for about two weeks now, the pool is winning thus far. I have been doing some reading here, but now I think it is time to come forward for help. Circulation is my problem. I drained my 27 foot round pool down to about two inches and started to refill. As soon as possible, started vacuuming and got everything looking pretty good considering how bad it was to start with. So after wading in the muck, getting bitten everywhere, vacuuming and refilling, I was ready for the final before swim vacuum. Now, it seems that I don't have much suction. There is some suction, but it is not adequate for a good vacuum, or to circulate the water properly.

    Before starting this endeavor, I replaced a cracked strainer housing on my Hayward Matrix 1 1/2 HP Pump. When I lost suction, I thought perhaps the cover plate on the pump was also cracked. I ordered a new one and installed it. I also replaced the o-rings and lubed them with Leslie's Pool Lube. When I put everything back together, it was more of the same. The pump makes a noise, but not a grinding noise. It makes the noise on the filtration cycle and the Recirc cycle. There is no abnormal noise during the backwash or rinse cycles. Also, the water is continuously churning in the strainer during those two cycles while it begins with a churn and suddenly goes flat in filtration and Recirc. If I put my hand in the skimmer basket, I can feel suction, but only when I am far too close to the hole (ouch, there is a sharp edge in there!). If I look through the lid to the strainer basket, the water just appears to vibrate.

    Today I have checked the hose to the pump, the hose from the pump to the filter and the hose from the filter to the pool, all are clear and were tightly in place. A gentleman at the pool store said that perhaps my impeller was cracked. I had already made sure it was not obstructed by debris, but I did not inspect it for cracks. As of right now, my pump is in pieces. I took it apart to the impeller, which from what I can see, is not cracked. I am afraid to take anything further off of this pump. My next step is to attempt to take apart the filter (yikes) unless someone here can steer me in another direction from what I have described.

    I have tried to do a prolonged backwash and rinse and backwash and rinse cycle, but it did not improve anything. I replaced a broken pressure gauge and it has been reading at a very 'jumpy' 18. As of right now, my chemicals seem to be good from the pool store readings, but I know that won't last if I do not get the water moving in this pool.

    Any and all help greatly appreciated!
    27' round AG
    Hayward Matrix 1 1/2 HP Pump
    Hayward S210T Sand Filter

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    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    Bump....

    Oh resident pool gurus.... (I'm stealing that phrase, read it on here)

    Somebody help this poor gal, I cannot, I'm not mechanically inclined. (But I'm impressed with your courage to tackle the filter....)

    How old is the filter?

    You drained your pool almost completely? FYI for future, You will read on TFP that most recommendations are not to drain it more than 1/3 or even 1/2....risking a collapse or damaging the liner.

    Good luck, I hope this gets worked out shortly...
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    sammm's Avatar
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    Re: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    Has the filter ever been thorougly cleaned? If you have low pressure it is preportionally related to low suction (and vice versa). In other words, the filter could be the bottle neck in your water flow.

    Does the pump ever prime?
    WetEdge Satin Matrix, 16K gallon, Pentair NSP-60 DE filter, Pac Fab Challenger, 2HP pump, BBB, Polaris 360

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    dattia's Avatar
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    Re: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    This will be the third season for the pool and all of it's equipment. I did not mention that the filter is also a Hayward (sand) S210T (I think) with a Multi-port valve. When the pool was installed, they told me that I may need to add some sand in the beginning of the third season, but I really don't know anything about cleaning it out. As a matter of fact, I saw the inside of one for the first time yesterday at the pool store. I begged a little for the guy to open one up on the floor to show me... I impressed him with my knowledge of the terminology, but in reality, that is all I have.

    As I said earlier, my pump is in pieces right now and it looks great as far as I've gotten. Unfortunately, there is a stripped bolt holding it onto the base so I cannot lift it to see if there is something abnormal underneath. I am working on that problem now and my 17 year old son just came home and can help with the filter if I do need to take it apart. I had no problem priming the pump to vacuum during the clean-up phase, although most of that vacuuming was done to waste.



    Thanks for the info about not draining the pool all the way. As I was wading in the two inches, I did have moments when I wondered if I had done a good thing or not. Luckily, I got through that part unscathed. On the bright side, my husband and I decided to jump in a short while ago with all of our clothes on, it was fun!

    Thanks for the replies!
    27' round AG
    Hayward Matrix 1 1/2 HP Pump
    Hayward S210T Sand Filter

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    Re: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    Quote Originally Posted by dattia
    Hi all, Dawn from PA here. It makes the noise on the filtration cycle and the Recirc cycle. There is no abnormal noise during the backwash or rinse cycles. !
    This certainly sounds like a clog in the return line! If the noise is there when water is being returned to the pool (filter or recirc) but not there on waste or backwash it's gotta be something in the return line. How is the directional eyeball? This is about the only question I can think of asking at this point.

    I'll think on this overnight - if you have any more info/ details tomorrow I'll get back to you 8)
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    dattia's Avatar
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    Re: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    I don't have any eyeball. so to speak. My return consists of vents around a light fixture. The flow is weak. Yesterday when I was a mad woman tearing everything apart, I was able to get a finger up into the fitting and I did get a few pine needles out. It is possible that there are more in there, I just didn't feel them. I will disconnect that hose again and see. The hose itself is free and clear.

    I took the top off of the filter. I'm at a loss. I was expecting to see a horrible funkified mess, and all I saw was relatively clean sand under very clean water with a PVC tube going down the middle. No joy there, I was hoping to see something that would lead me to root cause of my problem. It may be there, I just don't see it.

    Again, thank you all.
    27' round AG
    Hayward Matrix 1 1/2 HP Pump
    Hayward S210T Sand Filter

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    dattia's Avatar
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    Re: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    I have found joy!

    Thank you 'waste'!!!

    I put everything back together today, making sure to lube everything well. I had been curious as to why I did not get much water loss through my return when I had the hoses off. When 'waste' asked about the eyeball... I decided to poke around a bit more since I had gotten a few pine needles previously. What tool to use though... I found a large size plastic locking wire tie and got into the pool to try to ream it from the front side. I placed a large pitcher to catch anything that might come out on the ground under the hose fitting. It was difficult to get the tie inside the vents (this is a combo light/return) but I finally felt something give way. I went into every vent slot and moved the tie back and forth and I could hear the dripping water on the outside of the pool become more substantial.

    When I got out and hooked everything back up, everything ran perfectly. I have circulation, I have flow... I have JOY! and a big old clump of pine needles in the pitcher!

    Just not sure if I should tell dear hubby everything that I have replaced and the tools I have bought for this project, when an old plastic wire tie was all I needed! (and a little nudge in the right direction from those 'in-the-know')

    Thank you, thank you, thank you!
    27' round AG
    Hayward Matrix 1 1/2 HP Pump
    Hayward S210T Sand Filter

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    Re: Newbie needing help... perhaps my pump???

    I was wondering where Joy was - I turned my back for a minute and she disappeared
    I am very!! happy to have been able to point you in the right direction and am glad your trouble has been solved!
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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