Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and motors?

rock

0
Apr 26, 2012
250
Where do you guys generally get your parts online for rebuilding your pumps and motors?

With three Sta-Rite Max-e-Glas II {AO Smith QC1102 1.0x1.65SF 1.65 HP} pumps, one is always going out on me.
I've been paying for others to rebuild the motors and replace the pump seals but I'd like to order the parts and try rebuilding on my own.

Here are the bearings my pumps appear to be using:
9265552018_06bb56be2f_z.jpg


May I ask where you guys go on the net to buy parts such as pump seals and motor bearings?
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

Pump specific stuff like impellers, seals, gaskets, etc., I try either Amazon or Ebay first. I use the manual and crosscheck at www.poolpartsonline.com to make sure I'm looking at the correct part numbers first.

Since bearings are universal, I bought them at Grainger for a fraction of anywhere else I found online. If you've got a retail location nearby, you can save even more on shipping by buying at the counter. Somewhere on the website they list the numbers you wrote so you can crosscheck those numbers as well.
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

rock said:
With three Sta-Rite Max-e-Glas II {AO Smith QC1102 1.0x1.65SF 1.65 HP} pumps, one is always going out on me.
How often are they failing?

A pump that has repeated seal failure probably has other issues as well such as a bent motor shaft.
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

I agree with Mark, Those pumps should last for years before needing any repairs.

Having said that. I buy all my bearings and seals from Motion Industries.
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

mcmaster.com is where I go for bearings if I know the trade size or actual dimensions.

Ive never bought o-rings from them but I think the same would apply: if you know the size and diameter they can probably be had much cheaper than an actual pool manufacturer labelled part.
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

mas985 said:
How often are they failing?
One by one, I've replaced all the original motors (which were about 10 years old):
9262791765_d73f7fdce0_z.jpg

Looking at prices, I think I've been paying for rebuilds of about what the motor costs brand new!
A.O. Smith 1 H.P Square Flange Up Rate Motor (USQ1102)
mas985 said:
A pump that has repeated seal failure probably has other issues
The seals were working fine until I opened up the pump during an unrelated plumbing repair operation.
9265567688_248fcb43f1_z.jpg

chrisexv6 said:
mcmaster.com is where I go for bearings if I know the trade size or actual dimensions

I just realized, from what you said, that the TRADE SIZE is the key to pricing and quality!
What I need to do is figure out the trade size for all my rebuilding parts.
Pump parts (Sta-Rite Max-e-Glas II)
1. Pump seal
2. Seal plate (large) o-ring
3. U9-374 Diffuser (small) o-ring
4. Pump basket lid (medium) o-ring

Motor parts (AO Smith 1.65HP QC1102, 48Y square flange)
1. 604005-001 double sealed high thrust bearings (trade number 6203D or is it 6203LL?)
2. Very long bolts that always seem to break
9265567764_72b197341f_z.jpg


Smykowski said:
Amazon or Ebay first ... then Grainger. ... crosscheck at http://www.poolpartsonline.com
Once I know the 'trade name', I can find it on Amazon much easier, e.g.,
- OEM #U9-374
Bama Rambler said:
bearings and seals from Motion Industries.
Thanks.

Note: I also found these guys on YouTube:
http://wetheadpumprepair.com/store/prod ... epair-kit/
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

10 years is not so bad. I got the impression there were multiple failures per motor/pump.
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

mas985 said:
10 years is not so bad. I got the impression there were multiple failures per motor/pump.
From memory, three went out, one year at a time, since I bought the house-with-pool.
All were sent to the local shop to be rebuilt, which cost about $150 each for a rebuilt motor (IIRC) because they couldn't get the motors apart.
Here is what they gave me back since I asked for all parts to be returned:
Notice almost all the through bolts are snapped.
9262803875_f15a6100de_z.jpg


EDIT: I just asked for a price & availability quote from http://wetheadpumprepair.com:
Hi Joe Tomorrow & Bob,
I have four Sta-Rite Max-e-Glas II pumps with one-horsepower-sized diffusers/impellers.
I would like an itemized quote on parts & supplies to rebuild four Sta-Rite Max-E-Glas II pumps (one isn't in service yet):
- pump seal PS-201
- seal plate o-ring U9-228A
- diffuser o-ring U9-374
- pump basket o-ring
- sealant and lube

I also would like an itemized quote on these three motors in use at the pool:
(spa) AO Smith SQ1152 [K48M2PA105C4] 1.5HPx1.47SF=2.20 48Y square
(cleaner) AO Smith QC1102 [K48L2PA1101A1] 1.0HPx1.65SF=1.65 48Y square
(filter) AO Smith QC1102 [K48L2PA101A1] 1.0HPx1.65SF=1.65 48Y square
And on these potential rebuilds:
(old) AO Smith QC1102 [K48L2PA101A1] 1.0HPx1.65SF=1.65 48Y square
(old) AO Smith U27-881 [K48L2PA105] 1.5HPx1.10SF=1.65 48Y square
(old) AO Smith U27-884 [K48M2PA105] 2.0HPx1.10SF=2.20 48Y square

What I would need for the motors, I think, are the
- double-sealed high-thrust bearings (6203 or equivalent are used for the 1.65 HP motors)
- through bolts (they are different lengths depending on the motors)

Also, if I decide to rebuild the motors, I'd need a quote on:
- bearing puller
- bearing seater
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

MD_harley said:
inyopools.com

That's a nice find because it helps to find the trade size of the parts we need to rebuild our pumps and motors.
For example, they list AO Smith motor bearing part number 604005-001 as the 6203-2RS for $18.99:
13127055.png

Note: Inyo above says the bearing manufacturer is AO Smith, but AO Smith tech support told me today all their bearings are made by NSK (i.e., NSK 6203WC3E CLKEEMSM is the part number they gave me).

The key is that Inyo Pools indicates it's a 6203-2RS trade size bearing. That's important information!
Googling the INYO Pools reference of 6203-2RS, the number scheme apparently indicates:
6 = metric sized, single row, deep groove
2 = 40mm OD by 12mm thick, light duty
03 = 17 mm bore diameter
2RS = double nitrile rubber seals (i.e., one on each side, to keep contaminants out)

Googling some more, I can find that bearing commonly for about $1.21 to about $1.60 to about $2.77 each.
13127135.png


Interestingly, I had called AO Smith (now CenturyElectricMotors.com) technical support at 800-262-6484 today, who said the bearings on all my motors were 6203 double sealed, but other than the OEM supplier's part number, they didn't know any more. So the 6203-2RS reference from INYO Pools makes sense, given that it needs to be a 6203 size, double sealed, with no shields.

Googling for the AO Smith part number 606202-071 through bolts, I find they're $4 each at Inyo Pools, or $3.30 each at PoolProducts, or $2.57 each at Aqua-Man, where the Inyo Pools description is, again, apropos:
A.O. Smith Motor Thru-Bolt, 8-32 x 9-3/8" x 2" Thread
13127231.png


For the trade size, AO Smith technical support explained all their thru-bolts are 1/4 inch hex head 0.272" diameter rods, of varying lengths (depending on the motor) where the last inch of the rod is UNC rolled thread of size #8x32 inch.

Since I'm inclined to buy stainless steel rods instead of these soft steel through bolts, all I need to know are the various lengths:
AO Smith QC1102 1.65HP(net) 09.38" thru bolts, 9 3/8" long, P/N 606202-071
AO Smith U27-884 2.20HP(net) 10.25" thru bolts, 10 1/4" long
AO Smith U27-881 1.65HP(net) 10.25" thru bolts, 10 1/4" long
AO Smith SQ1152 2.20HP(net) 10.75" thru bolts, 10 3/4" long

For the pump, I had called Sta-Rite (now Pentair Pool) technical support today, at 800-831-7133x1x1x5.
They first asked for the model number on the side of the Max-e-Glas II pump body, which was C76-59P, before giving the pump seal part number of 37400-0027S (which may or may not be correct).

1. Pump Seal = <== Both this PDF and that PDF say the right part number is: Pump Seal Max-E-Glas II = U109-358SS, PS-201, PS-851, PS-3868, VG-201
13127876.png
.
For an upgraded seal, I could go with what it says hereor there, which is to buy the PS-1902 or the PS-4265 or PS-3868.

2. Seal Plate O-Ring = U9-228A
3. Seal Plate housing o-ring = ?
4. Diffuser O-Ring = U9-374
5. Basket Lid O-Ring = U9-375

Looking for the trade sizes for those o-rings, this GO-KIT38-9 kit appears to be $26 for all 5 components:
1. AS-1521 Shaft Seal
2. O-113 Seal Plate O-Ring
3. O-240 Seal Plate Housing O-Ring
4. O-83 Diffuser O-Ring
5. O-12 Basket Lid O-Ring
13127378.png


So, in hindsight, after learning from you guys, it seems the first goal is to find the trade size of all the necessary parts; and then to find a supplier for those trade-size parts.
 

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Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

Here's an update, for anyone needing to rebuild their Sta-Rite (now Pentair) pumps & filters and AO Smith (now Regal, who owns Century Motors, who bought AO Smith) motors.
The trick, it seems, for buying higher quality pool parts at a better price is to find the trade size ... as an $18 good bearing becomes a $5 better bearing in that process and o-rings can be stocked in the dozens for the prices you pay for a single one.
Once you have the trade size, then the rest is simply sourcing on the net, since all the parts appear to be standard parts.

These cross references are useful for o-ring trade-size conversion from your pool equipment part numbers:
- http://www.aladdin1950.com/images/parts ... ss_ref.pdf
- http://www.aladdin1950.com/images/parts ... _cross.pdf
- Aladdin Equipment Company 941-371-3732
Note: This document lists the chemical resistance of the various o-ring materials.

O-Ring sizing charts:
http://www.allorings.com/size_cross_ref ... framed.htm
http://www.marcorubber.com/sizingchart.htm
http://www.broadleyjames.com/o-rings-size-chart.html

Best O-Ring suppliers:
1. http://www.oringwarehouse.com <-- has a very easy to use calculator
2. http://www.theoringstore.com <-- has pentair sizes such as U9-374
3. http://www.mfpseals.com
4. http://www.oringsusa.com

I made the following diagram for you to see the summary of the trade sizing:
9265591282_ab337ee72a_z.jpg

Bigger: http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/131 ... 134279.png
-----
AO Smith QC1102 1.65HP(net) motor [800-262-6484 centuryelectricmotor.com]:
SPECIFICATION PDF (dimension PDF),impeller removal procedure).
1. bearing (x2), 17x40x12mm (IDxODxW) nitrile double sealed (not shielded), 6203-2RS,
a. Brand = NSK is OEM; use name brand such as INA, F.A.G., SKF, Timken, Koyo, Nachi, NSK-RHP
b. Tolerance = ABEC3 / ISO P6 (ABEC1 / ISO P0 is probably acceptable)
c. Radial play = C3 / P25
d. Noise = EMQ (electric motor quality) ZV2
e. Material = 52100 chromed steel & buna N rubber seals (both sides)
2. Thru-bolt (4) 606202-071 1/4"hexhead, #8x32-1" 0.272" 9.375" (9 3/8") (stainless steel threaded rod + nuts may be a better solution)
3. TefGel or equivalent PTFE dissimilar metal anti-seize (works by filling voids & not evaporating)
-----
Sta-Rite Max-e-glas II Pool Pump [Pentair Pool 800-831-7133x1x1x5]:
SPECIFICATION PDF
4. 3/4" shaft seal 3/4" (Buna=37400-0027S, PS201 $5)(Viton=37400-0028S, PS3868 $10)
5. Seal plate housing o-ring, U9-228A (trade size O-240 buna-n70 rubber at 16¢ each)
6. Diffuser o-ring, U9-374; trade size Alladin O-83 at $1.41 each <== this is a strange size
7. Trap cover o-ring, U9-375; trade size O-12 at 1¢ each
8. Drain plug o-ring (x2) U9-359; trade size O-39 at 8¢ each
9. pre1998: Insert o-ring U9-376; trade size O-113 at 2¢ each
10. PTFE-based sealant/lubricant for proper gasket seal
Note: Most O-ring trade-sizes are based on the Aladdin GO-KIT38-9
Note: The drain plug o-ring size is based on this and other reports on the net.

Sta-Rite System 3 Model S8M150 filter tank, 25-inch diameter
SPECIFICATION PDF.
11. Cord ring 24850-0009; trade size Alladin 0-486 <=== this is a strange size
12. Union O-Ring U9362? (based on this listing), trade size unknown
13. Large cartridge 25022-0203S; trade size unknown
14. Small cartridge 25021-0202S; trade size unknown
Note: Cord o-ring trade size is based on this listing and this cross reference.
9265597696_e322c37bbc_z.jpg

Larger: http://www2.picturepush.com/photo/a/131 ... 147850.png

Paramount PC2000 pool cleaner system
15. Six-Port Dome Base O-ring PN: 005-302-0100-00)
16. PCC2000 Nozzle O-Ring PN: 005-552-0142-00
9173158536_e3df844903.jpg
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

patpend said:
I like wetheadpumprepair.com, they sell rebuilt kits and have many helpful videos.
Until this week, I had never heard of Joe Tomorrow at WetHeadPumpRepair.com, so my opinion is nascent; but this is what I know:
a) They cover *all* the real details, in real time, in their 300 videos on pump repair and for that, they're GREAT!
b) Their videos even tell you what tools you need, and what tools you don't need (which is GREAT)
c) They supply very nice repair kits and they sell the necessary tools for homeowners to work on their pumps
d) Their videos are obnoxiously repetitive (like a commercial, which is what they are)
e) Their web site is really hard to navigate if your pump or parts aren't already listed (and phone support says to email them)
f) They responded back to my email with a simple one-line saying it was too complicated to provide a quote
g) Their prices appear to be as overpriced as *all* the pool supply companies (which I can't fault them for)

Smykowski said:
Great info, thanks for posting.

Thank you guys for suggesting the trade-size trick.
The process for sourcing high-quality pool pump parts at a great price appears to be these three steps, and I'm only in the second step:
a) Obtain inventory of desired parts
b) Determine the trade size for each part
c) Source the parts

For example, once you have the o-ring material and size, these are some o-ring suppliers:
- http://www.oringsusa.com
- http://www.mcmaster.com/#o-rings/=mwfbpf
- http://www.theoringstore.com
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

Now that we've figured out all the trade sizes for the o-rings, bolts, and bearings, does anyone know what the rubber material is for pool pump o-rings?

Googling, I see they can be made out of any of a score of materials, most commonly Viton, Buna/Nitrile, Silicone, or Butyl rubber.
Does anyone know what material our pool pump o-rings are made out of?

EDIT: This listing for the 25-inch filter o-ring is confusing whether the material should be Viton or Buna:
This listing mentions pool o-ring material; but it is confusing at best whether we should buy Buna or Viton o-rings.
http://tinyurl.com/nojnt73
http://www.theoringstore.com/index.php? ... s_id=18551
24850-0009 Sta-Rite Tank O-Ring - System 3 Filter, 25 inch diameter
Alladin O-486
The o-rings listed are made from Buna, Viton or EPDM compounds. All pool o-rings are made from Buna unless otherwise stated. If you are running a chlorine system and can not locate the Viton o-ring that you need, please contact us to make sure one is available.

From that, I can't tell if pool o-rings are buna or viton.
13148292.png

Large: http://www4.picturepush.com/photo/a/131 ... 148292.png

Googling for o-ring materials, it seems the material choices go in this order:
a. First see if BunaN (same as Nitrile) will work (because it's the cheapest solution).
b. If that won't work, use Silicone,
c. If that won't work, use Viton (Fluoro-elastomer),
d. If that won't work, use EPDM,
e. If that won't work, use Kalrez (perfluoro-elastomer).

The odd thing is that this blog article says the following (which must be incorrect):
Swimming pool pump and filter o-rings are typically made with EPDM rubber, while chlorinator o-rings are usually made of a Fluorocarbon, Viton or FKM. Some more expensive types are made with a Nitrile rubber, used in Buna type o-rings.

But it would be helpful if someone actually knows the answer.
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

rock said:
does anyone know what the rubber material is for pool pump o-rings?

I found out that Buna rubber (aka Nitrile, or Buna-N) is the "standard" material for all rubber components in a normal chlorine pool like mine.

It turns out that the chlorinator, which I know little about, of a salt pool has a harsher environment, which requires the Viton or EPDM rubber o-rings; otherwise, pool water is about as benign as drinking water - which means the standard Buna-N o-ring works out just fine (as long as it's not exposed to direct sunlight).

It also turns out that the suggestion of buying o-rings by trade size (e.g., O-486) is vastly less expensive than buying by pool part number; and, not surprisingly, the markup at the pool stores is 1000% or greater than at the industrial supply houses.

So, like the BBB system, when you put it together, buying parts is as simple as sourcing the trade size!

If folks are interested, the sizing for inch-dimension O-rings is relatively simple: There are six ranges, the first five of which are by cross section. Within the same cross section, the O-rings are ordered by inside diameter.
The sixth "range" (also called a "group") is for boss-style o-rings, and follows a different convention altogether (they are arranged numerically by outside diameter in 1/16" increments). That's it for o-ring sizing. Best to just consult a chart since there are only as many standard sizes as there are days in a year.

Note: The same BBB-style simplification logic goes for pump seals (e.g., PS201 = buton, PS3868 = Viton) and for bearings (e.g., 6203D vs 6203-2RS).
Thanks everyone for helping me see the light of how to source all my replacement parts for a fraction of the cost of buying them by Sta-Rite & AO Smith part number at the pool stores!
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

I think my housing o-ring is bad since my pump is leaking out the bottom. There is only a clamp holding the pump together (no bolts). I can't find what o-ring to buy anywhere! Can someone help find what o-ring I need for this motor?


Brand Name Part No Century Stock No HP RPM CFM Volts Frame Size Phase Motor Type Frequency Enclosure
A.O. Smith B848 B2848 1.0 3450 230/115 Y56Y 1 CX 60 ODP
 
Re: Where do you buy your parts for rebuilding pumps and mot

I can't take a picture right now. But water is coming out the very bottom where the two parts meet. Right at the large metal clamp.
 

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