Has anyone tried the Stenner ECON pumps?

[UnderWaterVanya]

http://www.uswatersystems.com/shop/prod ... -E10T.html

This one has a built in timer.




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[UnderWaterVanya]

Also what size tank and flow rate would you recommend? My pool used around 96oz of 6% this summer every day. I assume that will be about 70oz of 8.25% now that the common bleach % has changed. I cannot easily (so far) locate anything stronger. So I assume I'll be pumping about 70oz a day into the pool. My pump run time is typically around 6-8 hours but I may try to compress that to 4 hours and see if I can maintain the water quality.

My logic says the minimum I would need then is the 5GPD to make it possible to pump the required amount - however this gives no headroom for adding additional bleach when needed due to heavier swim loads etc. The other choices are 8.5GPD and 15GPD. I read in another thread about the classic pump that 15-17GPD was a good option but I forget how large that pool was and what the average daily use was. I'm thinking 8.5GPD is plenty - and I can always change tubes for the 15GPD output should that be necessary right?

As for Tank sizing, I was thinking about 7.5Gallons - this appears likely to get me almost 2 weeks of my average use if I am using 8.25% bleach. If I can source 12.5% somewhere that would be more like 20 days. However since this is stored outside I'm concerned that these higher concentration bleaches would decay faster. Should I mix the bleach down with water and use a larger tank to avoid the accelerated decay? I could get a 15 gallon tank and mix 50/50 with tap water to give 4.125% from standard 8.25% and keep the same runtime (with double the output - so that would mean a 15GPD pump tube). Is the 4.125% going to decay significantly less than the 8.25%?

 

[JasonLion]

I can answer some of your questions. I recommend getting the 15gpd version. You have a timer which appears to allow fine adjustment so you should have plenty of control over dosage, and the higher capacity allows you more freedom to use it with a shorter pump run time or to aid in shocking the pool. For similar reasons, I would recommend getting the 15 gallon tank. The larger tank gives you more flexibility in the future and more room for splashes to be contained inside the tank. The physical size is still reasonable and the additional cost is minimal. Neither of these are critical, the smaller tank and slower dosing will work fine, the larger sizes just give you a bit more flexibility.

It is rarely a good idea to dilute bleach. Bleach is very sensitive to metal contamination during storage and it is difficult to insure that the water used for dilution is metal free. Decay in the strength of even 8.25% bleach over two or even four weeks isn't going to be an issue.

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

It is rarely a good idea to dilute bleach. Bleach is very sensitive to metal contamination during storage and it is difficult to insure that the water used for dilution is metal free. Decay in the strength of even 8.25% bleach over two or even four weeks isn't going to be an issue.

Interesting. This summer I dilluted a bunch of 12.5% surplus shock that I got from Ollies. I did this mainly because my mentally disabled brother in law wanted to help with pool dosing and so I premixed the daily amount into bleach containers. I didn't want any chance that he might use the partial bottles with 12.5% in the laundry since that's where we kept these. So I down mixed them using tap water - I mixed a week at a time. I did have to use more than I thought I might but I attributed this to the decay of the shock. The shock was dated July of 2012 and I was buying and using this in August, September and October. I stored the unused undiluted shock in the crawlspace where it is quite cool even during the summer.

My municipal water seems metal free:
http://charmeck.org/city/charlotte/Util ... Report.pdf
No copper or lead detected is good right?

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

Also in reading the threads in this area I understand these are pretty loud pumps - is that true? Does anyone know if this new model is as loud? What solutions to the noise have you guys come up with?

 

[houstonTex]

Also in reading the threads in this area I understand these are pretty loud pumps - is that true?

The fixed-rate, high-pressure 10gpd version I use is not loud at all. I think the adjustable versions click pretty loudly when set to anything but full output.

Also what size tank and flow rate would you recommend?

Agree with UnderWaterVanya here. 10-15gpd give you the most options. The 15gal UV tank from Stenner is expensive, but protects the bleach well, mounts the pump well, and is a good size reservoir to extend your maintenance intervals. 4hours of run time is plenty in the 8-15gpd models for your bleach requirements at 8.25%, although in the summer my opinion is that you should filter more than that, even if just at low speed.

Hope this helps!

Paul

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

Also in reading the threads in this area I understand these are pretty loud pumps - is that true?

The fixed-rate, high-pressure 10gpd version I use is not loud at all. I think the adjustable versions click pretty loudly when set to anything but full output.

[quote:123ox74n]Also what size tank and flow rate would you recommend?

Agree with UnderWaterVanya here. 10-15gpd give you the most options. The 15gal UV tank from Stenner is expensive, but protects the bleach well, mounts the pump well, and is a good size reservoir to extend your maintenance intervals. 4hours of run time is plenty in the 8-15gpd models for your bleach requirements at 8.25%, although in the summer my opinion is that you should filter more than that, even if just at low speed.

Hope this helps!

Paul[/quote:123ox74n]

Thanks Paul. I haven't tried 4 hours and may settle in at 6 hours. 8-9 worked great over the summer this year.

 

[mikespoolfl]

I’ve been reading up on Stenner Pumps because I’ve been thinking about using one. I found this from Bama

Bama Rambler
“They have two pressures. 100 psig and 25 psig. They're rated on the pressure they can inject into. I would suggest the 100 psi model as it comes with a check valve at the injection point. That way if a tube or tubing ruptures it won't flow pool water out of it.”

The ECON T looks like anything over 1.3 gpd only does 25 psi. Maybe some Stenner users have some more insight?

 

[Bama Rambler]

I don't know anything about the Econ model but in most systems the 25 PSI model works fine. The check valve for the 100 psi models is just insurance in case the tubing ruptured. If that happened the main pump could possibly force pool water out the injection tubing. However there's not a great chance of that happening and even if it did the injection tubing is only 1/4" so you're not going to lose a lot very quickly.

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

I was actually considering injecting into the puck chlorinator that is unused at this time - I saw another user that did that and it seemed an elegant solution - there would be zero backpressure - this would be injected into open airspace and fall into the flow of water below.

However I'm open to hearing how this is a bad idea. One thing I remember reading was that one reason salts don't build up on the inejector is that they are not exposed to air... which this would be if I implemented it this way.

 

[cwuffman]

I have the 10 gpd fixed speed Stenner and loudness is not an issue. Based on other threads I think the variable output Stenner models were causing objectionable noise.

The Econ series does look interesting, but I am quite happy with the above pump and separate timer from Home Depot. I kind of prefer separate components since I won't have to replace both if either one fails prematurely. I think the total cost is less also, at least for the units I used.

Injecting into the unused puck feeder is working fine for me. I really don't understand why you would want air space in the puck feeder. If you open the water flow valve to maximum you should have plenty of flow to thoroughly flush chlorine into the pool.

Carl

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

I have the 10 gpd fixed speed Stenner and loudness is not an issue. Based on other threads I think the variable output Stenner models were causing objectionable noise.

The Econ series does look interesting, but I am quite happy with the above pump and separate timer from Home Depot. I kind of prefer separate components since I won't have to replace both if either one fails prematurely. I think the total cost is less also, at least for the units I used.

The Econ pump seemed cheaper than the non-Econ pump without a timer. Maybe prices I'm seeing aren't the same.

Injecting into the unused puck feeder is working fine for me. I really don't understand why you would want air space in the puck feeder. If you open the water flow valve to maximum you should have plenty of flow to thoroughly flush chlorine into the pool.

Your setup looked like you were injecting high in the puck feeder - and with mine I don't see a lot of water up high inside when I pull the cover. I assumed it was injecting into the air and dropping into the liquid below. The tip of the injector exposed to air was the concern.

 

[cwuffman]

No, I inject on the lower port of the puck feeder, (http://www.troublefreepool.com/another-happy-peristaltic-pump-injector-t53128.html. I make sure the feeder is full of water by:

with pool pump running, close the water metering valve off to the feeder

remove the cover

slowly open the metering valve (water will begin flowing into the feeder housing)

when feeder is nearly full, replace the cover loosely

when water is forced through the loosely sealed cover, tighten the cover

open metering valve completely

Now there should be no air in the feeder (except a small ammount in the top of the cap).
-----------------------------------------------
My pump was about $220, and the timer was about $15. So the 8.5 gpd pump/timer combo is a better price. Although my pump did come with the check valve included. Don't know about this one. I might have gone this route if it would have been available.

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

No, I inject on the lower port of the puck feeder

Doh! I misunderstood. Great info. Thanks. My feeder is different (Hayward) and I'm still looking to understand my options. I'm not opposed to a different Stenner but the built in timer seems very flexible which a lot of inexpensive timers don't appear to be - but your point about more stuff to break isn't lost on me. Easier to replace the under $20 timer than the whole pump...

 

[beezar]

Just looked at the manual for the ECON pumps, and it says that it is for indoor use only. So probably a no-go for most people.

The tank where you can mount the pump on top of it seems like an attractive option. However, are there problems with having the pump right over a tank of chlorine? Will the chlorine fumes hurt the pump?

 

[Bama Rambler]

Having the pump over the chlorine isn't a problem however if you're injecting acid I would make sure it's vented well.

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

Just looked at the manual for the ECON pumps, and it says that it is for indoor use only. So probably a no-go for most people.

The tank where you can mount the pump on top of it seems like an attractive option. However, are there problems with having the pump right over a tank of chlorine? Will the chlorine fumes hurt the pump?

Wow... The company I was talking to did not mention that.

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[Mongo]

I'm also going to go the Stenner route.

I originally was looking at the fixed output pump on a timer. I'm still figuring out my automation needs though, I might have a new thread on automation later. I figured for independent operation I'd look at the pumps with built-in timers, mainly the ECON and the BDF series pumps. From my readings, I think the BDF pump will suit my needs more than the ECON. I'd rather have more small dosings per day/week than be limited to the 24 dosings a week max limit with the ECON series.

I figure the BDF 24-hour programmable pump will be fine versus the 7-day programmable pump.

As has been mentioned, the ECON pumps are indeed listed as "indoor only" pumps. Same with the BDF series. I talked to Stenner tech, they said there are no environmental limits (temp, humidity, etc) on the pump...their concern is rain. And as long as the pump is completely protected from rain, all should be well.

So right now I'm leaning towards a BDF 24-hour programmable pump installed in a small housing. Haven't pulled the trigger yet though. Even thought the Stenner will likely be a stand-alone installation, I still want to figure out my automation as a whole before I buy.