First Test = Worst Fears Realized...

[azkevman]

Finally received my test kit in the mail today to perform my own testing. Bought our house in May, and just continued filling the puck floater that was in the pool expecting everything to stay smooth. Have now been battling cloudy water for several weeks. Glad to have found TFP...but I think my only hope is a drain and refill...do you agree? Here is my first set of test results.

FC: 25
CC: 0
pH: 7.3 (Not valid with FC >10 correct?)
TA: ???? I ran the test several times...it turns from green to blue to yellow....never red or pink
CH: 320
CYA: 190


I dumped 3 gal of 10% bleach in last night in anticipation of getting a head start on the shock process, hoping when my kit arrived today I would be equipped to continue shocking...

Am I going to have to drain the entire pool with such high CYA????

 

[Leebo]

Did you do a test with 50% tap water and 50% pool water to get your CYA level? If it's over 100ppm then a drain is your best bet. As much as it will suck, having that high of a CYA level is almost impossible to maintain. Your shock level with a CYA level of 190 is a FC level of 40.

As for your TA test....Watch this video just to make 100% sure you're doing the test correct. It sounds like you were coming close to the result...but hadn't hit the end mark. How many drops of the R-0009 did you add?
TA Test Using the TF-100

 

[azkevman]

Did you do a test with 50% tap water and 50% pool water to get your CYA level? If it's over 100ppm then a drain is your best bet. As much as it will suck, having that high of a CYA level is almost impossible to maintain. Your shock level with a CYA level of 190 is a FC level of 40.

I first did the normal test, and after seeing that the dot became covered way below the 100 mark I then performed the 50/50 test.

As for your TA test....Watch this video just to make 100% sure you're doing the test correct. It sounds like you were coming close to the result...but hadn't hit the end mark. How many drops of the R-0009 did you add?
TA Test Using the TF-100

I did watch the video to ensure I was doing it correctly and performed both the normal, and expected high TA tests...both with same results. I stopped after 30 drops.

 

[sparookie]

This is from the "Pool & Spa Water Chemistry" manual that came with my k-2006 kit - the TF-100 kit uses the same reagents except larger quantities.

"FALSE READINGS: the most common interference in the total alkalinity test is caused by a high level of chlorine. When excessive chlorine is present in the sample water, one of the two reagents used in the total alkalinity indicator is bleached out. When this happens, the reaction's color change is from blue to yellow instead of green to red. To avoid this problem, repeat the test but this time add an extra drop of the first reagent, thiosulfate, which is a chlorine neutralizer. This should destroy the excess chlorine and let the proper endpoint color develop. If this extra drop does not work, wait until the chlorine level is normal then retest to assure an accurate reading."

 

[Leebo]

If my memory serves me correct, Arizona has high TA in the fill water (could be wrong) so a TA level that high isn't a shocker to me. A high FC level could also affect the test. I would suggest heavy doses of acid to lower the levels, however at this point it's in your best interest to lower the CYA and then focus on the other numbers.

Are you having any issues with scaling?

 

[azkevman]

This is from the "Pool & Spa Water Chemistry" manual that came with my k-2006 kit - the TF-100 kit uses the same reagents except larger quantities.

"FALSE READINGS: the most common interference in the total alkalinity test is caused by a high level of chlorine. When excessive chlorine is present in the sample water, one of the two reagents used in the total alkalinity indicator is bleached out. When this happens, the reaction's color change is from blue to yellow instead of green to red. To avoid this problem, repeat the test but this time add an extra drop of the first reagent, thiosulfate, which is a chlorine neutralizer. This should destroy the excess chlorine and let the proper endpoint color develop. If this extra drop does not work, wait until the chlorine level is normal then retest to assure an accurate reading."

Excellent! Thank you for this. I have the k-2006 as well... Hadn't gotten far enough to read that section. Although if I'm facing the inevitable draining I don't know if TA even matters at this point...

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[azkevman]

Are you having any issues with scaling?

I am not sure what I would look for to recognize scaling...
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[kwhyde]

Gotta drain to get the cya down. Mine was in the hundreds and had to drain about 85% and 14 K gallons. Worked and attained a TFP within 10 days. Our sewage bill is tied to water consumption, so we submitted a letter to sewage co telling them we filled a pool and they forgave 10 K gallons of water on those charges, at least.

 

[azkevman]

Yeah, I figured from all I have read here so far that I have no choice but to drain. Now I just need to see what I can find on draining ...do I drain the entire pool at once, or is this a multi step process?

 

[azkevman]

Oh and my last 2 water tests at the pool store reported a CYA of 60. Ha! I don't even know if they did the actual test, or just punched in some numbers and told me to buy Phos-Free to solve all of my problems.

 

[azkevman]

OK, I have a couple additional questions relating to draining the pool. I would like to do it ASAP to get it back usable again. Is there any reason I can't just start draining it right away? Temps the next few days are expected to be avg AZ summer temps..~105. Anything I need to worry about, or do I just start draining and then refill as soon as empty?

Second big question is with the in-floor cleaning system, my main drain is routed through an in-deck leaf canister then to the pump. Will I be able to use my pump and drain it through waste/backwash, or once the water level goes below that in-deck canister is it going to lose suction?

Feeling very unsure about how to proceed....

 

[UnderWaterVanya]

Oh and my last 2 water tests at the pool store reported a CYA of 60. Ha! I don't even know if they did the actual test, or just punched in some numbers and told me to buy Phos-Free to solve all of my problems.

How empowered did it make you feel knowing you had better test and a clearer understanding of the chemistry than they do?

 

[jblizzle]

I am not sure how the leaf catcher works for that system so not sure if the pump will end up pulling air. I just rented a submersible pump from home depot and you can get as much hose as you want to direct the water where you want ... it was to a wash for me.

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[kwhyde]

We were unsure of our water table and did not want to dare take the risk of our pool "floating" up, so we did 3 drains. Of course, our CYA was in the HUNDREDS. But, if your CYA is roughly 200 and you drain 50%, and replace you are now at 100. Drain 50% again and retest to see if you are close to a manageable number. Then, you won't have to worry about the leaf thingie either, I suppose! Don't know anything about that. We did it in the 100 degree temps too. Just drained through the waste option and immediately put two garden hoses in to refill from two different spikets on our house. Refilled overnight. Like I said, since we've done that, it took me about a week to get all balanced and I've just added bleach and brushed the walls of the pool every other day or so.

 

[azkevman]

I am not sure how the leaf catcher works for that system so not sure if the pump will end up pulling air. I just rented a submersible pump from home depot and you can get as much hose as you want to direct the water where you want ... it was to a wash for me.

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The debris/leaf canister has a "balance" line that runs to the pool wall so that there is always about 3-4" of water sitting on top of the internal lid to keep it sealed and prevent is from pulling air. My thought is if I simply seal off the balance line to the pool wall then the water will be retained in the canister to keep the lid sealed and I can just use my pump to send it to waste. I might give it a try and see what happens, keeping a close eye on it. Otherwise I may have to go the submersible pump route.

 

[azkevman]

We were unsure of our water table and did not want to dare take the risk of our pool "floating" up, so we did 3 drains.

From what I am seeing so far, since I am in AZ , we do not have an issue with the water table here...being desert...but I am going to continue researching before I take the plunge.