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Thread: how long before algae shows up???

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    midtngal's Avatar
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    how long before algae shows up???

    Good grief I am only *minutes* from having my pool finished and just can't seem to get there from here! My PB finally installed the liner (waste, apparently the floor was still wet when he did this, therefore the reason for the vacuums going and no fill - at least that's what *he* said) and we finally started filling the pool on Friday. He told me to let it fill to just before the bottom step, then stop it and he would be back on Sat. to finish the liner and I could finish filling it. Well, shocker of all shockers, he hasn't been back since! We have had plenty of rain, but not the entire time. I didn't call him today because starting tomorrow the summer water discount automatically kicks in so my fill will be cheaper. My question is, here the pool is only partially filled with no chemicals in it. How long before the algae starts?? Is there something I should be doing to keep that from happening?? I will be started with the Bioguard start-up for the Mineral Springs system in case that matters. Thanks bunches!

    Karen
    10,700 gal IG vinyl
    Pentair Triton II TR50 sand filter
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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    There are two ways you can deal with this, either leave it alone and make the builder deal with it, or spend some effort to deal with it yourself.

    If you want to deal with it yourself you need to figure out a way to get some circulation happening. That could be a small cover pump or a sump pump or some serious paddling with brooms. Try to guess the amount of water in the pool and add enough bleach to bring it up to 2 ppm each evening until something else happens. After adding bleach you need to circulate the water as much as possible to mix the bleach into the water. This isn't at all ideal, but it will almost always get you through.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    It's good to know that he had a reason for running the vacs (IMO-it's not a very good reason, but he tried to think- which is more than can be said for some builders )

    Jason gave you the rundown on your options, so I don't need to address that.

    However, I will say a few words about the Mineral System. It's Goldline's Aqua Rite system repackaged for Bioguard . They're going to tell you that you need to periodically add Bioguard 'Mystery Substance X' (or whatever they call it) for proper operation ($$) -BS!! You can add your own salt (not from Home Depot or other big box store (!) they add an anti-caking agent and don't list it on the ingredients), cya, baking soda and acid (the Substance X is just this stuff premixed, it's expensive and not necessarily in proportions suited for your pool's needs. (Waterbear can tell you a little more about this - he's got the MSDS for this stuff).

    I hope the PB comes soon and finishes your pool!
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    midtngal's Avatar
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    Thanks Jason! Looks like I may not need to do this afterall....they actually showed up this morning and restarted the fill!

    Thanks to you as well waste! I wouldn't give this guy that much credit to say he was thinking! I think it's just more of his stalling tactics for whatever reason. I do absolutely plan on going the BBB route as soon as he gets me started up. I will let him get it running and tell him I'm done with him! He will not make another dime from me! I am assuming that after the start up, all I need to do is test the water (with my prize of duraleigh's test kit!), use Jason's calculator to see what I need to add, then add accordingly??? I did play around with the kit last weekend testing just the tap water to see where I would be starting from. That was kinda fun!

    Thanks again for all you guys' help! I feel very confident in telling this PB to go fly a kite with you all "having my back"!!
    10,700 gal IG vinyl
    Pentair Triton II TR50 sand filter
    Pentair Booster Pump
    Letro Platinum pressure side cleaner
    Emerson 1HP pump
    Bioguard Mineral Springs SWG
    2 skimmers

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    Karen, don't burn bridges when you don't have to do so!
    I feel very confident in telling this PB to go fly a kite with you all "having my back"!! bowdown
    I don't want to cause you any stress, but from what you've described in other posts - you may want to deal with him again, while the pool is under warrantee I sincerely hope that what I'm thinking of will not be a problem (!!!!!), but don't burn any bridges until you are fully satisfied with your pool. I am not going into any detail on what I'm thinking of unless you mention it in a post -- something you had mentioned caught my eye as a possible problem. It probably will not be a problem (!) - but if you notice something ~'not quite right' - ask here and I'll give you my 'take' on it

    I'm sorry (!) - perhaps I should have kept my mouth shut Don't go looking for problems (!) the thing I'm thinking of is MINOR and, if you don't notice it in a week of using the pool, the PB probably did everything right

    CONGRATS on the new pool!!!!!!!!! You know how to care for it and if you have ANY questions - you know where to ask them
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    midtngal's Avatar
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    Alright Waste! You *know* that's not fair!! Of course I'm now looking to see what you could be talking about! Can't you just tell what I might to pay attention to???? I won't burn this bridge with him. I realize I most likely will have to deal with him again, but trust me, I will do everytihing in my power not to! He gives me the "willies" for some reason. I can't really put my finger on it, but I don't trust him for one minute! Besides, if owing him money doesn't put a fire under him, imagine how long it will take to get him to take care of something that he won't make money on! Jeez, this has got to be the most maddening experience of my life! I came home this afternoon to the water being stopped. It's still only slightly above the first step. AAARRRGGGHHH!!
    10,700 gal IG vinyl
    Pentair Triton II TR50 sand filter
    Pentair Booster Pump
    Letro Platinum pressure side cleaner
    Emerson 1HP pump
    Bioguard Mineral Springs SWG
    2 skimmers

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    Karen, you are right that I shouldn't have 'teased' you like that I just didn't want you to tell the PB to '@*&^*&%& off' if you have to use your warrentee to get him to fix the possible problem.

    Take a special look at the floor and the corners - unless you see a problem with them, I'll go back to not saying anything (unless you see a problem)

    I don't want to 'dis' another pool co., but I want you to have a good pool
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    midtngal's Avatar
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    Oh, I see what you're talking about now! It's a kidney-shaped pool, so there's no corners to screw up and as it turned out he took up the liner and smoothed out the floor. I have been like a hawk on the sides and the bottom and nothing really sticks at me right now. The wrinkles that you see have since been taken care of. Here are the pics I took at the time.









    This is pretty much where it sits right now..only a couple more inches of water! I've had teeth pulled that didn't hurt this bad!! I....just...want...it...done. Tell me if you see something here I'm not seeing as far as "issue" down the road.............. As always, I appreciate your input and advice!

    Karen
    10,700 gal IG vinyl
    Pentair Triton II TR50 sand filter
    Pentair Booster Pump
    Letro Platinum pressure side cleaner
    Emerson 1HP pump
    Bioguard Mineral Springs SWG
    2 skimmers

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    Quote Originally Posted by waste
    I
    However, I will say a few words about the Mineral System. It's Goldline's Aqua Rite system repackaged for Bioguard . They're going to tell you that you need to periodically add Bioguard 'Mystery Substance X' (or whatever they call it) for proper operation ($$) -BS!! You can add your own salt (not from Home Depot or other big box store (!) they add an anti-caking agent and don't list it on the ingredients), cya, baking soda and acid (the Substance X is just this stuff premixed, it's expensive and not necessarily in proportions suited for your pool's needs. (Waterbear can tell you a little more about this - he's got the MSDS for this stuff).

    I hope the PB comes soon and finishes your pool!
    Mineral springs beginnings is just salt, cya and borax and dry acid (except in california where it's just salt and cya). Renewal is the same in different proportions (in california they leave out the borax and add alum!). You want plain solar salt or water softener pellets without any iron remover in them. You CAN buy this at home depot or lowes (sorry waste, you are wrong on this one!) If you want to spend more money you can get pool salt. This is just smaller crystals of solar salt but no different in any other way Stay away from food grade salt (fine free flowing crystals). . This is the stuff that has the anti caking agent (yellow prussiate of soda), which is an iron compound and can cause staining. Buy your borax at walmart or the grocery store, your cya and muriatic acid wherever the price is best (SOMETIMES this is at the pool store so check it out!) The borax is optional but an excellent idea. If you want to make adding it easier and don't mind spending the money then you can get proteam supreme or haviland salt support (same procuct and same company, BTW.) This is a pH neutral mix of borax and boric acid so you don't have to worry about adding the muriatic acid to neutralize the pH rise from the borax. You just add enough to bring your borates to 50 ppm!

    If you are lost by all of this don't worry, we are here to help you out every step of the way...just ask and you shall have your answers!

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    midtngal's Avatar
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    Thanks Waterbear! I'm glad to hear there's something I can use in lieu of the muriatic acid. I've been seeing what other folks have said about how strong it is. I'm going to let him do his thing on the first go around and them switch to BBB. Am I correct in that I just need to test to get my numbers and then just accordingly?? Thanks so much for your help!
    10,700 gal IG vinyl
    Pentair Triton II TR50 sand filter
    Pentair Booster Pump
    Letro Platinum pressure side cleaner
    Emerson 1HP pump
    Bioguard Mineral Springs SWG
    2 skimmers

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    Nope, you still need muriatic acid to control pH. I was just talking about aqdding borates to your pool. Plain borax has a high pH but Proteam/Haviland has a borate product that is pH neutral.
    You are still going to need muriatic acid for pH control in your pool (but keeping the TA between 60-80 ppm and keeping 50 ppm borates in the water WILL help minimize your acid usage, particularly in a vinyl pool.)

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    midtngal's Avatar
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    Ahhh, I see. Well that's fine too. Just as long as I don't need the moron PB for any this, I really don't care *how* much it costs!! And don't worry, you'll hear from me if I get confused! Thanks bunches!!
    10,700 gal IG vinyl
    Pentair Triton II TR50 sand filter
    Pentair Booster Pump
    Letro Platinum pressure side cleaner
    Emerson 1HP pump
    Bioguard Mineral Springs SWG
    2 skimmers

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    Waterbear said:
    You CAN buy this at home depot or lowes (sorry waste, you are wrong on this one!) If you want to spend more money you can get pool salt.
    Evan, the Goldline guy told us that the granular salt was labeled 99.xx% pure but was actually only ~97% pure (he said it was the yellow prussiate - because they often store the pallets outside). There was also a post I read that said Lowes (and perhaps others) have the same issue. I'd imagine that the pellets are fine, and I should have specified but Goldline doesn't sell salt and therefore has NO reason to dissuade folks from any source of salt, unless it would have a negative effect on the use of their products. I simply wanted to pass along what I'd heard from 2 separate, and IMO reliable, sources to save any potential problems with a SWCG system

    I hope you know how much I respect and value your input! I don't just make things up, I'm trying to help the folks here not have to deal with a problem that I've heard of

    Karen, sorry for the digression I see nothing wrong with your pool from the pics - maybe your PB isn't as big of a moron as I thought
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Neither Home Depot or Lowes normally carry granular salt. They carry crystals and pellets. I, and many others here, have used both of those without any problems on many occasions.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  15. Back To Top    #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by waste
    Waterbear said:
    You CAN buy this at home depot or lowes (sorry waste, you are wrong on this one!) If you want to spend more money you can get pool salt.
    Evan, the Goldline guy told us that the granular salt was labeled 99.xx% pure but was actually only ~97% pure (he said it was the yellow prussiate - because they often store the pallets outside). There was also a post I read that said Lowes (and perhaps others) have the same issue. I'd imagine that the pellets are fine, and I should have specified but Goldline doesn't sell salt and therefore has NO reason to dissuade folks from any source of salt, unless it would have a negative effect on the use of their products. I simply wanted to pass along what I'd heard from 2 separate, and IMO reliable, sources to save any potential problems with a SWCG system

    I hope you know how much I respect and value your input! I don't just make things up, I'm trying to help the folks here not have to deal with a problem that I've heard of

    Karen, sorry for the digression I see nothing wrong with your pool from the pics - maybe your PB isn't as big of a moron as I thought
    Waste, I agree on the granular salt (which BTW is often sold as pool salt...learned that the hard way when I bought expensive pool salt at a pool store...NOT the one I work at, btw!... and ended up with iron staining) but the solar salt, which is a large crystal salt, IS pure. Also the pellet salt is very pure, usually purer than solar. Interstingly enough, these are the two types of salt that are listed in my Goldline Aqualogic manual as the type to use. I have been using solar salt since the SWG went online except for the one bag of pool salt that I tried and ended up with iron stains where the salt sat before it dissolved and have been dealing with iron staining ever since! Thank goodness for ascorbic acid and Metal Magic!

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    midtngal's Avatar
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    Oh my! You guys are funny!! So, bottom line here---salt will be added by the PB as part of the start-up and when I need it again I can get it from HD or Lowe's (as long as it is pool salt or solar salt) and I'm okay..is that what all this is saying??? If I've read correctly all these months, I shouldn't have to be adding too much salt anyway except to replace what is lost during backwash...correct?? (oops...guess I need to go write down what all the equipment is and add it to my sig! I have a sand filter)

    The pool has been filling all day today and is almost done! There's probably only about 4 or 5 inches of water left to finish it off. I couldn't help myself...I had to at least get in one step deep and OMG that water's cold! Don't have a thermometer yet so I couldn't tell ya how cold, but I guess my original question of whether algae would start or not was a moot point! Algae can't grow in cold water right???

    Oh yeah...Waste..yes, he IS a moron!!
    10,700 gal IG vinyl
    Pentair Triton II TR50 sand filter
    Pentair Booster Pump
    Letro Platinum pressure side cleaner
    Emerson 1HP pump
    Bioguard Mineral Springs SWG
    2 skimmers

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