Brick Coping Issue

[jhalpinjr]

Hi all!,

I am having cracking issues with the mortor between my bricks on the coping of the pool.
The pool is 2 1/2 years old, the builder has already come out twice to "fix" the cracking. Their pool at the store (on display) is 8 yeras old and has no signs of the issues I have.

What do you think? Poor Mixing (wrong consitantcy?) Poor cleaning/prep or shifting? Also how can I remove the concrete that they have left on the bricks? I am assuming muruatic acid (with a brush?), however if I do the small section will I end up having to go all around the pool to keep the brick color the same?

Thank you - Jim

 

[harleysilo]

That's some sloppy "repair" work. Next time they come out hand them a bucket of water and a sponge and tell them to clean up as they go, there is no excuse for that. I'd ask the builder to have his crew come back and clean it.

Sorry I can't help diagnose the underlying problem, but I don't think patching the cracks (with cement/motar/concrete) will last, they'll reform.

 

[duraleigh]

That sure looks like settling/movement of the soil underneath the decking. It will simply re-crack using mortar....I would suggest trying polyurethane caulk forced into the crack instead. It may still seperate but it may last a good deal longer.

Acid will remove the mortar and PROBABLY will not discolor the brick....test it and see.

 

[ConcreteJack]

They poured the deck up against the coping; the two aren't supposed to touch, because when the ground shifts, the deck moves, and if it's poured up to the coping, it will cause the coping mortar to crack. Caulking the cracks in the mortar between the coping bricks won't address the problem, and will likely look worse than the patches they did; make them saw the joint between the deck and the back edge of the coping so that the deck is independent of the coping, and then caulk that joint to keep water from getting under the coping, freezing, and causing the bricks to come loose.

 

[JamesW]

I agree with ConcreteJack, there needs to be an expansion joint between the deck and the coping. It should be about 1/2 to 3/4 inch wide and filled with a flexible caulk.

The deck also moves as the concrete expands and contracts due to temperature changes. With no expansion joint, the concrete puts excessive pressure on the coping causing it to become unbonded and cracked.

 

[chiefwej]

In your picture, what I see is a crack in the deck which continues through the coping mortar joint. I agree that the deck and coping need to separated by a flexible joint to prevent this from happening.

 

[jhalpinjr]

I agree totally- but the PB wont budge. I may end up cutting one myself. I am not sure what to do. I guess a circular saw with a masonry blade? Not sure......

 

[harleysilo]

What is the shape of your pool?

You'll want to use a wet saw to cut this(saw that hooks up to water to keep blade cool and lubricated to extend blades life). You'll need to rent one. You can't really cut a curve either, where 2 cuts intersect is going to be the most difficult.

There's going to be a minimum width of the space you create, i don't know what that measurement is, depends on blade thickness and your ability to cut a straight line, i'd say your looking at least 1/2 inch when your done, maybe more.

 

[jhalpinjr]

Hey Harley,

Its a grecian shape. 1/2" seems really wide. Hmmm How deep do I go? Downe to the dirt? Do I need to seperate the concrete from the mortor joint entirely?

 

[harleysilo]

I think the idea is to completely separate the coping from the deck (I would suggest getting a second or third opinion on that) so yes you would cut completely down to the gravel/dirt. It may be that you can just make one cut so you'd be looking at the width of the blade only. I just don't know how you are going to deal with the corners without over cutting them....meaning where two of your cut lines intersect you have to cut beyond the place where you think you would stop because the saw blade which is round is only cutting to full depth directly under it's center. Maybe they make a concrete blade for a Saw-All or similar tool.

From above by another poster "I agree with ConcreteJack, there needs to be an expansion joint between the deck and the coping. It should be about 1/2 to 3/4 inch wide and filled with a flexible caulk.

The deck also moves as the concrete expands and contracts due to temperature changes. With no expansion joint, the concrete puts excessive pressure on the coping causing it to become unbonded and cracked."

http://www.icscompany.net/rca_blade1.htm

"Applications, Limitations, Expectations:
Masonry & Concrete Cutting
Window and Door Openings:
- Excellent for cutting the 90° inside corner on brick and block
- Not solid concrete
> The diamond brazing is fine, it's the slow speed of the reciprocating saw
> The blade will cut through hard concrete however, because of the slow cutting speed of the saw it will take too long to cut through solid concrete

"

 

[jhalpinjr]

Thank you Harley and all!!!!!!!!!

 

[ConcreteJack]

DO NOT CUT 'ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE DIRT'!!!! The deck likely rests on top of the bond beam, so I'd you cut to the dirt, you'll be hacking away at the top of your pool.

A concrete chainsaw like the ones ICS makes are an excellent tool, but only in the hands of an experienced operator; they are also incredibly expensive to operate if not used properly.

There are many companies that specialize in concrete cutting, just google some of the following, adding your location to help narrow down the results: concrete coring, concrete sawing, concrete cutting. A typical saw kerf is only about 3/8 of an inch thick, which isn't necessarily wide enough for a caulk joint that will last.

Another option would be to replace all of the coping stones with ones that aren't as deep; that will allow you to fix all of the cracks, which if left alone will cause be coping bricks to pop off anyways, and create a proper expansion joint.