Need Help With Electrical Requirements

[dmullen]

We are about to take delivery on a 24' 54" deep AGP that is scheduled to be installed sometime next week. Getting the electricity to the pool is my responsibility and all I have been told is that it works in a normal 120 plug.

I realize it is more complicated than that but I have no idea what to tell an electrician to install for me. The pool has a 2-HP 2-speed pump and is located about 40 feet from the house. What will I need to have quoted for this pool from an electrician? How do they run a line from the house to the backyard, where does it tie in? Would he have to go thru the brick wall on the outside of the house to attach to the breaker? I apologize for all the questions. This is all new to me and I want to make sure I have all my information ready and correct.

What should I expect to pay? (ballpark)

I would like to have additional outlets to use for outdoor lighting as well.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated!

 

[bk406]

Since your going to have an electrician do the work, call one out and go over what you are wanting to install. A competant, licensed electricion can answer your questions and tell you what you need.

 

[dmullen]

Since your going to have an electrician do the work, call one out and go over what you are wanting to install. A competant, licensed electricion can answer your questions and tell you what you need.

I've had two electricians out before for another project in the house and they had two extremely different quotes on what I needed done. I would rather have a good idea of what is required for this pool so I can resonably understand what the electrician would be telling me I need.

I'm guessing there will be trenching, conduit, 120V GFCI circuits, pool bonding? I'm out of my element with this stuff.

I live in Mississippi if that makes a difference with anything.

 

[swimcmp]

The 2 hp is overkill for your pool. You should be able to run it on 240 instead which will make your electric bill cheaper. Get bids from a couple of electricians for what you are wanting to do.

 

[dmullen]

The 2 hp is overkill for your pool. You should be able to run it on 240 instead which will make your electric bill cheaper. Get bids from a couple of electricians for what you are wanting to do.

Thanks for the reply. The 2-hp 2-speed setup comes with the pool in a package deal so I have no choice in that. I guess it is better to have "too much" than not enough.

So you are saying that a 240V GFCI circuit would be more desirable than a 120? The 240 gives more "headroom" so to speak?

 

[swimcmp]

The electric motor will run more effieciently on 240, your electric bill will be cheaper. In this case too much isn't better. A 3/4 hp would be just as good and actually better than the 2 hp. I have 27' pools that are on 3/4 whisperflos and get along perfectly.

 

[mas985]

The electric motor will run more effieciently on 240, your electric bill will be cheaper.

Not true. An electric motor has exactly the same power draw on 240v vs 120v and the efficiency is the same. The amp draw is twice as much on 120v but the power usage is the same.

I guess it is better to have "too much" than not enough.

Not really. There really isn't any up side to oversizing a pump. You will be paying more to the electric company than you really need to. Plus your filtering will not be as good.

 

[Ohm_Boy]

240v vs. 120v will have no affect on your electric bill. The motor will use half the current when wired for twice the voltage, but since the billing is based upon voltage * current, the end result is the same.

If you are using a 2hp pump (which is WAY overkill for your pool, BTW... think 3/4hp), then you are probably looking at 8-10amps or so on a 120V feed. You could get by with #12 wire. You'll need either a GFCI breaker to feed the circuit, or a GFCI receptacle.

If the pump motor will draw more amps than that, you'll need to bump up to a #10 wire, and possibly a 20amp recepticle (the have funny-shaped plugs; one blade is sideways)

And seriously, using that big a motor will add nothing but expense to your electric bill.

 

[dmullen]

The only options available for this pool was a 1.5hp 1speed or the 2hp 2speed pump. You are saying the 2hp pump is going to cost me more and not filter as well? How would it not filter as well? I want to have my information ready when I ask the pool salesman about it.

Also, is everyone thinking the pool is the INTEX listed in my signature...that is not the pool I have coming if that makes any difference. It is a 24' 54" deep aluminum sides, etc.

 

[mas985]

The only option from whom? There are other combo packs which have smaller pumps.

Filters in general will trap more dirt with slower flow rates. But unfortunately with AGP combo packs, manufactures tend to oversize the pump relative to the filter and there isn't a lot you can do about it. If you want a different combo, you have to purchase the filter and pump separately which is more expensive. However, there are ways to work around the "system". Pentair has smaller two speed combos, as well as some of the others, and here is what I would recommend for a 15k pool:

The Pentair PNSD0060DO2260 is a combo pack which combines a 1.5 HP two speed with a 2.3 sq-ft sand filter. Better if you plan on closing the pool and/or tend to have algae issues.

The Pentair PNCC0150OF2160 is a combo pack which combines a 1.5 HP two speed with a 150 sq-ft cartridge filter. Better if you have high electrical rates and/or water restrictions.

The make smaller ones as well but with a 15k pool, it would be better to size to the correct filter and then make adjustments on the pump if needed.

BTW, which combo pack were you considering and why?

Later on if you want to save some more in energy costs and you feel the flow rate and turnover is more than sufficient, you can downsize the pump impeller which doesn't cost all that much. But that is for another day.

 

[dmullen]

The only option from whom? There are other combo packs which have smaller pumps.

Filters in general will trap more dirt with slower flow rates. But unfortunately with AGP combo packs, manufactures tend to oversize the pump relative to the filter and there isn't a lot you can do about it. If you want a different combo, you have to purchase the filter and pump separately which is more expensive. However, there are ways to work around the "system". Pentair has smaller two speed combos, as well as some of the others, and here is what I would recommend for a 15k pool:

The Pentair PNSD0060DO2260 is a combo pack which combines a 1.5 HP two speed with a 2.3 sq-ft sand filter. Better if you plan on closing the pool and/or tend to have algae issues.

The Pentair PNCC0150OF2160 is a combo pack which combines a 1.5 HP two speed with a 150 sq-ft cartridge filter. Better if you have high electrical rates and/or water restrictions.

The make smaller ones as well but with a 15k pool, it would be better to size to the correct filter and then make adjustments on the pump if needed.

BTW, which combo pack were you considering and why?

Later on if you want to save some more in energy costs and you feel the flow rate and turnover is more than sufficient, you can downsize the pump impeller which doesn't cost all that much. But that is for another day.

Thank you for the information. I know absolutely nothing about these pools. My wife and I decided to get one for this summer and went to the local Clearwater Pools and Spas in Brandon, MS to pick out one. I believe the brand is Wilbar but I will find out for sure and the model is the "Dolphin." It is a 24' x 54" pool. They offer 5 "packaged" pool setups from cheapest to highest and we selected the one below the top which had the 1.5HP 1-speed pump but we got "upgraded for free to the 2 Horsepower - 2 Speed Pump and it looks like a 125 square foot cartridge filter. From the information I have received here I need to ask the salesman about a 200 square foot filter and a 1 horsepower 2-speed pump. Maybe I can switch them out somehow. I wish I had posted here earlier and got all this good information before I bought it. Installation isn't scheduled until next week so I have time to switch out the pump and filter if that is possible.

 

[cramar]

Your pump manual should come with some info regarding electrical connection, an electrician will probably need to see that info. Electricians do a wide variety of work and it's not unreasonable for the guy not to have all the specs on a specific pool pump requirements.
That's how my install went anyways, as for trenching and all that, he should be able to give some options on how to get the feed from point A to B.

 

[CSimpson]

Please excuse my being so naive...

But why can't he just plug the thing into and exterior wall receptacle with GFCI protection? If it is only 40 feet away couldn't he just bury an extention cord in conduit and save himself the cost of an electrician?

 

[Highlandreef]

It depends on the equipment draw, for example say his outside circuit is 10 amp, if he exceeds that he will have issues.
As far as the extension cord, that can be dangerous around 15k gallons of water
Especially when one of his loved ones goes digging around to plant flowers and such in order to hide the pool equipment

 

[Durf]

I have a 18x33 AGP and I believe the Pentair cartridge type 2 speed one listed earlier in the thread. I keep it on low and let it run 24 hours a day. It costs me like $10-20 a month in electric. I love the 2 speed ones, you can run them all the time on low and it is cheap. oh and i have a heavy duty extension cord run to it and wrap the end where it plugs in to keep it weather proofed.

 

[bk406]

oh and i have a heavy duty extension cord run to it and wrap the end where it plugs in to keep it weather proofed.

 

[Ohm_Boy]

Please excuse my being so naive...

But why can't he just plug the thing into and exterior wall receptacle with GFCI protection? If it is only 40 feet away couldn't he just bury an extention cord in conduit and save himself the cost of an electrician?

He may be able to, provided that he has an exterior receptacle, and there is enough capacity on the circuit, but a 2hp pump motor should really be on it's own circuit. We would simply recommend that he have a receptacle installed, or have a circuit run to hard-wire the pump.

As for burying an extension cord, that is never an approved application, nor are they approved to be run in conduit. Generally speaking, wire type THHN would be the best for running in conduit, or type UF wire for direct burial.

 

[cramar]

Please excuse my being so naive...

But why can't he just plug the thing into and exterior wall receptacle with GFCI protection? If it is only 40 feet away couldn't he just bury an extention cord in conduit and save himself the cost of an electrician?

There's the right (safe) way and the cheap way, I suspect this method would be violating all applicable building codes. As Ohm_Boy said - you need to have enough capacity on a circuit or else he'll be popping breakers all the time, a dedicated circuit is best, and burying an extension cord is not the norm.

 

[Durf]

Well I used an extension cord an my electrician said it was fine. It has never caused a problem and the outside plug is a gfci

 

[Ohm_Boy]

Extension cords are to be used as a temporary wiring connection only. Use as a permanent wiring fixture is prohibited, thus burial, conduit installation, or direct attachment to a building is not an approved installation. General-use cords aren't rated for in-ground installation anyway. Additionally, one must ensure that any extension cords used are made of large enough wire to carry the load.