Getting Finished - (Pool Build Central FL)

[Karl]

Hello everyone. Well, the pool bug has bit me after I gave up a couple years ago due to the uncertain economy. I am getting the ball rolling to have a pool built and I've just scheduled some appointments for bids. I'll do my best to keep things fresh and current in this thread. I've included a basic list below of what I am looking for. Feel free to critique everything and PLEASE ask questions. I'll upload a drawing from my last endeavor a couple years ago when I decided not to build a pool.

Thanks in advance for your inputs!

KARL

THE POOL
15' x 30' free-form, with 6 Person oval spa (glass block spill over, air blower, 6 ea therapy jets)
Formed cantilever edge, pebble tech type finish, beach area w/ umbrella stub
Multicolor LED Lighting (1 in Pool, 1 in Spa)
Paramount PCC2000 system or equivalent
Salt chlorination system (Intellichlor IC 40 or equivalent)
Multi-speed pump for energy savings (Intelliflow?)
DE Filter (48SF)
400,000 BTU Master Temp heater or equivalent
Rainbow (Pentair) chlorinator (to augment salt system during wet season)
Wireless remote operation (to control spa, lights, heater, and whatever else)
Lifesaver Black Mesh Pool Fence
Screened Enclosure (Mansard roof style)

Wish list items:
Heliocol Solar system (8ea 4x12 panels)
Wireless Remote Automation

 

[lbridges]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Looks great. Based on the interview results when I was thinking of building, and asking everybody I knew, avoid Aqua-Blue as your PB. Maybe bad luck on their part, but I could NOT find a single satisfied customer.

 

[Brentr]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Welcome Karl, please post pics of your new pool construction. I love your layout.

 

[Karl]

Re: Update #1 New Pool Build- Central Florida

I interviewed Builder #1 this past weekend ... the design looks totally different than the one I posted earlier in this thread. It has different elevation features in the back with planters in a free form pool design. The spa in this design resides in the back left area. This builder uses Hayward products as its main line ... I am curious on how Hayward stacks up against Pentair/Intelliflow product lines. (Feedback welcome on this topic!) I've had hayward products in a previous IG pool and was wondering if they worked the bugs out of their DE housings and pump impellar housings. I expect to get a bid/ designupdate from this builder very soon and will make another post when I hear from them.

All the Best,

Karl

 

[Brentr]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Karl I have a mixture of stuff. My PB believes that the starite pump is a very good pump. He also liked the Hayward sand filter and he put in the Aquarite SWG. I went with this and have no problems so far. If you went with all pentair you get a 3 yr warranty.

 

[lbridges]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

I think maybe a PM to some of the people in the industry, folks that see enough product in a year to make up for many individual owners, is your best bet. Try someone like PoolGuyNJ (Scott), or simicrintz (Bruce), etc.

Based on my readings, and I have almost zero cross platform experience, Hayward is a good product, but a touch below Pentair and Jandy. Like I said, I don't have enough experience to factually back up what I just said - but maybe just throwing it out there will generate enough feedback to serve your needs.

 

[Brentr]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Good suggestions lbridges

 

[PoolGuyNJ]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Pentair and Sta-Rite are the same company, Like Chevy and GCM trucks.

Pentair gear tends to be slightly more costly but also tends to have longer MTBF period and are easier to work on. The better engineered product line over all. They also have much better vendor support for techs and end users.

I avoid Hayward gear when I can though I do still like the venerable Super Pump (over 3 million made!). Never liked the Super II, Northstar, or Tristar pumps, the older heaters had their share of reliability issues and the new ones are a PITA to work on. The sand filters have cheap up-pipes that like to crack, the multiports don't last, and the tank is a little narrower than I think they should be for each size class. The DE filters, when purchased with a multiport as a package, get a 4 position, not a 6 position. It's just cheaper up front but costs more in the long run.

The LED lights are almost comparable but again, Pentair wins because they engineered a special lens that distributes the light more evenly and uses 15 watts less power.

The products that came from the Gold Line acquisition are by and large, top quality though I have heard much of the No Cell Power issue. Someone actually made a web site dedicated to it. The frequency of it being brought up seems to have relented some, possible because Hayward made an improvement or possibly because of the site.

Scott

 

[Karl]

PB#1 Design is In! New Pool Build- Central Florida

I interviewed PB #2 over the past weekend and am waiting on a final design and quote. In the meantime, I just received a VERY nice design from PB#1 and I am pleased to share it with everyone. Yes! That would be FIRE next to the spa ... has an amazing look to it. With this particular PB, he will go either all Hayward or all Pentair for me. I am indifferent at this point, but maybe I can be convinced from some educated input of my fellow forum members? I am leaning toward some type of automation and I am impressed with the Pentair Easytouch w/ Wireless Remote. On the flip side we have brutally hot, humid, salty weather in the summer and corrosion is a concern of mine. The PB would use the Pentair VS 3050 in either a Hayward or Pentair automated system that he would install. The pool would be approx 15 x 31, spa would fit six, and he'd be running gas chase lines for me to the fire features (of course), to include an outlet for a gas grill :-D . The raised beam in the back would transition for 6" to 12 " at the highest point. We are considering making the spa a more oval shape and brining it forward a foot or 2 to make room for more planting area. The screened enclosure would be a bronzed masard style. We meet with PB#1 once again for "tweaking" the design this weekend. I welcome your comments, concerns, and feel free to get technical ... I don't mind at all!,

Sincerely,

Karl

 

[PoolGuyNJ]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

With that shape spa, getting six people in there might get a bit crowded. The fire bowls will be hot seats.

Get electronic ignition for the bowls. Manual is a little bit of PITA and has singed the hair and eyebrows of some not being careful, usually after a few adult beverages.

Using all Pentair gets you a 3 year warranty. I am not sure if a dealer for Hayward needs to be Totally Hayward to get the extended warranty but it's not like I would ever consider them anyway.

The EasyTouch would allow you to use the iS10 spa side controller. This would allow you to speed up or slow down the jets on demand in addition adjusting the heat, turning on the lights, fire pits, etc... from in the spa. Pentair may release the next generation of spa side control, the Spa Command by the time you are ready (it's close).

Get everything in writing. If it wasn't written, it wasn't said. Assume NOTHING! Lets avoid and :grrrr: so there is more of this and this

Scott

 

[Karl]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Thanks for your sage advice, Scott!

So ... going totally Pentair gets the 3yr warranty, very interesting ... PB informed me that electronic ignition controller is a bit spendy for spa-side flambe effects. He advised that the good ol' manual valve method is a less costly option. We head out to PB's showroom tomorrow for tweaking the design (making spa more oval shaped!) and taking a look at some pool videos and product displays. I appreciate the advice on getting everything in writing too.

Karl

 

[Karl]

It's a Go!!!!! New Pool Build- Central Florida

After much hemming, hawing, and contemplation ... the BOSS and I decided on a pool design and pool builder. In the end, it was pretty much a no brainer after several interviews. This PB was was very straightford and answered all of our questions and concerns honestly without hesitation. After the interview, he took us to pools that he had built that had options that we selected ... very cool. None of the other PB's in our interviews went that far in trying to get our business; it was a pleasant personal touch. The pool will reside in the backyard which has a nearly true south exposure. Permits have been submitted and good 'ol HOA paperwork too. I expect to see a hole dug in the ground within 30days (fingers crossed). Expect pictures as the work progresses. One last Note: The PB will be adding a small bench seat in the pool's small niche to the right of the spa.

I've listed many of the details and features below:

16x30 Concrete IG 6 ft max depth Pool w/spa and Fire Pots
Finished with Premix Marbletite, Freestone Series (natural tumbled, small pebble) Color: Panama
Waterline/beam/fire pot tile is 6" Noble p/n NVSA668 "Blue China"
Going all Pentair: VS3050, EasyTouch Wireless Remote, IC40 Chlorinator, Intellibrite Pool & Spa LED lights, Master Temp 400,000 BTU Heater, and Pentair FNSP60 DE Filter
Rainbow Model 320 Chlorinator (for added insurance)
Jandy 36" Sheer Descent (centered on back beam)
Heliocol Solar (others may be more efficient but this has the highest wind rating in the event of a dreaded hurricane)
27'x50' mansard style screen enclosure in a bronze patina color

Feel free to comment, critique, and ask questions. I appreciate Scott's (PoolGuyNJ) inputs about the potential "hot seats"!

Karl

 

[Brentr]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Can't wait to see pics of your pool build, however I liked your first design better.

 

[susa]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

considering the amount of plant material in the design, have you given any thought to what happens on windy days, unless the plants are outside the pool screen enclosure ? if inside, on rainy days, you will have ....umm.... visitors, usually on the bottom the next morning.

 

[Brentr]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

considering the amount of plant material in the design, have you given any thought to what happens on windy days, unless the plants are outside the pool screen enclosure ? if inside, on rainy days, you will have ....umm.... visitors, usually on the bottom the next morning.

Good point susa, I am no expert on planters however we have large pots with palms in them and on very windy days a couple of them topple over making a mess. You can see a pic in the sig bar.

 

[PoolGuyNJ]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Use decorative rocks and not mulch in the planters.

Please get the electronic ignition for the fire pits. You won't regret it.

All three major equipment manufacturers have extended warranty programs for new pools. Some dealers may even extend it.

Depending on the enclosure, you may have engineering issues with the fire bowls.

I am kind of surprised your PB isn't using Pentair's sheers. Not a biggie, just a surprise.

I suggest putting an iS-10 spa side controller in the spa. You can control the water features, pump speed, heater and temperature, light shows, and fire pits from in the spa. The wireless units are water resistant, not water proof.

Specify Schedule 40 pressure rated pipe, not flex pipe for everything but the spa returns. Flex is fine when encased in concrete for pressure applications but with suction lines, can collapse and in pressure applications, stretches and expands, eventually failing. I have also seen termites eat it.

Use at least 2.5" pipes for the suction lines and 2" for the returns, especially at the spa where higher flow rates are the norm.

I like Waterway Poly Storm jets for the spa. Lots of variety and they are interchangeable from position to position. You can buy additional varieties of jet inserts. They are easy to change.

I prefer the Quad 80 DE when paired with the IntelliFlo pumps for the added flow rates/ The Clean and Clear Plus 520 cartridge filter is also an excellent alternative.

While some of this will cost a bit more, I am a firm believer in doing it once and doing it right.

Scott

 

[Karl]

Pre-Pre Site Prep New Pool Build- Central Florida

My PB informed me that things will start sometime this week. I spent a gorgeous Saturday demolishing floating deck with my 4yr old grandson's help. In the meantime, here are a few pics of the pool build site in my backyard. Once things get rolling this week, I'll follow with a few more pics.

Scott, Your advice is invaluable, and I appreciate it. While your concern with the fire bowls are duly noted, the top of the enclosure will be 12-13 feet high. No "rock concert" height flames here!! Decorative rocks/recylcled rubber mulch will be the rule. It's the same stuff I had in my previous pools landscape and it worked out great. As for the electric igniter ... I'm still leaning toward not getting it, electronic ignitions don't last here in Florida ... my BBQ grill is testimony to that. Thanks for the tips on plumbing the pool and spa. I am certain that my builder uses 2" Sched 40; not so sure on the 2.5" pipes for the suction lines.

Karl

 

[lbridges]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

I can't speak to the "need" for 2.5" pipes on the suction, but I can say the total flow restriction on the input side of the pump should be less than the output side of the pump. This helps reduce the possibility of a noisy pump. Forum members like mas985 could explain it in technical terms, but I can tell you I've seen it first hand. On a noisy pump system cranking down on an output valve (assuming they have one), to put in more restriction on that side, can quiet down a noisy pump.

Now you can effect this by different pipe sizes or maybe separate drain and skimmer lines back to a valve at the pump - whatever, but again, less total flow restriction on the suction side compared to the pressure side makes for a happy pump.

 

[Karl]

Re: New Pool Build- Central Florida

Makes logical sense to have a greater "cross-section area" on the total suction plumbing vice the output side after hearing your explanation. Suffice it to say, I know that I'll have at least a skimmer and 2 main drains on the suction side. I'll be asking my PB what he does to ensure the pump does not "starve" for water Thanks!
Karl

 

[Karl]

Let The Digging Begin: New Pool Build- Central Florida

It's been a busy week with things progressing very quickly with my pool dig. I'll let the pics speak for themselves. Feel free to comment!

Karl