IntelliFlo VS 3050 does not turn on correctly

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DanFL

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Dec 12, 2010
4
I've search the forum and have not found this particular problem, but it does appear that other users are having issues with this same pump. In April 2010, I installed an IntelliFlo VS-3050 to replaced a burned out Pentair 1.5 HP single speed pump. I've been happy with the pump overall, especially the huge savings in my electric bill. When I replaced it, I wired it into the existing mechanical timer that was running the old single speed pump. Up until recently, I have not had any issues. About a month ago, I noticed a few times that the pump was not running. When I checked the pump, it was powered on, but the motor was not running, so I would just manually restart it by pressing the Start button, but never figured out why it wasn't running.

Now, this past week, I've noticed almost every morning, when the pump turns on, it comes up in some unknown state, running at a slower speed than the normal Speed 2 setting where I leave it. I can tell because one of my water features is dribbling over the edge of the pool instead of shooting in to the pool as it should. I have to manually go out and press the Stop button, then press Start again (it usually won't respond to pressing a different speed button until I Stop, then Restart). On 2 separate occasions, it turned on in the lower speed with the LED flashing an error code that indicated "Excessive Drive Temperature", which I found hard to believe when the pump had only been on for about 2 minutes and the ambient temperature was about 40 degrees (yeah, it gets cold here in Florida sometimes).

So I called Pentair tech support and they told me that my timer is probably not turning off both poles at the same time, which could be causing the problem, and told me I should be controlling it with an automation system ($600 - $1000!!!). But according to the manual, my setup should be perfectly acceptable. Does this sound reasonable, since I've been running trouble free on this timer since April? Anyone else seen this type of behavior with the VS 3050? Thanks for your inputs.
 
Did you actually connect a line meter to measure that both legs were supplying 120v for a combined 240v and you have it connected via dedicated 20amp breaker ?

From the Pentair quide:
The IntelliFlo VS-3050 should be wired line side, i.e. directly to a 220V to 240V circuit breaker with a minimum 20 amp rating...
Click to expand...

We have almost identical pumps (mine is VF) and the wiring directions are the same. Not sure if your pump has this feature but the VF will *not run* if there is any problem on the supply side of power or voltage.
 
The controller for the VF is very different. from the VS-3050. The VS has no timer, just 4 settable speeds. It would remember the last speed when power as removed.

I assume this was running correctly at one point and then this started happening.

What timer are you using and how old is it?

How old is the pump?

Scott
 
Yes, it's been working fine since I installed it (brand new) in April 2010. The original mechanical timer in an Intermatic T21004R and was installed when the pool was built in Sept 2006. I did not measure the line voltages since the old pump was working since Sept 2006 and the new pump was working since April 2010, so it seemed unlikely that the power is suddenly bad when I am not having any other power issues with the rest of the house. Yes, it is running through it's own dedicated 40 amp breaker.

This morning, it did the same thing (came up in slower speed with LED flash 2 times - over temp alarm). When I tried to get it to start again, it would not hold prime. Once the pot filled all the way, it lost suction and drained out, then started again. I let it sit for 10 minutes and tried again and it finally got back up & running. So is the whole pump going bad on me?
 
Sounds like you've got a leak that's allowing air into the system. I'd recommend finding and fixing that first before blaming the pump too much. Once it's primed it should stay primed unless you open the system (i.e. pump strainer basket lid).
 
I had to go out of town Monday night for work, and we were expecting a hard freeze here in Central Florida, so I removed the off pin from the timer so the pump would stay running all night. When I returned home late Tuesday, the pump was off, but power was still applied to the pump (as I would expect, since the timer could not turn it off with the off pin removed). So I turned it back on manually Tuesday night and set it to speed 1. When I checked it this morning, it was still running, but it was in that same odd state that it usually turns on in. None of the speed setting lights were lit (so it was no longer in Speed 1) and the LED was flashing 2 times (indicating "excessive drive temperature). So this thing is turning itself off and going into this odd state independent of the mechanical timer turning it off & on.
 

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Dan, I found you post regarding your VS3050. I am having the same issue. The only common element that I can determine that triggers my pump to either stop is go into the very slow RPM mode w/ the buttons locked up is when the temp falls below 40 degrees. I called Pentair and they told me to override the freeze protection by holding any of the 4 speed buttons for at least 3 seconds. The problem is that does not work. Can you tell me how you ended up fixing your issue? Thx, Knoxville
 
I have read that the Pentair VS pump controllers are very touchy to voltage surge. Your description suggests that your Pentair pump is powered by the timer, when it it should be wired directly to the timer breaker (or line side of the timer), such that the mechanical timer is not turning off power to the pump. The pump has its own timer so the need for a mechaincal timer (and its surge issues) is no longer required.

I suggest changing the pump's power tap to the line side (up stream of the timer), so the pump's controller is powered 24 hrs per day. But, you may have already suffered some electronic dame to the controller form the daily mechanncal timer on/off
 
I, too, am having problems with my IntelliFlow VS-3050. This is my first post on TFP (yes, I'm new), having discovered it looking for answers to my problem a few days ago. My problems will be stated in a subsequent post. First...

To "Knoxville": Did you ever here back from "Dan" in Florida, and how he fixed his VS-3050 pump problem? It appears that he didn't come back with any responses (unless I don't know, yet, how to use this TFP forum). And....

To "donaldm823": I'm looking at the User's and Installation Guide for the IntelliFlow VS-3050, and how to connect the pump to an AC power source, in case you or anyone else is interested in any quotes from it. My system (both the VS-3050 Variable Speed Programmable Pump and the "brains"--an AutoPilot Pool Pilot Digital wall unit) is powered by one old-fashioned timer. I'm beginning to learn that "continuous power" must be supplied to the pump by connecting it directly to the circuit breaker, that's when using an automated system such as IntelliTouch, EasyTouch, SunTouch and IntelliComm, according to this Guide. So I think one of my problems is that one timer is controlling BOTH. Again, my problem later.

But I will say this now: I'm also beginning to believe that these systems are like computers--they have a mind of their own, at times.

I"ll be off-line 'til a day or two from now, but would appreciate any responses.

Bob
 
[quote="

To "donaldm823": I'm looking at the User's and Installation Guide for the IntelliFlow VS-3050, and how to connect the pump to an AC power source, in case you or anyone else is interested in any quotes from it. My system (both the VS-3050 Variable Speed Programmable Pump and the "brains"--an AutoPilot Pool Pilot Digital wall unit) is powered by one old-fashioned timer. I'm beginning to learn that "continuous power" must be supplied to the pump by connecting it directly to the circuit breaker, that's when using an automated system such as IntelliTouch, EasyTouch, SunTouch and IntelliComm, according to this Guide. So I think one of my problems is that one timer is controlling BOTH. Again, my problem later.

But I will say this now: I'm also beginning to believe that these systems are like computers--they have a mind of their own, at times.

I"ll be off-line 'til a day or two from now, but would appreciate any responses.

Bob[/quote]

I also have an autopilot and it was connected to the load side of the mechanical timer with my old pump per the autopilot manual. My pool vendor, when he replaced my old Pentair pump with my new VS 011018 left the SWG power connection as it was, BUT connected the new VS pump to the line side (upstream of the timer). So now the pump is controlled by the pump's internal timer and the SWG power is controlled by the mechanical timer. I need to periodically ensure both time clocks are on the same time so the SWG does not try to power up when the pump is not running. Of course the SWG has a no flow safety feature buy that's the backup

True the owner's manual says
NOTE: When the IntelliFlo® is started and stopped by removing power with a relay or timer,
a two-pole device should be used to apply and remove power to both POWER LINE TERMINALS.

that implies you can use a timer, but most mechanical timers (2 pole) are a littler sloppy in removing power at the same time without some voltage spike. I guess you can buy one of those fancy digital 2 pole timers. But my pool store siad he had sold many VS pumps and hooked them up in the fashion I described without issue.
 
Electronic timers are no better, FWIW. They still use relays. The control of the relay is digitally controlled, not the actual make and break of the connectors.

The VS-3050, one of the original Intelliflow pumps, does not have a timer and as such was ill suited for stand alone use. It has been superseded with a newer VS that does have a timer built in. The VF and the SVRS, models are still available today. Prior to the newer VS, I would not have spec'ed it without a Pentair automation system in place. Now I can with the newer model VS.

Scott
 
Hmm, I wonder if this may be a similar problem I had have with the Intelliflo VF I have on my pool. It would shut off randomly (happened maybe 3 times in the 3/4 of a year I've owned it. I have the pump powered downstream from an intermatic mechanical timer; however, I use the pump's own timer. The on and off pins are both removed from the intermatic, so the timer never shut the pump off.

I shouldn't have any surges in voltage in his configuration I'm assuming, yet I still had the pump shut off on its own a few times. Maybe a problem with the pumps? Or is it the way I have it hooked up? (The person who installed it hooked it up that way).
 
With no pins in the timer, it is the same as getting power before the timer. The contractors are just passing the current and assuming they are in decent shape and not burnt, with have no bearing. The occasional outage is likely a power hit.

Scott
 
The "no pins in timer" is starting to give me an idea with my Intermatic timer which is powering BOTH my
VS-3050 vari-speed pump and my AutoPilot Pool Pilot Digital wall unit. The timer's been set to come ON at 4 AM and go OFF at 12 noon in the So. Cal Desert, and worked successfully all through the summer months 'til now.

Pool water has been around 40-something degrees lately. I have learned from this forum that my particular pump has NO internal timer and that it's the cheaper version (fewer bells and whistles). So here's my problem:

Lately the pump has not been coming on at 4 AM. Sure, the Pool Pilot Digital comes on but the red light blinks with the panel reading something like "NO FLOW, CHECK (I forgot the next word--could be PUMP)". And when I look down at the 4 speed buttons on the pump's panel, I sometimes see the red "alarm" light lit, and other times not lit.

Most of the time I can just push "start" on the pump and it will start right up--then the red blinking light on the Pool Pilot Digital stops blinking and I finally get a reading of, say, 3000 ppm, which is good. But I have noticed that the clock on this Pool Pilot keeps losing time (and I replaced the battery inside this unit not long ago). Being a real novice at this stuff I really don't know the reason for the clock inside this Pool Pilot Digital anyway. Maybe if I pulled the ON/OFF pins from the Intermatic timer and allowed power to be ON all the time this, then, would allow the Pool Pilot Digital to actually control the ON and the OFF of the pump. But all this stuff I don't know. Perhaps it's like most else--trial and error. Keep trying different things 'til something finally works. My real concern (as well as the concern of my pool maintenance man) is if the water gets down to freezing--and if my pump is not coming on either at the 4AM ON time or automatically ON with the internal auto-ON sensor (called the Tri-Sensor?), sensing a temperature drop down to, say, 38 ( before it reaches 32) then some of my system could be damaged by the freezing water--even in the desert.

Someone said, earlier, that the Pentair Company told them that if they hold down the four (4) speed buttons on the pump for 3 seconds, it should shut off "something (I forgot what)" but it's my understanding that if you hold down those four buttons at the same time (for 4 seconds), it just resets the pump back to its default settings. I DO NOT believe it shuts off the auto-ON sensor that detects the temp for near-freezing water. I would expect the auto-ON (for freezing) to be included in the default factory settings. Again, I'm new at all this and can only go by what I read in the booklets and on this forum. And I have not had good luck in getting qualified service people out to my pool who fully understand the operation of my salt-water system. Finally...

Am I on the right track in keeping constant power to BOTH my pump and my wall unit 24 hours a day?

If I install a new battery in my AutoPilot wall unit (Salt Chlorine Generator Model DIG-220), will this somehow turn ON and turn OFF my pump? I wonder if my DIG-220 might be faulty?

Is there a tester to test the Tri-Sensor (near the salt cell), to make sure it's working properly?

Age of all these components are about 18 months.

Bob
 
I have the vs 3050 pump installed with approx 7 year old pentair and jandy equipment. My pump cannot communicate with my in house remote. I am told I need the RS8 upgrade kit. Has anyone had this installed? Or installed it themselves? Will it ultimately allow me to control my pump at the remote and will I be able to program different speeds at different times. I have spoke with jandy and pentair and get conflicting reports. I have an issue with the pump in freeze protect mode, it turns on at 40 degrees(pump protection) my remote in the house I have freeze protection come on at 36 degrees, so due to the communication issues the pump won't move any water it will stay powered on. The pump will only work at it's last setting. When I try to hit any button on pump control panel I sometimes get the error code blinking at me. Any help or advice I would greatly appreciated.
 

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