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Thread: BBB and SWGC

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    BBB and SWGC

    I'm interested in using the BBB method w/ my SWGC pool. I've searched the site, but haven't really found a how to on this. any help will be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks in advanced!
    IG Liner
    SWG
    15000 Gallons

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    MikeInTN's Avatar
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    The BBB method stands for Bleach,Borax, and Baking Soda. The Bleach is nothing more than liquid chlorine, and your SWCG should provide enough chlorine for sanitation. If you should need to shock, you would need to supplement your SWCG with bleach to get the FC level up to shock level. Borax is used to raise pH, with a small rise in Total Alkalinity, and Baking Soda is used to raise both pH and Total Alkalinity.

    So, first things first. To implement BBB, you need to post the following readings so we know what your water chemistry is like right now: Free Chlorine (FC), Combined Chloramines (CC), pH (pH), Total Alkalinity (TA), Stabilizer, which is cynauric acid (CYA), Calcium Hardness (CH) if you have a plaster or concrete pool. You'll use your SWCG and the other two B's to bring your water chemistry into balance and maintain it there. If you don't have a test kit, it's highly recommended to get one so you don't have to rely on the pool store getting it right. The two kits that are most recommended are the TF100 test kit or the Taylor K-2006 kit, of which the cheapest price I've found for it is here. Both test kits use the FAS-DPD chlorine test so that you can accurately measure chlorine levels over 5ppm. Another handy tool to have is either the bleachcalc program or JasonLion's pool calculator so you can figure out how much of each B to add, if needed.
    24' x 52" AGP - approx 13,500 gallons
    Pentair Optiflo 1 hp/2sp pump w/ Swimpro Voyager 150 sq ft cartridge filter
    Intex 8110 SWCG
    "Fear the Schnauz!"

  3. Back To Top    #3
    There are some links in my signature that will help you on your way! Read the stickies... Mikes stated things very well!

    With an SWG, you will only need to use bleach occasionally to shock, and will probably need to add acid weekly or so, as the SWGs tend to cause a pH rise. Many with SWGs never need to shock, except at opening or closing!

    8000 gallon 20' x 48" round vinyl frame pool, 12" sand filter (don't have the specs on the pump), TF100 test kit
    Handy Links: PoolMath, TF-100 Test Kit, Pool School, CYA-Chlorine Chart
    "Shock" is a process, not a product!

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    Join Date
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    Poughquag, NY
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    And tell us where you are! PH rise in SWG pools seems to be somewhat regional. Here in the Northeast, I never have had to acid to my pool in the last 3 years thanks to acid rain.

    The other thing to remember is that the CYA specifications that your SWG manufacturer recommends are RIGHT! There are many threads discussing this, but your SWG just won't run right unless you are in the right CYA range specified. You can add CYA directly (sometimes called conditioner), or you can build it up using DiChlor or pucks. If you are putting an SWG on an existing pool, it is very possible that you already have more than enough CYA, so you will need to test.
    20 x 40 vinyl IG. SWG. Solar. Ikeric VS pump.

  5. Back To Top    #5
    Thanks all for the responses. I'll post my readings when I get back tomorrow (on travel). I live in Suffolk Virginia, 30 min west of Virginia Beach.
    IG Liner
    SWG
    15000 Gallons

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    Join Date
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    Spring,Tx
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    We just filled the new pool about 2 1/2 weeks ago. My PB stopped by a few days ago and dumped in the salt, we are at 3300 ppm and the SWG is on-line. I did get a spike in chlorine the next day. We did have a puck in the skimmer, so I chucked that and turned the % on the SWG way back to about 5%. Does this sound like the right thing to do?
    16k I.G. Gunite, SWCG, 1.5hp Hayward Pump, .75hp Booster Pump w/ Hayward Phantom Cleaner,Hayward C5025, swimclear cartridge filter, 400k Hayward heater.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Just keep an eye on the FC level and adjust the percentage as needed. Early evening is a good time to test FC, as it is generally lowest at the end of direct sunlight. 5% might have been a little bit of an over correction, but you can test tomorrow and adjust as needed.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Jun 2007
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    Spring,Tx
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    55
    Thanks Jason, I kept the SWG @ 5% all day and my total chlorine is still pretty dark yellow. I may cut down my run time tomorrow, and keep tabs on it. I really need to invest in the TFP 100 kit, and will shortly so I can post all my #'s. Y'all got me thinking about the CL #'s on that new plaster. I'll keep ya updated, I'll be out of town through Saturday. Update you then, I also need to add the finished product pic's. I just want to get the palms planted and some sod first !!

    Thanks again for the help.

    Stakeman
    16k I.G. Gunite, SWCG, 1.5hp Hayward Pump, .75hp Booster Pump w/ Hayward Phantom Cleaner,Hayward C5025, swimclear cartridge filter, 400k Hayward heater.

  9. Back To Top    #9
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeInTN
    The BBB method stands for Bleach,Borax, and Baking Soda. The Bleach is nothing more than liquid chlorine, and your SWCG should provide enough chlorine for sanitation. If you should need to shock, you would need to supplement your SWCG with bleach to get the FC level up to shock level. Borax is used to raise pH, with a small rise in Total Alkalinity, and Baking Soda is used to raise both pH and Total Alkalinity.

    So, first things first. To implement BBB, you need to post the following readings so we know what your water chemistry is like right now: Free Chlorine (FC), Combined Chloramines (CC), pH (pH), Total Alkalinity (TA), Stabilizer, which is cynauric acid (CYA), Calcium Hardness (CH) if you have a plaster or concrete pool. You'll use your SWCG and the other two B's to bring your water chemistry into balance and maintain it there. If you don't have a test kit, it's highly recommended to get one so you don't have to rely on the pool store getting it right. The two kits that are most recommended are the TF100 test kit or the Taylor K-2006 kit, of which the cheapest price I've found for it is here. Both test kits use the FAS-DPD chlorine test so that you can accurately measure chlorine levels over 5ppm. Another handy tool to have is either the bleachcalc program or JasonLion's pool calculator so you can figure out how much of each B to add, if needed.
    MikeInTN:

    Here are my readings from the local pool store. They use a drop kit:

    FC: 1.1
    CC: 1.6 (It's listed as Total Chlorine on my pool sheet)
    pH: 7.43
    TA: 112
    CYA: 19

    Is calcium needed for an IG liner?

    Any assistance will be greatly appreciated.
    IG Liner
    SWG
    15000 Gallons

  10. Back To Top    #10
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    May 2007
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    Silver Spring, MD
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    Your CYA is low. Check your SWG manual to see what they recommend. 60 to 80 is common for SWG, though some manufacturers are different. As your CYA comes up you will need to maintain a higher FC level, which the SWG will have an easier time doing so this will happen almost automatically. Just keep an eye on the FC level and adjust the SWG percentage/run time as needed.

    I would aim for a TA of 80, but there isn't any rush to bring it down. If you have problems with the PH drifting up then bringing the TA down will help.

    There is no need for CH with a vinyl liner, though it doesn't hurt. As long as it isn't very high you will be fine.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  11. Back To Top    #11
    MikeInTN's Avatar
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    Middle Tennessee
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion
    Your CYA is low. Check your SWG manual to see what they recommend. 60 to 80 is common for SWG, though some manufacturers are different. As your CYA comes up you will need to maintain a higher FC level, which the SWG will have an easier time doing so this will happen almost automatically. Just keep an eye on the FC level and adjust the SWG percentage/run time as needed.

    I would aim for a TA of 80, but there isn't any rush to bring it down. If you have problems with the PH drifting up then bringing the TA down will help.

    There is no need for CH with a vinyl liner, though it doesn't hurt. As long as it isn't very high you will be fine.
    Only thing I would add..you can get CYA at your pool store, online, or sometimes at Lowe's or Home Depot (one lady on here actually found it at Walmart, too!). It's usually labeled as either a conditioner or stabilizer, so check the list of ingredients for cyanuric acid; that's the stuff you want. Use either the bleachcalc program or JasonLion's pool calculator to figure how much you'll need, put it in a knee-high pantyhose, and either hang it by one of your returns, or put it in the skimmer basket. I probably would put 1/2 to 3/4 of the calculated amount in at first and let it dissolve, and then check your level after a couple of days, reason being the only way to lower your CYA if you get it too high is to replace part of your water in your pool. Much easier to bring it up a bit, check the level, then bring it up a bit more until you get the level right.
    24' x 52" AGP - approx 13,500 gallons
    Pentair Optiflo 1 hp/2sp pump w/ Swimpro Voyager 150 sq ft cartridge filter
    Intex 8110 SWCG
    "Fear the Schnauz!"

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