Rain

[Jaywalker]

I think I'm getting too close to the problem.

In semi-arid south central Texas, rain is something most people greet with joy. I just think, "Dang. Now I have to add more muriatic acid."

 

[PoolGuyNJ]

Here, the rain tends to lower pH.

Scott

 

[PaulR]

Whether rain raises or lowers pH seems to vary a lot. The rainwater itself is typically acidic; but there's often an aeration effect from drops hitting the surface of the water. The net result is probably consistent for any given pool, but not predictable based on anyone else's experience.
--paulr

 

[geekgranny]

Our semi-arid central Texas hasn't been very arid this winter and spring. I've never experienced so many cloudy/rainy days, for so long, since I came to Texas in 1971.

The rain usually doesn't change my pH a whole lot. Starting at 7.5 last week and about 6" of rain, the pH was 7.8 yesterday. I've never had rain lower the pH here. It usually doesn't change the pool or raises it slightly.

I wonder if all the dust we typically have in the air, all altitudes, captured by the rain as it comes down, helps to raise the pH some.

gg=alice

 

[Jaywalker]

True enough - "semi-arid South Texas," only because for three years or so it was definitely "arid," and now seems to me to be "semi-tropical." I'd prefer the rain to be a bit more acidic, since I truly dislike adding acid; adding base would be much more pleasant.

 

[geekgranny]

True enough - "semi-arid South Texas," only because for three years or so it was definitely "arid," and now seems to me to be "semi-tropical." I'd prefer the rain to be a bit more acidic, since I truly dislike adding acid; adding base would be much more pleasant.

I've spent some time in the "jungle" (technically a "semi-tropical rain forest") in the Yucatan and boy can some of the plants get huge and prolific. Pothos ivy, Epipremnum aureum and actually native to southeastern Asia, can cover a bungalow in a few weeks. When we have wetter than normal years, here, our cross-timbers forest grows poison ivy, and other vines, that can rival some of the vines in a jungle; almost scary. I expect the poison ivy in the unmanaged, wild part of our property to be gynormous this year. I haven't hit the poison ivy around the fences of our "managed" yards, yet, but it is already looking like it does at the end of a wetter than normal summer. Some are reaching 10-12 feet with huge leaves. Most people wouldn't even recognize it as poison ivy. Every year, I go at it in Spring and Summer with chems that are supposed to kill it. One of the very few times I use "bad" chemicals. It appears to be gone but come next spring and it seems hardier than ever.

If our Central Texas weather keeps like it has since last fall we may have to start calling ourselves "semi-tropical rain forest" for most of the year, except this Spring has been one of the coolest we've ever had. We're still getting more cloudy days than sunny which is extremely unusual. A lot of days typically reach upper 90's by this time of year and sometimes 100. I think we've had a couple of days that got near 90; rest of the time it has been mostly in 70's and a few days in 80's.
BRRRRRRRRRRRRR.

gg=alice

 

[Guest]

We have acid rain here, which lowers pH. At least that's what Bill Clinton and Al Gore told me

 

[JasonLion]

From a swimming pool point of view, all rain is acid rain. But generally the TA level of the rain is really low, so it has hardly any direct effect on the PH.

 

[Jaywalker]

Jason,

All I can say is that I always have to add muriatic acid after a rainfall, and it's rained a lot. Maybe it has something to do with splashing, or maybe overflow. When I first bought the house/pool last November, I spent most of my energy adding baking soda and borax, so I stocked up. Now, all of that stuff remains unused, and I'm on my third half-gallon of MA, though one of those I used to balance the refilled 10k gallons a couple of weeks ago.

 

[pedsrn]

Granny,
I fought poison ivy for years until last year when my dad suggested some weed killer he uses on his "farm." I borrowed his 4 wheeler and sprayer and went about spraying. I killed every ivy, weed and brush that it touched..and it did not come back. I'll miss those few flowers that I accidentally got, but man I was impressed with this stuff. I'll check with him and see what it is called. It came from a feed and grain store and was expensive...but worth every dime.

Rain lowers my ph..about .5 per inch i think.

 

[rastoma]

From a swimming pool point of view, all rain is acid rain. But generally the TA level of the rain is really low, so it has hardly any direct effect on the PH.

I find that to be the case for me. Last year I had to adjust PH maybe twice over the course of a few months.

Pool has been open almost 2 months this year and I've had to adjust it once since opening.

I love the rain. It gives me free backwash water

 

[JasonLion]

All I can say is that I always have to add muriatic acid after a rainfall

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I was probably being a little too technical, talking about "direct" effects. There are also "indirect" effects, which often make a larger difference.

Rain causes aeration. Depending on your TA level, aeration will tend to cause CO2 outgassing, which raises the PH. If your TA level is relatively high, this "indirect" effect can result in a dramatic increase of the PH. If your TA is relatively low, the slight acidity of the rain water is more significant.

Rain can also be accompanied by dust carried in the wind and/or other debris like leaves. Depending on where you are, and what sources of dust there are in the region, the effects of the dust/debris can be more important than either of the effects mentioned above.

 

[geekgranny]

Granny,
I fought poison ivy for years until last year when my dad suggested some weed killer he uses on his "farm." I borrowed his 4 wheeler and sprayer and went about spraying. I killed every ivy, weed and brush that it touched..and it did not come back. I'll miss those few flowers that I accidentally got, but man I was impressed with this stuff. I'll check with him and see what it is called. It came from a feed and grain store and was expensive...but worth every dime.

Rain lowers my ph..about .5 per inch i think.

Thanks, pedsrn, That would be great and ASAP please. The least amount I need to use the better and cost isn't really a factor. The dogs can get the PI oil on their coats and rub off on people too. I'm not nearly as allergic to Texas PI as Kentucky PI, but enough that I've had to take off work a few times to nurse it (and steroids). All my life I've gotten it in perspiration areas even if I don't come in contact with it. When I was a kid the doctors poo-pooed the idea about airborne oils. But my parents and I knew better.

For some reason it doesn't grow much in the wild, but fenced, area right below our deck going down to the barn so I don't need to treat much there. It stays really shady down there with so many trees and other vines. We have an unfenced, natural area, woods, between the three houses out here, where neighbor's dog has created a path between our houses. We call it "Chaco Canyon" after dog, Chaco, who made and maintains the path. Same amount of shade as down the hill but PI is constantly creeping into the path area year round. And driving in, the other neighbors have a retaining wall, full sun, that the PI really loves, that rubs against our cars coming and goin. I battle that the most and have had the least amount of control over it, over the years. I've gotten small patches on my right hand from opening the car door.

It is pretty though.

gg=alice

 

[Jaywalker]

Jason, thanks - that makes sense.

Geekgranny, be careful of the poison ivy oil - it's still active even after the plant itself is dead. In Virginia, we killed it and then bagged it for disposal - burning just makes a poisonous aerosol. We applied systemic killers (gets into the plant's system and kills the roots) on dry, calm days, and didn't water the poison off the leaves. We preferred to apply the poison sparingly to each individual plant rather than broadcast it; apparently, the stuff that holds the poison spray on the leaf without it running off, the surfactant, is more harmful to amphibians than the poison itself, not letting them form properly and otherwise clogging their gills. We had good luck with the general poison ivy killer at Home Depot or Lowes, spraying a couple of leaves on each plant each day over a few days. The leaves applied to started to shrivel, then the plant itself got unhealthy. As I said, many people make the mistake of "watering in" the poison after application - just the wrong thing to do. Good luck.

 

[anonapersona]

I have a monster vine that while it is not poison ivy, it romps all over the yard and pops up everywhere. The growing branches are weakly attached to the mother root and that root is typically 1/2" thick or better and runs only as deep as 4" or less all over the yard and flower beds. When you pull up what emerges from the ground, it simply breaks off, leaving the mother root intact. It is very fond of popping up inside a bush where it extablishes itself in the root system of the bush. If allowed to it will climb to the top of a tree and go to seed. It is everywhere.

This week, as it is to be hot and sunny, I will attack it in the same way that I've heard one should hit poison ivy. That is, use a plastic bag and cover as much of the vine as possible, particularly the growing tips. Tie the bag at the base and open a hole at the top and then spray Round-Up into the bag. Flatten and tie closed. The growing tips are most susceptible to the systemic poison and the bag and heat will force more of that into the plant. I will hit all the vines that I can see on the same day, so as to make the attack on the mother root more effective.

I know that method would be difficult on poison ivy as it does force you to handle it a lot. I've never tried this method, but I have passed it along.

 

[pedsrn]

Granny, sorry it took me so long to get back to ya. The weed killer is called "Eraser" http://www.epinions.com/prices/Eraser_4 ... ntrate_1gl

We buy tons of it at a time, like 2 gallons concentrate for around $60 if I recall correctly so check a local feed and grain store. The internet price is ridiculous. This stuff is awesome!

 

[duraleigh]

It's a Round Up knock off. Whoever made round up has lost their patent over the last few years and there are several other brands out there now.

Like Round Up, it's great stuff. The active ingredient is glyphosphate and 41% is the standard concentration but you can also buy it diluted.