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Thread: welcome to my bog

  1. Back To Top    #1

    welcome to my bog

    Pool Specs:
    30K
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter (sand replaced last season)
    Been using: Leslie Shock and 3" pucks


    I'm ready to switch. I've been having more and more trouble with my pool the last few years and this year is the worst. I opened my pool last week as always:

    1) Took off the safety cover- yup, it's a bog.
    2) Adjusted the PH to 7.4
    3) Added 4 lbs of granular shock (FC somewhere over 5 on the tester)
    4) Ran pump 24/7
    5) Backwashed 2X / day

    Pool should be clearing up right? Nope- it's actually getting worse.

    So I go to the pool store and get the water tested.

    FC: 5
    TC: 5
    TA: 40
    CYA: 100
    PH: 7.6
    Phosphates: 0

    They tell me the water is fine but I need to add alkalinity, hardener and algaecide.

    So I ask, shouldn't the chlorine be killing the algae? It's been at a high shock level for almost a week. They said ya, but the algaecide just does a better job. I understand the alkalinity up but hardener? I have a vinyl liner with no metal railings - why do I need to add hardener? Answer- you still need to keep the calcium level right.

    Not satisfied with the answers I got, I started sniffing around and landed here.
    So from what I've read, it sounds to me like:

    1) My CYA is VERY high and that's inhibiting the FC from doing it's job- killing the algae. I should cut my CYA in half- so that means draining / replacing a good bit of water from the pool.

    2) My Alkalinity is low- baking soda to the tune of 27 lbs for my 30K pool.

    3) I need to add a #$%# load of bleach and keep the FC levels somewhere between 8-13 (*based on the pool cal for current CYA level but this will change)


    I have the leslie pro test kit- it's 4 years old but I replace the regents every year. How do I measure FC past 5ppm? That's as high as the titration scale goes?

    Is there anything that I'm missing? Won't FC that high eat away at my liner? I'm scared!!!
    Thanks in advance for the help,
    -P in the A
    Pool Specs:
    30K gal
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter
    All day Direct sun in atlanta

  2. Back To Top    #2
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Don't be scared. You have a good grasp of what needs to be done.
    You need an FAS-DPD test - and you can order that ala carte from Taylor or TFtestkits.net for about $25.
    It tests FC/CC up to 50 and is the most accurate method for testing FC.

    What was your target for TA (how did you get to 27 lbs?)

    1. Drain/refill to lower the CYA level. Don't be surprised if you have to repeat this process since the test only goes up to 100 it may be higher.
    2. AFTER the CYA is in range, since you have a sand filter you can go as low as 60 on the CYA, it will slowly drop from there....
    AFTER - adjust the TA to 70 (and the PH to 7.4 if it's higher than that) and begin the shock process:
    Shocking Your Pool

    Once your FC holds overnight:
    3. you maintain your FC level according to the new CYA level - and that won't hurt your liner at all.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  3. Back To Top    #3
    Mod Squad JohnT's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Welcome to TFP.

    The high FC levels won't do anything to your pool but keep it clean. You have to understand that if you have CYA in the pool that part of your chlorine is bound up with the CYA and isn't available until some of the unbound chlorine is used up. The higher your CYA level, the larger percentage of the chlorine that's bound up with the CYA. With your high CYA, your effective chlorine level is very low, so your pool is responding as if you have very little chlorine.

    You test higher chlorine levels with the FAS-DPD test. It's available in the Taylor K-2006 or the TF-100 at TFTestkits.net. There is also a supplementary test kit available, but I can't recall the model right now.

    Chances are good that your CYA is well over 100ppm due to limitations of the test. Your best bet is do drain some water from the pool and replace it with fresh water until you have lowered your CYA to around 50ppm. Even 60 or 70ppm is something you can live with, but not ideal.

    I wouldn't worry about anything but your CYA and chlorine levels until you get the CYA squared away.
    TFP Moderator
    20K Gallon 20X36 Vinyl Inground
    Hayward S244T Sand Filter with 1HP Whisperflo Pump. Liquidator C-201 and Solar Heat

  4. Back To Top    #4

    Re: welcome to my bog

    thanks for the response guys. this is the test kit I have:
    Taylor Complete DPD Test Kit K-2005
    So the 5 at the top of the CL test is 50ppm?
    The newer test kits have smaller water sample chambers but the regents are the same- or at least have the same numbers and require the same number of drops per test. Has Taylor changed the regents?
    A few years back I chucked the CYA regents because I didn't realize I needed to test that.
    If what I've read here is correct, my CYA may be well over 100. I've been using the leslie shock and pucks for the last 6 years and have never drained the pool below the skimmers. Well at least this year we're not under water restrictions...
    I'll start draining / replacing tonight and get the water tested friday. Hopefully by sunday I'll have enough water replaced to start the shock.
    Pool Specs:
    30K gal
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter
    All day Direct sun in atlanta

  5. Back To Top    #5
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by pete in atlanta
    thanks for the response guys. this is the test kit I have:
    Taylor Complete DPD Test Kit K-2005
    So the 5 at the top of the CL test is 50ppm?
    The newer test kits have smaller water sample chambers but the regents are the same- or at least have the same numbers and require the same number of drops per test. Has Taylor changed the regents?
    A few years back I chucked the CYA regents because I didn't realize I needed to test that.
    If what I've read here is correct, my CYA may be well over 100. I've been using the leslie shock and pucks for the last 6 years and have never drained the pool below the skimmers. Well at least this year we're not under water restrictions...
    I'll start draining / replacing tonight and get the water tested friday. Hopefully by sunday I'll have enough water replaced to start the shock.
    No - it's 5
    There is a DPD kit that tests up to 5
    and there is an FAS-DPD kit that is very different and tests up to 50.

    Dilute your pool water sample 50/50 to try to get another read on the CYA. It's not as accurate but may put you in the ballpark.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Welcome to TFP!

    You've gotten good advice and I have nothing to add other than to say that I can tell that you have been reading. Strong work. Your pool will be perfect soon.
    10K gallon IG gunite with waterfall; Pentair CC320P filter; WhisperFlo 2 HP pump
    TF Test Kits - Pool Math - Pool School
    "It depends."- JohnT

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by frustratedpoolmom
    Dilute your pool water sample 50/50 to try to get another read on the CYA. It's not as accurate but may put you in the ballpark.
    My thoughts exactly.

    My pool was replastered 2 years ago, if one believes everything they say during the homebuying process. It looks like it is probably true. In that short time, a steady diet of pucks in a floating chlorinator pushed CYA up in the neighborhood of 240. And yes, the pool store test read 100. With the advice to keep FC at 5.

    Try CYA at 1:1 with tap water and again at 1:2 and see if the numbers are close. Don't forget to multiply the result by the appropriate factor.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Re: welcome to my bog

    thanks guys.
    Great idea about testing a diluted sample. I don't know why it never dawned on my to do that.
    I'm gonna have to go out leslies to do the CYA tonight but I'll buy a better kit from them so I can do it myself from now on. When I looked at it in the store, it still seemed to read only to 5 on chlorine. How are yall getting readings like "13" using that tester?
    Pool Specs:
    30K gal
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter
    All day Direct sun in atlanta

  9. Back To Top    #9
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by frustratedpoolmom
    you can order that ala carte from Taylor or TFtestkits.net for about $25.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Butterfly's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    How are yall getting readings like "13" using that tester?
    From where fpm said......look for the FAS/DPD test.
    TFP Moderator TF100 Test Kit TF100 TestKit YouTube Channel PoolMath
    You're done SLAMing when:
    1)You lose 1ppm or less FC overnight, & 2)You have .5ppm CC's or less, & 3)your water is clear.

    ~ One should not use a sledge hammer to swat a mosquito. ~

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  11. Back To Top    #11

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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by pete in atlanta
    Pool Specs: 30K Vinyl liner, Sand Filter, Been using: Leslie Shock and 3" pucks
    ...having more and more trouble with my pool the last few years and this year is the worst. I opened my pool last week as always:
    1) Took off the safety cover- yup, it's a bog.
    2) Adjusted the PH to 7.4
    3) Added 4 lbs of granular shock (FC somewhere over 5 on the tester)
    4) Ran pump 24/7
    5) Backwashed 2X / day
    Pool should be clearing up right? Nope- it's actually getting worse.
    Hi Pete!
    Congratulations on starting to rule your pool instead of it ruling you!

    What granular shock did you use when you opened toe pool? If it was cal-hypo it may be adding "clouds" to the water, not that it matters since you are going to be doing the "drain-n-fill" shuffle, AND will be using bleach, right?

    We've all been through it and this group of folks are THE BEST ar helping out. The nice thing is that you are grasping it quickly. It's all pretty easy once you get used to it but we still make mistakes too.

    BTW: Safety covers are great, but the mesh lets all of the dust/dirt/pollen through and when the water starts to warm up the algae starts fast. I open our pool in NC in March just so I don't have to fight the algae... I fight the pollen instead..

    Don't know which is worse, but I HATE ALGAE!
    Terry in NC
    Triad Region of NC
    18x37 Vinyl IG (24,000 gal.), BBB & GoldLine AquaLogic PS4 SWG, Hayward 1 HP Superpump / Hayward Sand Filter / Polaris 280 cleaner / 6 deck jets / Sheer Descent Waterfall (in coping) / Brick Red Concrete Coping / Stamped Concrete Deck
    Lots of oak trees, maple trees, *and* leaves!

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Re: welcome to my bog

    Here's the stuff I've been using:

    Chlorine pucks:
    http://www.lesliespool.com/browse/Home/ ... 00/I/12439
    Used to use a hayward inline chlorinator but after the second one failed, I went to floaters.

    Shock:
    http://www.lesliespool.com/browse/Home/ ... 10/I/14181

    I just bought the100lbs of shock... GRRRRRRRRRRR

    I'm in the process of draining about 1/3 of the water out of the pool I vacuumed the bottom and sides to get rid of a winters worth of crud that gets through the safety cover. I"m wondering if I should just take the water down so I can finally replace that **** light that went out last year...
    Is that something I should attempt or should I leave that to a pro. I'm not a total idiot- just one when it comes to throwing good money after bad on things I don't fully understand.

    So... tonight, drain, think about pool light repair. Tomorrow new CYA test and test kit then perhaps fill and raid costco for bleach.
    Thanks for the help guys- the advice and encouragement has been fantastic.
    -P
    Pool Specs:
    30K gal
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter
    All day Direct sun in atlanta

  13. Back To Top    #13
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Can you return the shock, perhaps for a store credit?
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by frustratedpoolmom
    Can you return the shock, perhaps for a store credit?
    alas, I've used 4 lbs from the bucket. I'll ask them but I doubt they'll take it back.

    I also have a brand new bucket of soda ash. Is that forbidden as well or can I still use that until it's gone before moving on to Borax?
    Pool Specs:
    30K gal
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter
    All day Direct sun in atlanta

  15. Back To Top    #15
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    LOL pool store chems are not forbidden; they just cost more.
    Soda ash raises PH and TA so just keep that in mind.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  16. Back To Top    #16

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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by pete in atlanta
    Here's the stuff I've been using:
    Chlorine pucks:
    http://www.lesliespool.com/browse/Home/ ... 00/I/12439
    Used to use a hayward inline chlorinator but after the second one failed, I went to floaters.
    >> Trichloro-S-Triazinetrione << = bleach + CYA + acid ... BOO! HISS! But OK for out of town as long as CYA isn't too high already.

    Shock:
    http://www.lesliespool.com/browse/Home/ ... 10/I/14181
    >>Cal-Hypo, can cause calcium clouding << I keep some around (but don't tell anyone ) for times when I run out of bleach!

    ...take the water down so I can finally replace that **** light that went out last year... Is that something I should attempt or should I leave that to a pro. I'm not a total idiot- just one when it comes to throwing good money after bad on things I don't fully understand.
    >> Yes you can do it if you are handy. Search for "replace light" <<

    Tomorrow new CYA test and test kit then perhaps fill and raid costco for bleach.
    >> You are headed in the right direction! <<
    Hey, most things can be done by us lowly homeowners. It's just up to you.

    Keep us posted with updates, and can we get some pictures? ... We LOVE pics!

    Terry in NC
    Triad Region of NC
    18x37 Vinyl IG (24,000 gal.), BBB & GoldLine AquaLogic PS4 SWG, Hayward 1 HP Superpump / Hayward Sand Filter / Polaris 280 cleaner / 6 deck jets / Sheer Descent Waterfall (in coping) / Brick Red Concrete Coping / Stamped Concrete Deck
    Lots of oak trees, maple trees, *and* leaves!

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Re: welcome to my bog

    I'll snap some shots when I get home. I'm pretty sure the creature from the black lagoon has moved in. the head of my whale tail brush somehow came off the end of the pole in the deep end and I have yet to find it...
    Pool Specs:
    30K gal
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter
    All day Direct sun in atlanta

  18. Back To Top    #18
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by pete in atlanta
    I have yet to find it...
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: welcome to my bog

    Quote Originally Posted by pete in atlanta
    ...the creature from the black lagoon has moved in. the head of my whale tail brush somehow came off the end of the pole in the deep end and I have yet to find it...
    Operation "leaf rake" to the rescue!
    -That is "pool leaf rake" for those of us with TONS of trees!
    Triad Region of NC
    18x37 Vinyl IG (24,000 gal.), BBB & GoldLine AquaLogic PS4 SWG, Hayward 1 HP Superpump / Hayward Sand Filter / Polaris 280 cleaner / 6 deck jets / Sheer Descent Waterfall (in coping) / Brick Red Concrete Coping / Stamped Concrete Deck
    Lots of oak trees, maple trees, *and* leaves!

  20. Back To Top    #20

    Re: welcome to my bog

    [quote=fuzzy_dba]
    Quote Originally Posted by "pete in atlanta":3p1vlbrf
    ...the creature from the black lagoon has moved in. the head of my whale tail brush somehow came off the end of the pole in the deep end and I have yet to find it...
    Operation "leaf rake" to the rescue!
    -That is "pool leaf rake" for those of us with TONS of trees! [/quote:3p1vlbrf]

    that's the mystery. I used the leaf rake and still can't find it.
    speaking of the leaf rake...
    When I first opened the pool, I filled 3 floaters with pucks and threw them in the pool. Unbeknown to me, one of the tops had a broken tab. It turned over and the pucks fell into the deep green abyss. Took almost an hour to find them all with the leaf rake.
    Pool Specs:
    30K gal
    Vinyl liner
    Sand Filter
    All day Direct sun in atlanta

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