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Thread: Brand new pool-need advice

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    Brand new pool-need advice

    Hello all!

    I've been reading up on the BBB method for a while, many great articles and testimonials here. I for one really appreciate the time that all the contributors have put in.

    Well, I just finished topping of the pool today. The water source is my well in Fuquay Varina, NC. I don't have a test kit yet, I ordered the TF100 XL. I got some test strips from my PB start-up package. The initial readings on the multi strip were: FC=0, Alk=~80, pH=7.4, TH=50. The water is obviously very cold, not sure exactly but would guess in the low 50's. It was initially clear, but after the pump etc. were turned on it clouded up a little, very slight greenish tint. I can still see the bottom pretty good though.

    What is the recommendation for intitial treatment of the water, before I have any really accurate readings. Should I bring the FC up to shock level, and what is that? 10 ppm FC? Then what are my next steps, being that it is still winter?

    I am also wondering, at what temperature can I start using the SWG?

    Let me know if you need any other information. Thanks in advance for any replies.
    15,000 gal. vinyl liner pool, 3/4 HP Tristar pump, Hayward goldline salt system, Aqua Comfort electric heat pump, Polaris 280 w/booster pump, S244T sand filter

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    Brentr's Avatar
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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    Welcome to TFP where you will find lots of great info and a lot of people willing to give you great advice. I am not an expert at your question but someone will soon chime in and will give you the info you are searching for
    5,775 gal, IG free form, Beach Series Antigua by Marbletite Pebble finish, 2 swim out benches, Sheer Descent, IG Fountain, Dolphin / Mermaid Statues, StaRite Dura- Glas 1.5hp pump, Hayward Pro Series Sand Filter replaced with Hayward Pro-grid DE4820, Aqua Rite SWG with T-Cell 15, Polaris 360, Pentair 300w Light upgraded to Pentair IntelliBrite (OMG what a huge difference) , Heat Siphon Heat Pump DX 5.0 109,000 btu, Pool Cage, 1800sq ft Tremron Estate Pavers, solar cover, TF-100 test kit, Pentair Deck Jet, Apollo Magnetic Stirrer (Makes testing a breeze), Aquatherm Ecosun Solar Panels 192 sq ft with GL-235 Controller,Margarita Concoction Machine,
    Pics of our Spool ( Social Pool) being built Solar install Outdoor kitchen upgrade

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    polyvue's Avatar
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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    Quote Originally Posted by toshalew
    Well, I just finished topping of the pool today. The water source is my well in Fuquay Varina, NC. I don't have a test kit yet, I ordered the TF100 XL. I got some test strips from my PB start-up package. The initial readings on the multi strip were: FC=0, Alk=~80, pH=7.4, TH=50. The water is obviously very cold, not sure exactly but would guess in the low 50's. It was initially clear, but after the pump etc. were turned on it clouded up a little, very slight greenish tint. I can still see the bottom pretty good though.

    What is the recommendation for intitial treatment of the water, before I have any really accurate readings. Should I bring the FC up to shock level, and what is that? 10 ppm FC? Then what are my next steps, being that it is still winter?

    I am also wondering, at what temperature can I start using the SWG?
    Welcome to the forum

    You'll want to get some chlorine in that pool pretty quick -- the SWG won't work (or won't work well) until the water temperature stays over 50 degrees or so. Recommend using liquid chlorine (pool store 10-12% sodium hypochlorite or grocery store 6% bleach.) Use the Pool Calculator to determine how much. Until you're able to run a CYA test to determine its level you will want to add enough chlorine so the strips read 1 or 2 ppm Free Chlorine (FC) or more. Once you have your complete test kit in hand, run all of the tests and post those results. I wouldn't recommend shocking your pool unless you have a compelling reason to do so and are able to test FC & Combined Chlorine (CC) with some precision - the TF100 XL kit will enable you to do that. Since you're using well water to fill the pool you may wish to test it also so you have some idea of what's going into the pool water. It'd be nice to know if you have iron present, so you may want to put an iron test on your shopping list for the future.

    The pH is about right so next step would be to add some Calcium Chloride to increase Calcium Hardness (CH).

    Here are two links with some essential reading:

    pool-school/recommended_levels

    pool-school/water_balance_saltwater_generator

    EDIT 1-27-2009 6:22 pm PST

    Correction -- FPM is right to suggest postponement of adding Calcium Chloride. Unless there is grouted tile, flagstone coping, mosaics or plaster involved, having undersaturated water in a vinyl pool should not be considered a serious problem.

    END-EDIT
    14,555 gal in-ground 16'x29' white plaster Pool w/spa (2007); Goldline Aqua Logic AQL-PS-8 control w/Aqua Cell 15 Salt Water Chlorination (SWCG); Hayward TriStar 1HP (1.85 SF) main / 1.5HP (1.60 SF) spa pumps; Hayward Swimclear cart filter C4025, ColorLogic LED lights; Tankless SP-18-4 electric heater; Polaris 280 cleaner.
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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    I'm not sure about your particular brand of SWG, but my Pentair won't work until the water temp reaches close to 60 degrees. The manual says 52, but the Pentair tech said 60 is reality. So, YMMV.

    Have you tried to start your heat pump yet? I'd be interested to see if you get it to run with the water being 50 degrees. If it doesnt start up and you get a low pressure (LP) error message, dont panic. It's because the water temperature and air temperature are too low. The refrigerent in the heat pump operates at a certain pressure thats dependent on temperature as well. When the water AND air temp are cold, the refrigerent can't get up to the proper pressure. As a result, the safety switch that reads low pressure and shuts of the compressor kicks in and shuts it down. Once the sun heats up the water a bit, and/or the air temp comes up some, it will operate just fine. My Aquacomfort likes 60 degree water before it fires or 60 degree air temp if the water is 50-55 or so.
    14,000 gallon IG, Vinyl. Hayward 3/4 hp superpump, Penatair IC40 SWCG, Pentair automation, Hayward sand filter, Aqua Comfort heat pump, Hayward 400k Lo-Nox LP heater.

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    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    You shouldn't need to shock the pool, fresh fill and cold water at all.... if you have metals present in your well water the tint could be from that, and it would become especially pronounced when you add chlorine....don't be alarmed. Can you have the fill water tested for iron and copper?

    For now, I would manually dose your pool with bleach/chlorine until the temp is at a point where the SWG will operate... have you added any salt? CYA? CH can wait, it's not especially important since you have a vinyl liner.

    If you have not figured out how to use the pool calculator yet, now's a good time, you can figure out how much bleach to add to raise the FC to 1-2ppm until you can get some CYA in there. Then use the chart for the appropriate FC levels, once the SWG is operational, you'll refer to the SWG section of the CYA chart for your recommended number.

    Hope this helps and welcome to TFP
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    Thanks for the input everyone.

    So, I used the Pool Calculator for adding the correct amount of bleach. The level came up to about 2-3 ppm. The water looks "cleaner", there is less of a green tint, but it is still slightly cloudy. I've been running the pump 24/7 for these first two days. I guess I should just wait and let the filter do it's thing for a few more days? I will recheck the FC level this afternoon and post the results.
    15,000 gal. vinyl liner pool, 3/4 HP Tristar pump, Hayward goldline salt system, Aqua Comfort electric heat pump, Polaris 280 w/booster pump, S244T sand filter

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    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    Yes, just give the filter a chance to work, keep the FC consistent. I don't know that it's really necessary to run the pump 24/7 right now...

    Once you get your test kit, you can do an Overnight FC Loss Test with the FAS-DPD test. That will let you know for certain if shocking the pool is the next step.

    Was this a private well? How many days was the bulk of the water in the pool before you finished topping off.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    toshalew,

    Welcome to the forum.

    Check your messages....top left corner of the page...it'll say "1 new message"
    Dave S. - Forum owner
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    Hi all!

    So it's been a few weeks of running the filter and polaris cleaner. The FC level has been kept rather consistent and I also performed an overnight loss test. There was no overnight loss, started at night with 6 ppm and was 6ppm just before sunrise.

    The water is still cloudy. My guess is that it is suspended clay particulate. We have had rough weather over the past month, lots of wind and the exposed clay is being blown around. The filter has been going at it for almost a month 24/7 with constant brushing and vacuuming.

    Here are my test results from this afternoon.

    FC- 3.5
    CC- 0
    pH- 7.5
    T/A- 80
    CH- 70
    CYA- 70
    Temp- 42 F

    One thing worth noting is that the filter pressure has not changed, I have not had to backwash. That leads me to believe that not much of anything suspended in the water is being actively filtered out.

    Any help would be appreciated.
    15,000 gal. vinyl liner pool, 3/4 HP Tristar pump, Hayward goldline salt system, Aqua Comfort electric heat pump, Polaris 280 w/booster pump, S244T sand filter

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    polyvue's Avatar
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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    Quote Originally Posted by toshalew
    So it's been a few weeks of running the filter and polaris cleaner. The FC level has been kept rather consistent and I also performed an overnight loss test. There was no overnight loss, started at night with 6 ppm and was 6ppm just before sunrise.

    The water is still cloudy. My guess is that it is suspended clay particulate. We have had rough weather over the past month, lots of wind and the exposed clay is being blown around. The filter has been going at it for almost a month 24/7 with constant brushing and vacuuming.

    Here are my test results from this afternoon.

    FC- 3.5
    CC- 0
    pH- 7.5
    T/A- 80
    CH- 70
    CYA- 70
    Temp- 42 F

    One thing worth noting is that the filter pressure has not changed, I have not had to backwash. That leads me to believe that not much of anything suspended in the water is being actively filtered out.
    Based on the temperature of the water (cold) and the results from the overnight chlorine loss test I think you can rule out algae, so something else is making the water cloudy.

    A few questions... What product are you using to chlorinate the pool (bleach, liquid chlorine, Caltypo, Trichlor)? At the time you add chlorine do you notice a change in the water's color? Is the clay particulate being blown in daily? Is your Polaris cleaner picking up anything that you can identify? I'm guessing that the cleaner operates at least once a day.

    If your pump/filter are working correctly there should be no visible (undissolved) particulate matter returning to the pool. You might want to check to be sure that the multi-port valve isn't mistakenly set on "Recirculate" instead of Filter and that other valves are set correctly. I'd probably look around at the pad and see if everything looked as it normally does: pump making normal sound, no air in the pump basket, no hissing or leaky pipes. Verify that the pressure gauge goes to zero when the pump is turned off and that it jumps back to a normal PSI when the pump is turned back on. Inspect the sand in the filter to make sure the bed is intact but not compacted or channeled...

    I don't want to just pepper you with questions because it could be a number of things. If you determine that the circulation (pump and filter) is working correctly, I would then think it might be any substance/chemical other than chlorine that was added to the pool since the fill or whether a dissolved metals test might show elevated iron or some other metal that came in from the well. By the way, did I mis-read your first post... was this pool filled for the very first time two weeks ago?

    That's all I can think of at the moment. Other members who have experienced this may be able to pinpoint the problem using a shorter decision tree.
    14,555 gal in-ground 16'x29' white plaster Pool w/spa (2007); Goldline Aqua Logic AQL-PS-8 control w/Aqua Cell 15 Salt Water Chlorination (SWCG); Hayward TriStar 1HP (1.85 SF) main / 1.5HP (1.60 SF) spa pumps; Hayward Swimclear cart filter C4025, ColorLogic LED lights; Tankless SP-18-4 electric heater; Polaris 280 cleaner.
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    View of spiral galaxy in Ursa Major NGC6217 - Hubble Telescope 2009

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    Re: Brand new pool-need advice

    Considering that my chemistry seemed to be in good shape and that my equipment was apparently working properly, I did add about 3 oz of clarifier yesterday afternoon. Woke this morning, turned the pool light on and WOW! crystal clear!

    I had suspected that the cloudiness was suspended clay, as it had settled a little bit on the stairs and appeared reddish.

    My filter pressure for the last 3 weeks remained unchanged at 20 psi, this morning it had gone up to 24 psi. It is finally "catching" it.

    Thanks to everyone for the help! I will be posting pictures soon.
    15,000 gal. vinyl liner pool, 3/4 HP Tristar pump, Hayward goldline salt system, Aqua Comfort electric heat pump, Polaris 280 w/booster pump, S244T sand filter

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