Grey stains on bottom of pool

[frustratedpoolmom]

I think most people have dosing "equipment" (measuring cups, plastic containers, etc.) that are marked to specific ounce sizes for more accurate measuring - the Pool Calculator can also determine dosing in "volume" in addition to weight. So you calculate and come up with say, "3 cups" or whatever...and you've got that handy 1 cup measure ready to go.

I myself haven't needed anything except bleach and CYA for the last three summers so it hasn't been an issue for me, and for those two things I just guestimated.

Poly summed it up quite well, what I was trying to say, about the scoop... my point is if you don't know your CYA level, or your exact FC, how do you know how many scoops it will take to get you where you need to be?

 

[IslandPool]

I think most people have dosing "equipment" (measuring cups, plastic containers, etc.) that are marked to specific ounce sizes for more accurate measuring - the Pool Calculator can also determine dosing in "volume" in addition to weight. So you calculate and come up with say, "3 cups" or whatever...and you've got that handy 1 cup measure ready to go.

I myself haven't needed anything except bleach and CYA for the last three summers so it hasn't been an issue for me, and for those two things I just guestimated.

Poly summed it up quite well, what I was trying to say, about the scoop... my point is if you don't know your CYA level, or your exact FC, how do you know how many scoops it will take to get you where you need to be?

a scoop came with the 100lb pale of Cal Hypo I bought.

I had someone from another company, a friend of mine, who has been in the business for years give me a quote on cleaning the DE filter. he recommended 3 scoops of Cal Hypo and that indeed did clear up the pool very nicely. He was right also the Cal Hypo raised the pH.

I also looked up the manual for recharging the EC65 filter and they recommend 5lbs of DE powder which is equal to 1 gal paint can so I bought a 5qrt liquid paint pail which holds 5lbs of DE. I could just get some empty 1 gal paint cans and fill them with DE ready for recharges. a smaller DE filter would take 3/4 of the paint gal. the pool guy at the shop I go to also confirmed this.

 

[Ohm_Boy]

so you guys use a scale to weigh chemicals?

I've been known to use a postal scale for a few chems, but mostly to determine baselines, ie. how much dry weight equates to how much volume... Helps me to know "this scoop is 10 ounces of Borax", as one example, so that later I know how much to scoop depending on what dry measure I require. A couple of measuring cups (plastic, of course) help at dosing time. By the way, if you wish to use a postal-type scale for chemical weighing, you may want to get a large clear plastic bag to slip over the scales. It will keep corrosive and reactive chems out of the device and still let you read the display and press buttons, etc.

Speaking of measures, I am confused by this statement:

...they recommend 5lbs of DE powder which is equal to 1 gal paint can so I bought a 5qrt liquid paint pail which holds 5lbs of DE.

A gallon is 4 quarts (at least that's how it is here, in the states... ) You say that a gallon of DE is 5 lbs, then say that you got a 5 quart pail (1.25 gal) to hold 5 lbs. Are you just planning for extra room in the bucket?

I also agree with keeping up with amounts and chemicals, like "10 ounces of Cal-Hypo", instead of brand names. For instance, you mentioned "stabilized Desert Granules" - I assume that this is Dichlor, but I really don't know. It will help to know exactly what chemicals you are adding, as we don't always know brand names. Incidentally, for every 10ppm of chlorine increase that you get from Dichlor, you also get 9ppm increase in CYA, so it will jack up the CYA level really quickly. Just an FYI...

 

[polyvue]

[A] scoop came with the 100lb pale of Cal Hypo I bought.

I didn't mean to come across as anti-scoop... Use a scoop, by all means, if you know that each time you pick up a scoop of Calcium Hypochorite there will be 16 oz. (for example, not 13 oz., 20 oz.) and report the addition (make an entry into the pool treatment log) using the nomenclature suggested by Ohm_Boy.

I've been known to use a postal scale for a few chems, but mostly to determine baselines, ie. how much dry weight equates to how much volume... Helps me to know "this scoop is 10 ounces of Borax", as one example, so that later I know how much to scoop depending on what dry measure I require.

That's what I did using a portion control baking scale. And it's almost true that for liquids, "A Pint's a pound, the World Round!"* Fortunately the dry chems (no shock powder or DE) I use are nearly equivalent in weight so don't need 3 or 4 differently marked plastic containers.

[W]hat I was trying to say, about the scoop... my point is if you don't know your CYA level, or your exact FC, how do you know how many scoops it will take to get you where you need to be?

• Exactamundo!

* Thank you, Pierre, for this helpful maxim. Your parkerhouse rolls and soft-hand pâtisserie will be ever remembered.[attachment=0:36qb4sjt]PortionControlScale_5lb_mechanical.jpg[/attachment:36qb4sjt]

 

[IslandPool]

bad news still black on the bottom but i did use a chlorine tablet to test an area and the black went away. in fact where I poured the mixed water and cal hypo on the steps the black is not there any more.

do I need to shock again? I could get my "friend" but he charges $30 to give advice every time he comes.

I have a nightmare of a pool!

I once posted on another forum I should have stayed in the music business. it seemed easier to cut and run but I've always done that and always have been a failure at what I did. I just want to make a living and pay the bills. I feel like a loser/

 

[geekgranny]

Here to give you a big hug. r: l:

You are doing an admirable job on your new venture. You're possibly feeling a little overwhelmed right now. You have your expectations set for yourself and it is going to take a while for the pools and owners to come around. It will get easier and easier. It can take a person, with only one pool to manage, a long while to get things under control. Please go easier on yourself and do give yourself a bunch of really positive strokes for what you have accomplished already.

gg=alice

 

[IslandPool]

Here to give you a big hug. r: l:

You are doing an admirable job on your new venture. You're possibly feeling a little overwhelmed right now. You have your expectations set for yourself and it is going to take a while for the pools and owners to come around. It will get easier and easier. It can take a person, with only one pool to manage, a long while to get things under control. Please go easier on yourself and do give yourself a bunch of really positive strokes for what you have accomplished already.

gg=alice

Thanks. Alice. the first week was the worst. first pool.....added chlorine..then green and all sorts of problems. 2nd week a little better. 3rd week trying to get rid of the black marks. i have no where to go but here. The pool companies here on the island are laughing and actually not talking to me anymore so you guys are my only help. Thanks. I went into a pool company to look for a test kit only to find out i took a pool from them. i got to pay bills and survive don't they realize.

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

Order one of the recommended test kits online... that is really your only option. TFtestkits.net ships worldwide.

Yes, shock level of chlorine while brushing should remove the black stains if a tablet worked.

Hang in there!

 

[IslandPool]

Order one of the recommended test kits online... that is really your only option. TFtestkits.net ships worldwide.

Yes, shock level of chlorine while brushing should remove the black stains if a tablet worked.

Hang in there!

Thanks.

My Ccard is maxed out so can't order online or I would have. will see if i can get one picked up from the states.

 

[geekgranny]

i have no where to go but here. The pool companies here on the island are laughing and actually not talking to me anymore so you guys are my only help. Thanks. I went into a pool company to look for a test kit only to find out i took a pool from them. i got to pay bills and survive don't they realize.

I've been in some kind of "competitive" activities most of my life horses, dogs, swimming, business. There are lots of back stabbers all round. Let it just go by you, or roll off. Don't get paranoid but do keep a bit of an "eye" over your shoulders. Keep an eye, also, on your goals. Lots of times, people in the "business" will appear that they want to "help" you but that's almost always not the case.

TFP is a very safe and friendly place as you have found. :-D I am amazed, sometimes, at the outstanding patience the "experts" have with many of us, me, for sure, included. Everyone here has good, for real intentions with no motive other than to help and assist with loads of secure "hand holding".

gg=alice

 

[IslandPool]

so you guys use a scale to weigh chemicals?

I've been known to use a postal scale for a few chems, but mostly to determine baselines, ie. how much dry weight equates to how much volume... Helps me to know "this scoop is 10 ounces of Borax", as one example, so that later I know how much to scoop depending on what dry measure I require. A couple of measuring cups (plastic, of course) help at dosing time. By the way, if you wish to use a postal-type scale for chemical weighing, you may want to get a large clear plastic bag to slip over the scales. It will keep corrosive and reactive chems out of the device and still let you read the display and press buttons, etc.

Speaking of measures, I am confused by this statement:
[quote:1649fwzt]...they recommend 5lbs of DE powder which is equal to 1 gal paint can so I bought a 5qrt liquid paint pail which holds 5lbs of DE.

A gallon is 4 quarts (at least that's how it is here, in the states... ) You say that a gallon of DE is 5 lbs, then say that you got a 5 quart pail (1.25 gal) to hold 5 lbs. Are you just planning for extra room in the bucket?

I also agree with keeping up with amounts and chemicals, like "10 ounces of Cal-Hypo", instead of brand names. For instance, you mentioned "stabilized Desert Granules" - I assume that this is Dichlor, but I really don't know. It will help to know exactly what chemicals you are adding, as we don't always know brand names. Incidentally, for every 10ppm of chlorine increase that you get from Dichlor, you also get 9ppm increase in CYA, so it will jack up the CYA level really quickly. Just an FYI...[/quote:1649fwzt]

The Cal Hypo that I use doesn't increase CYA.

ok yes there is US and UK dry and wet measures. I'm going in between.

they say to add 5lbs of DE. I assume is that US dry measure. 5lbs of DE: http://www.inyopools.com/pool_filter_answers.aspx

I found a calculator on the web that converts liquid gallon to dry measure. on my other computer. so 1 liquid gal = 5lbs of dry de.

 

[IslandPool]

Thanks everyone for the kind comments. I'm hangin in there.

 

[Ohm_Boy]

ok yes there is US and UK dry and wet measures. I'm going in between.

they say to add 5lbs of DE. I assume is that US dry measure. 5lbs of DE: http://www.inyopools.com/pool_filter_answers.aspx

I found a calculator on the web that converts liquid gallon to dry measure. on my other computer. so 1 liquid gal = 5lbs of dry de.

The US/UK thing explains it. And your assumption regarding US measure on that website should be good, as these guys are in Florida.

The Cal Hypo that I use doesn't increase CYA.

Right-O. It does raise the calcium hardness level, but not CYA. Calcium level is another one of those which does not go away on its' own, and needs to be reduced by drain/refill, just like CYA. While it doesn't make that big of a impact on chlorine use, it can be a scaling problem down the road. You just need to be aware.

The stabilized Desert Granules was what I referred to as a CYA concern. It says 'stabilized', which in the pool world generally means that it has CYA. It's going to be important to know what the chems you use contain, so that you can know what to expect from their use.

I really hope that you can get your hands on a decent test kit, 'cause you need at least a CYA test to properly target an effective FC level. I don't suppose that your customer has a little test kit in the shed somewhere that might have a CYA test in it?

Meanwhile, spend some time skimming over the info in Pool School. This stuff can seem overwhelming at first, but it's not that tough to get a working knowledge of water chemistry. And don't sweat those other pool guys and their attitudes. Once you get the hang of doing this right, you'll be taking truckloads of their pools.

 

[IslandPool]

ok yes there is US and UK dry and wet measures. I'm going in between.

they say to add 5lbs of DE. I assume is that US dry measure. 5lbs of DE: http://www.inyopools.com/pool_filter_answers.aspx

I found a calculator on the web that converts liquid gallon to dry measure. on my other computer. so 1 liquid gal = 5lbs of dry de.

The US/UK thing explains it. And your assumption regarding US measure on that website should be good, as these guys are in Florida.


[quote:3lou49jl]The Cal Hypo that I use doesn't increase CYA.

Right-O. It does raise the calcium hardness level, but not CYA. Calcium level is another one of those which does not go away on its' own, and needs to be reduced by drain/refill, just like CYA. While it doesn't make that big of a impact on chlorine use, it can be a scaling problem down the road. You just need to be aware.

The stabilized Desert Granules was what I referred to as a CYA concern. It says 'stabilized', which in the pool world generally means that it has CYA. It's going to be important to know what the chems you use contain, so that you can know what to expect from their use.

I really hope that you can get your hands on a decent test kit, 'cause you need at least a CYA test to properly target an effective FC level. I don't suppose that your customer has a little test kit in the shed somewhere that might have a CYA test in it?

Meanwhile, spend some time skimming over the info in Pool School. This stuff can seem overwhelming at first, but it's not that tough to get a working knowledge of water chemistry. And don't sweat those other pool guys and their attitudes. Once you get the hang of doing this right, you'll be taking truckloads of their pools.[/quote:3lou49jl]

Yes thanks man I will. I live in the pool school section.

I'm going to start using the BBB method.

I checked all over and the professional test kits are not sold here. the pool supply companies don't want us getting our hands on them. so got to get one from the states.

they have CYA test but just in strip form and that's not accurate.

 

[polyvue]

they have CYA test but just in strip form and that's not accurate.

It's been my experience with CYA strips (in general) that the accuracy isn't a problem so much as their precision; the ones I'm familiar with report CYA in grouped ranges (30-50, 50-75 etc.) But if you're shocking a pool, knowing that the CYA is 50-75 and not zero or 30-50 ppm can guide your decision in how much chlorine must be added to be effective.

 

[IslandPool]

they have CYA test but just in strip form and that's not accurate.

It's been my experience with CYA strips (in general) that the accuracy isn't a problem so much as their precision; the ones I'm familiar with report CYA in grouped ranges (30-50, 50-75 etc.) But if you're shocking a pool, knowing that the CYA is 50-75 and not zero or 30-50 ppm can guide your decision in how much chlorine must be added to be effective.

cool thanks i will get some asap.

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

As I stated on the other thread - I don't find the CYA test on the strips reliable at all.

In my own pool, the strips read 30-50 and in reality the CYA was well over 100.

 

[IslandPool]

As I stated on the other thread - I don't find the CYA test on the strips reliable at all.

In my own pool, the strips read 30-50 and in reality the CYA was well over 100.

that much difference? wow.

 

[IslandPool]

the black on the bottom is going away! Thanks guys!!!

its was algae.

ok I tested again. my FC test tube only goes up to 3. so I added 3 parts untreaded water to 1 part pool water and figured the level was 5 and then multiplied that by 4 to give an approx FC of 20ppm

so chlorine level is high. can I add some bleach to really kill the rest of the alae? like 2 gals will bring it up to 30ppm. I'm betting my CYA is high but have not tested it yet. my brother has a strip test kit and I will borrow it tomorrow to get an idea of CYA.

pH was 7.6
and TA i think 80 but was hard to see any color even after adding 4 drops to neutralize the chlorine.

 

[polyvue]

ok I tested again. my FC test tube only goes up to 3. so I added 3 parts untreaded water to 1 part pool water and figured the level was 5 and then multiplied that by 4 to give an approx FC of 20ppm

It will be tough to know the actual level of Free Chlorine with an OTO kit that only reads 3 ppm, but if this is your only option I suppose killing algae is possible using a skanty knowledge of chlorine levels and has been done.

so chlorine level is high. can I add some bleach to really kill the rest of the alae? like 2 gals will bring it up to 30ppm. I'm betting my CYA is high but have not tested it yet. my brother has a strip test kit and I will borrow it tomorrow to get an idea of CYA.

You'll be relying on assumptions and very rough estimates of available chlorine, but if you know the % chlorine in the product you're using and use the Pool Calculator, at least you'll have some knowledge working forward. FPM may be right about the CYA test strips; I haven't been able to test them against the turbidity test except at 30-50 ppm range, so heed her warning that the CYA just might be higher than the strips suggest. Nevertheless, in your situation, lacking good testing options, having a bit of knowledge is better than having none.

pH was 7.6

I know that shocking is somewhat more effective at lower pH, say 7.2-7.3, but I can't give you the reason for why that is true at the moment. If you add muriatic acid to reduce it, use the pool calculator and correct acid strength to estimate the outcome.


and TA i think 80 but was hard to see any color even after adding 4 drops to neutralize the chlorine.