Newbie with questions after reading through Pool School

[patplh]

Hi, Newbie here who is closing on a house on 8/21 and feeling incredibly anxious about pool maintenance (which explains why I'm up at 3am). I've read through pool school a few times and have some questions. Here's some background on my set up: 9 yr old Gunite pool with waterfall, DE filter, Tablet Chlorinator, Electric Heater, and Polaris vacuum.

1. What is my goal for TA? Pool School says 100-120 if you use trichlor and 60-80 if you run a waterfall often. The previous owners used trichlor so we plan to continue until next season and we plan to run the waterfall. Would I hope to average between 80-100?

2. Previous owners shocked the pool on a weekly basis without consistently testing the chemical levels of the pool. Pool School indicates that we should shock the pool if we see algae, FC = 0 or CC is 0.5. Since testing CC isn't part of the Daily or Weekly schedule, when would I normally test for CC?

3. Previous owners seem to always add 2 chlorine tablets after every backwash. I plan to monitor the pool chemical levels frequently by first checking CYA and then identifying the target FC based on the chart on TFP. I will add tablets according to the Pool Calculator, but if tablets come in 8oz pieces and the calculator tells me to add 4.4 oz, do you cut the tablet or round up to 8oz?

4. The Basic Pool care schedule indicates the first weekly step is to 'Clean out the pump strainer basket(s)." I assume this is the same as the skimmer baskets, right?

5. I've read on random web pages (not on TFP) that gunite pools require more maintenance than other types. Also read something about needing to re-plaster the pool every 5-7 years. Is that true? How do you know it's time to replaster?

6. I hate the idea of wasting precious dollars heating our pool using the electric pool heater. I read about solar pool heating rings as a way to increase the temp.. are these effective? Do they just destroy all FC in the process?

7. Do pool chemicals expire? The previous owners have a slew of chemicals (Dicalite, Omega Chlorine Free Shock, Phoenix Giant Tabs, Phoenix Reserve -Raise Calcium Hardness, muriatic acid, BlueShield pH decrease, Mega algaecide 60, and Bioguard Off the wall cleaner). I know they consistently use the Dicalite, Shock and Chlorine tabs so they are probably 'fresh', but have no idea about the rest. Any ideas on how long they last, or should I just toss and start over if the need arises?

8. I'm worried about closing the pool for the winter. I'm in Northern/Central Massachusetts and curious when people start planning for closing the pool down? I know it must vary year to year, but what would be some signs that it's time to close (other than snow on the ground )

9. Should I even consider closing the pool on my own for the first time without any prior experience with pools ? Or just suck it up and pay the pool folks $350 to do it? I read the threads about winterizing the pool, but I feel that without knowing much about my existing set up (the parts I can't see.. i.e. underground pipes), I may do something wrong.

Thanks again- this site has provided me with such a wealth of information - I can't wait to contribute back!
Please forgive me if I asked questions that are covered in pool school.. it's late and my sleepless night has left me overly anxious about pool maintenance!

 

[duraleigh]

Hi, Newbie here who is closing on a house on 8/21 and feeling incredibly anxious about pool maintenance (which explains why I'm up at 3am). I've read through pool school a few times and have some questions. Here's some background on my set up: 9 yr old Gunite pool with waterfall, DE filter, Tablet Chlorinator, Electric Heater, and Polaris vacuum.

1. What is my goal for TA? Pool School says 100-120 if you use trichlor and 60-80 if you run a waterfall often. The previous owners used trichlor so we plan to continue until next season and we plan to run the waterfall. Would I hope to average between 80-100?

You may have to rethink the tri-chlor.....I believe your CYA may be excessive. Your TA will be fine in the 80-120 range and is sort of a fine tuning adjustment.

2. Previous owners shocked the pool on a weekly basis without consistently testing the chemical levels of the pool. Pool School indicates that we should shock the pool if we see algae, FC = 0 or CC is 0.5. Since testing CC isn't part of the Daily or Weekly schedule, when would I normally test for CC?

CC testing should be done once weekly when you first take over the pool. It's a part of the weekly FAS/DPD chlorine test.

3. Previous owners seem to always add 2 chlorine tablets after every backwash. I plan to monitor the pool chemical levels frequently by first checking CYA and then identifying the target FC based on the chart on TFP. I will add tablets according to the Pool Calculator, but if tablets come in 8oz pieces and the calculator tells me to add 4.4 oz, do you cut the tablet or round up to 8oz?

As in 1. above, I suggest you get a CYA test done first prior to commiting to tabs

4. The Basic Pool care schedule indicates the first weekly step is to 'Clean out the pump strainer basket(s)." I assume this is the same as the skimmer baskets, right?

No. The skimmers are at the pool. However, their purpose is the same, to keep large objects out of the pump.

5. I've read on random web pages (not on TFP) that gunite pools require more maintenance than other types. Also read something about needing to re-plaster the pool every 5-7 years. Is that true? How do you know it's time to replaster?

I would say not tru. There are pros and cons of each type pool. If gunite pools had real disadvantages, there wouldn't be so many.

6. I hate the idea of wasting precious dollars heating our pool using the electric pool heater. I read about solar pool heating rings as a way to increase the temp.. are these effective? Do they just destroy all FC in the process?

Solar heating is a very smart way to heat a pool. Solar Sun Rings are a waste of money, however.

7. Do pool chemicals expire? The previous owners have a slew of chemicals (Dicalite, Omega Chlorine Free Shock, Phoenix Giant Tabs, Phoenix Reserve -Raise Calcium Hardness, muriatic acid, BlueShield pH decrease, Mega algaecide 60, and Bioguard Off the wall cleaner). I know they consistently use the Dicalite, Shock and Chlorine tabs so they are probably 'fresh', but have no idea about the rest. Any ideas on how long they last, or should I just toss and start over if the need arises?

Hold on to all until you learn more about there use and your need for them by asking lot's of questions on the forum.

8. I'm worried about closing the pool for the winter. I'm in Northern/Central Massachusetts and curious when people start planning for closing the pool down? I know it must vary year to year, but what would be some signs that it's time to close (other than snow on the ground )

I live in the South and don't close but others will help you as the time gets closer.....you'll get a lot of great advice.

9. Should I even consider closing the pool on my own for the first time without any prior experience with pools ? Or just suck it up and pay the pool folks $350 to do it? I read the threads about winterizing the pool, but I feel that without knowing much about my existing set up (the parts I can't see.. i.e. underground pipes), I may do something wrong.

Make that decision as you get closer and learn more about your pool.

Thanks again- this site has provided me with such a wealth of information - I can't wait to contribute back!
Please forgive me if I asked questions that are covered in pool school.. it's late and my sleepless night has left me overly anxious about pool maintenance!

I wish I could explain what I'm doping up @ 3:30........at least you have a pending new house as an excuse. Good luck. Stay on the forum, read Pool School, ask lots of questions

 

[Brad S]

On the electric heater. i would imagine that its a heat pump. If it is, they are really efficient. I live near worcester mass, so im probalby close to you. We used the heat pump last year through the middle of october. We closed right after Columbus day and plan to close about the same time this year.

 

[anonapersona]

Hi, Newbie here who is closing on a house on 8/21 and feeling incredibly anxious about pool maintenance (which explains why I'm up at 3am). I've read through pool school a few times and have some questions. Here's some background on my set up: 9 yr old Gunite pool with waterfall, DE filter, Tablet Chlorinator, Electric Heater, and Polaris vacuum.

Welcome and congratulations on the new home. You will be so glad you learned how to run your pool the Trouble Free way. We were in your position only 9 months ago, new home and no pool experiance.

1. What is my goal for TA? Pool School says 100-120 if you use trichlor and 60-80 if you run a waterfall often. The previous owners used trichlor so we plan to continue until next season and we plan to run the waterfall. Would I hope to average between 80-100?

TA goal is not first on the list, but yes, 80-100 is probably right, really depends on if your pool pH rises a lot and if that bothers you.

2. Previous owners shocked the pool on a weekly basis without consistently testing the chemical levels of the pool. Pool School indicates that we should shock the pool if we see algae, FC = 0 or CC is 0.5. Since testing CC isn't part of the Daily or Weekly schedule, when would I normally test for CC?

Weekly, or if you suspect an issue, like heavy usage, big rain or windstorm, something in the skimmer.

3. Previous owners seem to always add 2 chlorine tablets after every backwash. I plan to monitor the pool chemical levels frequently by first checking CYA and then identifying the target FC based on the chart on TFP. I will add tablets according to the Pool Calculator, but if tablets come in 8oz pieces and the calculator tells me to add 4.4 oz, do you cut the tablet or round up to 8oz?

Odds are that you will find the CYA to be high and will need to limit your usage of tablets to vacations and primarily use bleach or occasionally cal-hypo for chlorine source.

4. The Basic Pool care schedule indicates the first weekly step is to 'Clean out the pump strainer basket(s)." I assume this is the same as the skimmer baskets, right?

Weekly on pump strainer, I check skimmers daily in summer, cleaning them maybe every other day depending on wind blown leaves I see. In fall I check daily or twice daily since I live in a wooded area.

5. I've read on random web pages (not on TFP) that gunite pools require more maintenance than other types. Also read something about needing to re-plaster the pool every 5-7 years. Is that true? How do you know it's time to replaster?

I dunno, waiting to see what pros say.... my pool is 8 yrs old and in need of acid wash or replaster maybe I don't know how to be sure.

6. solar pool heating rings ?

7. chemiclas expire ?

8. closing the pool for the winter ?

9. closing the pool on my own ?

All those questions are above my pay grade so hang on and someone else will be along soon for that.

 

[patplh]

Thanks for the responses! Here are some of my thoughts based on the questions and responses I received...
duraleigh - I'm definitely thinking of ditching the trichlor for the BBB Method, but I think i'll just wait it out for the rest of the season since there's so much other house stuff I need to focus on. Am I just being a wuss? Should I jump right into BBB since I'm learning from scratch anyhow?

Brad S - yes, we are close.. I'll be in Westford, MA. Yes, it is a heat pump (still getting use to the terminology). What temperature do you normally keep your pool at - out of curiosity.

anonapersona - Thanks for the responses - we'll definitely be looking at using tablets when we're out of town.. seems like BBB is the way to go..

Thanks again everyone!
We'll be at the house for another walk thru on Monday, so hopefully, I'll get some of the missing info about the pool equipment and be able to put together my signature

 

[Brad S]

I keep my heat pump set about 80. I bump it up on occasion. I have a solar cover so that keeps a lot of heat in. Last few days the pool has been about 87, so the heater doesnt run. But, the last few morning have been in the low 50's, so it kicks on in the morning.
Once you get all the specs, post your pool size, brand of heater, etc.

 

[PaulR]

1. What is my goal for TA? Pool School says 100-120 if you use trichlor and 60-80 if you run a waterfall often. The previous owners used trichlor so we plan to continue until next season and we plan to run the waterfall. Would I hope to average between 80-100?

The goal is for TA to be at a point where the pH doesn't move very quickly in either direction. Trichlor will tend to push it down while a waterfall will tend to push it up. The Pool School numbers should be thought of as starting points; just pick one, and 80-100 sounds as good as any. Then, if you find your pH rising to the point of adding acid more often than you like, you want to lower TA, and if you find your pH dropping, you want to increase TA.

3. Previous owners seem to always add 2 chlorine tablets after every backwash. I plan to monitor the pool chemical levels frequently by first checking CYA and then identifying the target FC based on the chart on TFP. I will add tablets according to the Pool Calculator, but if tablets come in 8oz pieces and the calculator tells me to add 4.4 oz, do you cut the tablet or round up to 8oz?

The pool calculator is written to tell you how much to use in total. But trichlor dissolves very slowly. In general with trichlor you figure out how many tabs it takes to keep your FC steady, and periodically add more as the previous tabs get smaller. This is an area where the pool calculator is not especially helpful.

With the previous owners using trichlor consistently, your CYA is probably high. Given it's already August, one tactic is to just keep with it for this season (possibly supplementing with polyquat 60 algaecide weekly, if CYA is really high) on the theory that you are going to drain down some water when you close this fall. Then in the spring you'll refill with fresh water, and already be partway done with a drain/refill cycle to lower CYA and adopt the rest of the recommendations on this forum.
--paulr

 

[Guest]

Hi, Newbie here who is closing on a house on 8/21 and feeling incredibly anxious about pool maintenance (which explains why I'm up at 3am). I've read through pool school a few times and have some questions. Here's some background on my set up: 9 yr old Gunite pool with waterfall, DE filter, Tablet Chlorinator, Electric Heater, and Polaris vacuum.

1. What is my goal for TA? Pool School says 100-120 if you use trichlor and 60-80 if you run a waterfall often. The previous owners used trichlor so we plan to continue until next season and we plan to run the waterfall. Would I hope to average between 80-100?
I would start at around 100-120 ppm and if your pH is rising and you need to add acid to lower it then lower the TA about 20 ppm. I would NOT go beloe 80 ppm with trichlor and if below 100 ppm I would monitor it and the pH closely to prevent the pH from 'crashing'. However, as Duraleigh said, test your CYA first. A season on trichlor may not be an option!

2. Previous owners shocked the pool on a weekly basis without consistently testing the chemical levels of the pool. Pool School indicates that we should shock the pool if we see algae, FC = 0 or CC is 0.5. Since testing CC isn't part of the Daily or Weekly schedule, when would I normally test for CC?
Weekly chlorine testing should be done with FAS-DPD which will test FC and CC. Daily testing is usually done with OTO which tests TC. IF the TC test is not normal break out the big kit and see what's going on!

3. Previous owners seem to always add 2 chlorine tablets after every backwash. I plan to monitor the pool chemical levels frequently by first checking CYA and then identifying the target FC based on the chart on TFP. I will add tablets according to the Pool Calculator, but if tablets come in 8oz pieces and the calculator tells me to add 4.4 oz, do you cut the tablet or round up to 8oz?
Trichlor tablets are added in a floater or feeder. You adjust the floater or feeder to control how much and how fast the chlorine is added. Do not add tablets to the skimmer or directly to the pool.

4. The Basic Pool care schedule indicates the first weekly step is to 'Clean out the pump strainer basket(s)." I assume this is the same as the skimmer baskets, right?
Pump basket is the basket on the front end (wet end) of your pump. Skimmer basket is part of the skimmer and is in the deck for an inground pool or hanging off the outside in an above ground pool at the skimmer. It is important to clean both out.

5. I've read on random web pages (not on TFP) that gunite pools require more maintenance than other types. Also read something about needing to re-plaster the pool every 5-7 years. Is that true? How do you know it's time to replaster?
For the most part it's true but the time frame seems a bit short. Replaster is more like every 10-15 years. A lot depends on how well you manage your water. Paster pools need to be acid washed every 2-3 years and each time you lose a bit of plaster. When the plaster becomes too thin you need to replaster, about every 2--4 acid washes on average. Also, the exact plaster finish does make a difference. Marcite (plain white or colored plaster) does not last as long as some of the exposed aggregate finishes (which are also plaster with quartz or marble or other substance in them).

6. I hate the idea of wasting precious dollars heating our pool using the electric pool heater. I read about solar pool heating rings as a way to increase the temp.. are these effective? Do they just destroy all FC in the process?
Solar heating is very effective if you have the proper northern exposure and enough area to place enough panels. They do not destroy chlorine any more than any other heating method does. Heat pumps are also cost effective in many parts of the country. They are often the second most cost effective after solar. Using a solar cover makes any form of heating more cost effective.

7. Do pool chemicals expire? The previous owners have a slew of chemicals (Dicalite, Omega Chlorine Free Shock, Phoenix Giant Tabs, Phoenix Reserve -Raise Calcium Hardness, muriatic acid, BlueShield pH decrease, Mega algaecide 60, and Bioguard Off the wall cleaner). I know they consistently use the Dicalite, Shock and Chlorine tabs so they are probably 'fresh', but have no idea about the rest. Any ideas on how long they last, or should I just toss and start over if the need arises?
Depends on the chemical. Trichlor and dichlor will keep a long time if tightly closed and not exposed to extreme heat and moisture. Liquid chlorine will last 6 weeks to a few months before losing strength.
How fast depends on the strength it started at. The higher the concentration, the shorter the shelf life. Cal Hypo. lithium hypochlorite, and non chlorine shock (pretty useless in an outdoor pool, btw) fall somewhere in between liquid and the trichlor and dichlor.
Just about all other pool chemicals will keep indefinitely if they are kept dry, out of high heat, and high humidity.
8. I'm worried about closing the pool for the winter. I'm in Northern/Central Massachusetts and curious when people start planning for closing the pool down? I know it must vary year to year, but what would be some signs that it's time to close (other than snow on the ground )

9. Should I even consider closing the pool on my own for the first time without any prior experience with pools ? Or just suck it up and pay the pool folks $350 to do it? I read the threads about winterizing the pool, but I feel that without knowing much about my existing set up (the parts I can't see.. i.e. underground pipes), I may do something wrong.
The first time I would hire someone, watch them and take notes and ask a lot of questions. After that it really depends on your comfort level. Ditto for opening the pool in the spring.
Sometimes one time is all you need to be able to do it on your own. Sometimes you need to go through the process more than once. It's not hard but there are steps that need to be done.

Thanks again- this site has provided me with such a wealth of information - I can't wait to contribute back!
Please forgive me if I asked questions that are covered in pool school.. it's late and my sleepless night has left me overly anxious about pool maintenance!

 

[Brad S]

A solar cover is a must. But, i wouldnt even consider solar for heating the pool in New England. Heating season here is basically opening (you can open in early May if you have a heater) to the middle of June, then middle of august to middle of october. So, you really only have 7 weeks or so where you dont need a heater (mid june to mid august). During heating season, the sun just isnt strong enough or high enough in the sky to do much good. At night, even in mid august, it can get down into the 50's at night. You need some heat in the mornings to do any good to raise the temp. Keep the heat pump, its the most economical way to heat the pool in New England.

 

[patplh]

Thanks again for all the information - my TF100 kit is on the way. i made a little maintenance document for myself so I'm feeling a little better about it. We close on 8/21, should I test right after we close (around 12pm) or wait until the evening, next morning?

I Need to dig up some pictures from our visit to the house so I can update my sig with specifics.. but from what I remember, it's around 15x35 ft, 17000 gallons, gunite, kidney shaped, DE filter, Aerotemp heat pump. there are two covers, one is thinner than the other and the 'other' had a name etched around the edge - without the pictures, I think it said something like Menma? Also, there are hooks all along one side (about every 10 inches) of the pool's edge (about 6 inches above the water surface), but there were no visible hooks on the other side.. any ideas where I should be looking for hooks?

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

Test as soon as you feel like it, at the latest the next morning.

No advice on the hooks issue, hopefully someone else can advise.

 

[tphaggerty]

A solar cover is a must. But, i wouldnt even consider solar for heating the pool in New England. Heating season here is basically opening (you can open in early May if you have a heater) to the middle of June, then middle of august to middle of october. So, you really only have 7 weeks or so where you dont need a heater (mid june to mid august). During heating season, the sun just isnt strong enough or high enough in the sky to do much good. At night, even in mid august, it can get down into the 50's at night. You need some heat in the mornings to do any good to raise the temp. Keep the heat pump, its the most economical way to heat the pool in New England.

This is just so wrong in so many ways.... I live in upstate NY and have solar, open my pool in early May, close at the end of Oct. The statement about the sun not being high enough or strong enough is news to our Canadian friends, who have a much higher use of solar pool heating than the US (the CA government has a GREAT pamphlet on solar pool heating, BTW). If I wanted to, I can get my pool into the low 90s, just with solar. I do have a lot of panels (about 700 sq ft), but that is because I have a less than optimal exposure (mine is slightly NE) and I like for my pool to reheat quickly after all the storms we get.

As for cost effectiveness, you pay more for solar upfront, but it is basically free after that. I would agree that if you already have a heat pump, it may not be worth switching. If you have a propane or electric heater, it definitely is. There are LOTS of TFPers in the NE that have solar, it works great!

Got my brother-in-law a single panel (4x10) for his AG pool (maybe 10k gals). He easily raised his temp by 10 degrees or so just laying it on the ground. In Taunton, MA.

 

[patplh]

This is just so wrong in so many ways.... I live in upstate NY and have solar, open my pool in early May, close at the end of Oct. The statement about the sun not being high enough or strong enough is news to our Canadian friends, who have a much higher use of solar pool heating than the US (the CA government has a GREAT pamphlet on solar pool heating, BTW). If I wanted to, I can get my pool into the low 90s, just with solar. I do have a lot of panels (about 700 sq ft), but that is because I have a less than optimal exposure (mine is slightly NE) and I like for my pool to reheat quickly after all the storms we get.

As for cost effectiveness, you pay more for solar upfront, but it is basically free after that. I would agree that if you already have a heat pump, it may not be worth switching. If you have a propane or electric heater, it definitely is. There are LOTS of TFPers in the NE that have solar, it works great!

Got my brother-in-law a single panel (4x10) for his AG pool (maybe 10k gals). He easily raised his temp by 10 degrees or so just laying it on the ground. In Taunton, MA.

Thanks for the feedback.. Since we technically didn't invest in the heat pump (the previous owners did), maybe we should look into the solar panels When we visited the house earlier in the week, we were pleasantly surprised with how much sun we actually got.. we'll have to keep an eye on the # of hours of day of direct sunlight, when and where.. We'll probably wait another season just to see how much we love the pool (which I'm sure we will).. I'm sure I'll come running to TFP when the time comes..

Wish us luck.. closing date is a week away.. woo hoo!