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Thread: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

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    Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    We recently retired to live in Philippines and will be building a new house, starting construction hopefully in January of 2018. Our architect is finishing up the house plans while I complete the pool technical design. Below is the equipment shopping list for our future 13.5 x 30 ft indoor IG liquid chlorine pool and drawings I made to explain our vision to the pool builder. We already obtained some quotes but they are almost useless as they don't want to share any details with us for fear we will not use them to build, so I have to do my own detailed plumbing and structural design first. The project is in Philippines but all equipment will be ordered (by me) and shipped from USA because letting the pool builder supply it will cost 3-4 times as much. Both suction and return lines will all be 2.0 inch Schedule 40 PVC pipe because the availability of 2.5 or 3.0 inch PVC pipe and fittings are more difficult to find. However, the return and dedicated pressure lines will terminate in the pool as 1.5 female threaded pipe. I would appreciate any advice. Thanks -Mel

    Pentair 180008 FNS Plus 48 Sq. Ft. Vertical DE Pool Filter, 96 GPM (qty 1)

    Pentair 261152 2.0-Inch Threaded Multiport Valve For FNS Plus DE Filter (qty 1)

    Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pool Pump, 230 Volt, Single Phase, 2.0 Inch Connect, Maximum of 80 GPM with 2.0-Inch Pipes or 110 GPM with 2.5-Inch Pipes (qty 1)

    Pentair 500120 StarGuard Drain, 8-Inch, White, 2-Pack, ABS, 72-GPM, Installed In Pool Wall. (qty 1 – Because Product Sold As 2-Pack)

    Pentair 506300 PVC 2.0 Inch Slip-Port Bermuda Skimmer, White (qty 2)
    --- Equalizer Port is Permanently Sealed With Both Screw-In Plug and Slip Cap.

    Pentair T40FW Autofill (Automatic Water Leveler) With Fluidmaster Valve (qty 1)

    Jandy 4717 3-Port 2.0” To 2.5” Neverlube Valve, CPVC (qty 4)

    Jandy 7305 180-Degree 2.0” To 2.5” Inch Check Valve, CPVC (qty 3)

    Hayward SP1056 Hydrostatic Relief Valve, White, Installed In Main Drain Port. (qty 2)

    Hayward SP1055 Relief Valve Suction Outlet Collector Tube For Hydrostat. (qty 2)

    Intermatic T104R 230v Mechanical Timer Switch With Outdoor Metal Case. (qty 2)
    --- First Timer Wired To Hayward Filter Pump
    --- Second Timer Wired To Stenner Liquid Bleach/Chlorine Pump

    Intermatic PS3000 Surge Protector, Installed In Electrical Service Panel. (qty 1)

    Stenner 45MPH10-B 220v/60Hz Liquid Chlorinator Pump With Hoses & Connectors
    --- Container Drums Purchased & Supplied Locally

    Hayward SP1026 Threaded MPT Safety Grate for 1.5" Return Fitting (qty 5)
    --- Fits Threaded Female 1.5 Inch PVC Return & Pressure Lines.

    Polaris 360 Pressure Side Cleaner (No Booster Pump Required)

    Stainless Grab Rails
    --- One Set (2 Pieces) of A-Shape
    --- One Set (2 Pieces) of P-Shape

    Bronze Anchors (For Install of Stainless Handrails)
    --- S.R. Smith AS-100B 4-Inch Anchor for 1.90-Inch Outer Diameter Tubing (qty 8)

    TFP-100 Test Kit (qty 1)

    Weld-On 11890 Gray 724 Heavy-Bodied CPVC Professional Industrial-Grade Cement, Medium-Setting, Low-VOC

    Spears Mfg Brand 2.0 Inch PVC “Sweep” 90-Degree Elbow, Part # 406-020s (qty 25)

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/zvjxgsuyf6...age29.jpg?dl=0
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/7jzli8osme...NT%29.png?dl=0
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/b0uaeuumor...NG%29.png?dl=0
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/xlendrofuo...EW%29.png?dl=0
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by melinphils; 12-01-2017 at 02:48 AM. Reason: Photos Replaced
    Pool under design is approx. 13,000 gallon rectangular (30 x 13.5 ft) in-ground concrete pool with avg depth 4.25 ft, no spa, no water features. Pentair 160301 Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter, 150 GPM. Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pump, 230 Volt... in Philippines

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    cfherrman's Avatar
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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Okay I can help although I am limited somewhat. Have you done the math on the fluid velocities on your pump, I believe you should go with a 2.5 inch pvc from your pump to where your drains and your skimmer meet up, again run the numbers here. On the discharge side 2" to where the returns go to 1.5" sound fine.

    Consider getting a robot instead of the pressure side cleaner, everybody with a robot will agree with this.

    Make sure your sweep 90s are schedule 40, along with all your other pvc just in case.
    Intex 24' x 52" Closed for 2017/18 Winter
    2 Main Drains, hard lined 1.25" and 1.5" PVC
    1/2 HP Intex Pump w/ 42 lb 13" Sand Filter

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Your detailed diagram shows 90 degree "street" elbows. They are frowned upon on this site! Regular 90 degree sch 40 elbows are recommended.
    Keith
    15,000 gallon in-ground gunite/plaster pool, 1.5" PVC plumbing
    1.0HP Sta-Rite DuraGlass P2R pump, Hayward S244T sand filter
    Teledyne-Laars Lite-2 250k heater, Hayward CL200 chlorinator
    Polaris 380/Hayward 6060 booster pump

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Thanks for the advice. I will definitely be using sweeps and they are on my list above as:
    Spears Mfg Brand 2.0 Inch PVC “Sweep” 90-Degree Elbow, Part # 406-020s (qty 25)

    All the manufacturers I've contacted only supply 2.0 inch pipe. It's even worse as their 2.0 inch pipe is 63mm outside dimension (OD) or 2.48" instead of the US pipe that has 2.375mm (60.325mm) OD. The inside dimensions are also different. Living in Philippines, many construction items are sold as "non-standard" sizes. But if 2.5 inch is what you guys recommend, then I'll just have to find a way to get it here... maybe from Australia.

    As for the robot cleaner, they are extremely expensive here... around $3000 and very limited choices. We also get a lot of imitation products made in china, so I'd have to send it to a friend in US to disassemble and repack in smaller boxes as replacement parts to avoid the high cost. The good news is that labor is very cheap and I think I can pay a pool boy to clean the pool manually for roughly the same as the electric costs. The other consideration I have whether these robot cleaners break within 1-2 years because getting parts would take 3-4 months. I'm still on the fence with cleaners.

    Is the Pentair FNS Plus 48 Sq. Ft. DE Pool Filter the right size for the Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS ? My initial flow calculations led me to upsize to the FNS 48 filter. The builders here try to sell the 3/4 hp single speed pumps but I'm sticking with the variable speed. I've read numerous debates on Hayward vs Pentair and there's no clear winner.

    BTW: Our house electric will be mostly provided by rooftop solar because the island's electric only runs a diesel generator and power is unstable. Water is only available between 3PM to 5AM so we're installing large water storage tanks and also collecting rainwater.

    Sounds remote? Yes, but we have huge mango trees and no regrets. My prepaid healthcare for 3 years cost less than $50 and my last doctor visit cost $10. Everything kindof works out in the balance.

    Another question I have is with putting the main drains on the walls, not the floor. I've read this is ok. Right?

    Thanks (Salamat po)
    Pool under design is approx. 13,000 gallon rectangular (30 x 13.5 ft) in-ground concrete pool with avg depth 4.25 ft, no spa, no water features. Pentair 160301 Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter, 150 GPM. Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pump, 230 Volt... in Philippines

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    I was assuming you were getting the pvc from the USA, but if your getting it locally you also have to figure in repairs or being broken on installation, so it might be better to order extra.

    I'm not saying that you have to get 2.5", I'm saying to run the numbers with flow rates to make sure your suction velocity does not get too high. If you is too high you should only need it from the skimmer 3 way to the drain 3 way, and then to your pump. Order double the amount of 2.5" and it's connections if needed again for future repairs or mess ups.

    The vs speed pump is a must for everybody really, and if you go with 2" and it turns out being too small you can fix it with not running the pump at Max speed.

    Main drains on here are often regarded as unnecessary so floor or wall or none will be fine. I and people that use them love the drains on the floor to sweep into, I believe they really help. There really is no wrong answer here.

    I don't know de filters, I do know bigger filter is better and check that max flow rate on the filter. Did you check availability of pool de powder locally?

    I've seen that the tf100 test kit can't be shipped outside the USA, you may have to double check that and do something special or get the Taylor 2006c, just make sure you get one of these two.
    Intex 24' x 52" Closed for 2017/18 Winter
    2 Main Drains, hard lined 1.25" and 1.5" PVC
    1/2 HP Intex Pump w/ 42 lb 13" Sand Filter

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    I had not even thought about ordering double quantity PVC for future repair, so thanks for that suggestion! The Apex Plastic Piping company I just now located in Laguna (island of Luzon where Manila is located) sells canadian-made/imported IPEX brand pvc pipes 2.0 and 2.5 inch schedule 40 pipes and fittings, so looks like we have a solution in sight.


    Spears 2.0" sch 40 sweeps costs $4.32/ea online in USA but the local distributor quoted me $30/ea so that explains the reason I'm trying to order as much equip myself and ship it here. I tried ordering a full box of 25 from Spears (at $17.55 MSRP) but they directed me to their ripoff distributor here.


    Yes, DE powder is available locally and it originates from China. I contacted the Manila manufacturer who told me "Zonrox" brand liquid household bleach contains between 4-6% Sodium Hypochlorite and I'm still looking for Clorox brand liquid bleach here. Most pool builders here will supply the chlorine chemicals (pucks) but they are simply ordering from Manila and adding the shipping costs plus a handsome markup for themselves.


    I will check the import restrictions, but I thought I read TFT-100 and Taylor 2000c Test Kits use the same reagents so wouldn't both be restricted?


    I had recently reconfigured the plumbing layout, so as you suggest I need figure out the dynamic head and also make sure the suction velocity doesn't get too high.


    As of now, here's what I have put together from a variety of sources including info from this forum. The local pool builders won't divulge their secrets. Thank goodness for TFP.


    Dropbox - POOL CALCULATIONS.pdf
    Dropbox - POOL FORMWORKS.pdf
    Dropbox - POOL FLOOR + WALLS.pdf
    Dropbox - POOL SPECS.pdf
    Dropbox - IPEX.pdf


    Most IG pools here are constructed by first digging out the hole, then building a cement hollow block wall around the sides to serve as "formworks". Next, the rebar and plumbing are laid out then the pool floor is poured with cement mixed in a mixer onsite and the walls are built up step by step with the "hand packed" method using concrete. The concrete is very dry so it holds up well until it cures. Then we plaster and finish as usual. Takes around 60 days.


    As for shipping, I can ship anything (not restricted of course) in a 24x24x24 inch box that will arrive here in 3-4 months for around $110 shipping costs with no customs duties. Anything larger or needed quicker requires going through the complicated and expensive import process.
    Pool under design is approx. 13,000 gallon rectangular (30 x 13.5 ft) in-ground concrete pool with avg depth 4.25 ft, no spa, no water features. Pentair 160301 Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter, 150 GPM. Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pump, 230 Volt... in Philippines

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Very nice!

    The % of clorine is mostly unimportant, just the cost per free clorine is more important, so 6% bleach that is way cheaper than 8% is more than fine except that you lug more jugs around. There is a cost per fc calculator on the internet that you can probably find. Plain old bleach, brand name don't matter. If you get a lot of rainfall pucks might work fine, tfpc is about knowing what exactly you are adding to your pool. Check out pool math and the effects of adding chems to see what a 8oz triclor puck does. I don't know your pool experience or experience with tfpc, if it's low start with bleach, hard to mess up. **Noticed you put stenner in parts list, nice go with bleach!

    If sch 40 90's are much cheaper use those, sweeps are barely better.


    Anything not stocked locally order extra except the special stuff like valves, maybe one extra 3 way valve since you already have a few. The run of 2.5, if needed, should be short so double there, the 2" and 1.5 your gonna use a lot so order a extra stick or two, depending on price and budget. I can tell from experience being out in the field and short on materials sucks, and some stuff you might run into might take awhile to get in. You'll figure it out, and pvc in storage does not go bad. Contractors hate when customers supply their own materials as they don't make money there and often have to work with materials they haven't worked with or that they don't like, so keep that in mind when interviewing and procurement.

    If you have a friend in the USA you might be able to arrange them to buy the tf100 and some other stuff to pack into the 24" box to make procurement easier, if needed.
    Intex 24' x 52" Closed for 2017/18 Winter
    2 Main Drains, hard lined 1.25" and 1.5" PVC
    1/2 HP Intex Pump w/ 42 lb 13" Sand Filter

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    This is my first swimming pool, so I'm learning as much as I can and (with no help from the local pool builders) trying to design the best pool for our situation before actual home construction begins in hopefully 2 months.

    I caught a good deal on amazon, so I already bought some Jandy check values. I guess it's going to winter there.

    I just re-read the thread titled "Hydraulics 101 - Have you lost your head?" and the charts say:


    88 GPM flow at 6 ft/sec for 2.5" pipe (suction)
    63 GPM flow at 8 ft/sec for 2.0" pipe (discharge)


    Then I found this quote: "On the return side of the pump, multiple lines can help reduce head loss as well but the equivalent size of all the return lines should never exceed the equivalent size of all the suction lines or pump cavitation could become an issue."


    2.0" pipe for return discharge (same as before)
    2.0" pipe for each skimmer suction (same as before)
    2.5" pipe for main drain suction lines, all the way to jandy 3-way at the pad (changed as recommended)


    Also, switch to using 2.5" pipe at equipment pad where skimmers and main drain pipes meet... but use 2.0" pipe from jandy 3-way value to the pump (which has 2.0 connectors) and continues as 2.0" pipe to the filter and for the entire return path, where the 2.0" return is reduced to 1.5" pipe right before entering the pool shell.

    I don't understand the justification for the skimmer pipes to be 2.5" because they will never be the sole suction (i.e. main drains valved off) with the pump also running at high speed. Also, should I really have 2.5" pipe from Jandy values to the pump as that would require a 2.5 to 2.0" reducer to connect to the pump?

    Thanks
    Pool under design is approx. 13,000 gallon rectangular (30 x 13.5 ft) in-ground concrete pool with avg depth 4.25 ft, no spa, no water features. Pentair 160301 Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter, 150 GPM. Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pump, 230 Volt... in Philippines

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Also, switch to using 2.5" pipe at equipment pad where skimmers and main drain pipes meet... but use 2.0" pipe from jandy 3-way value to the pump (which has 2.0 connectors) and continues as 2.0" pipe to the filter and for the entire return path, where the 2.0" return is reduced to 1.5" pipe right before entering the pool shell.
    You have two skimmers and two drains, which will be tied into one pipe, leave these at 2". People use their skimmers for 90% of their suction so you will be using them a lot. Where your skimmers come together, along with your drains, this is where your pipe needs to be 2.5" to the pump. To make it easier to talk about we will just talk about the skimmers. The two 2" skimmer pipes will flow way more than one 2.5", that's why you want to up the size where everything comes together so the run to the pump stays under recommend fluid velocities limiting noise and possibly pump cavitation. I will admit my pump experience is from work with bigger pumps, everything is same but different.

    Returns sound good, could run the numbers if you wish, if I was you I probably wouldn't.

    I don't understand the justification for the skimmer pipes to be 2.5" because they will never be the sole suction (i.e. main drains valved off) with the pump also running at high speed. Also, should I really have 2.5" pipe from Jandy values to the pump as that would require a 2.5 to 2.0" reducer to connect to the pump?
    Your regular suction devices would be plumed with 2" as you planned, just needs the 2.5" from the pump to the jandy valve. Just remember, most to all people here don't use main drains so in the grand scheme they are unnecessary, but they are helpful if you have them.

    Depending on your pump you might need a reducer, the bigger pumps have 2" threads on the inside and 2.5" threads on the outside.

    Just remembered, you need to have unions on the suction and discharge of your pump, so one 2.5" and three 2", or 4 2" if you don't do 2.5".

    I also noticed your glue is for cpvc, which is drinking water pvc pipe glue, you will need regular pvc glue, primer, and maybe clear cleaner. This might be where you can throw your builder a bone and have him use his glue and primer.

    Teflon tape for all pipe threads, probably builder supplied.
    Intex 24' x 52" Closed for 2017/18 Winter
    2 Main Drains, hard lined 1.25" and 1.5" PVC
    1/2 HP Intex Pump w/ 42 lb 13" Sand Filter

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Mel,
    Are you planning to engage a local Pool Builder or managing and/or supervising your own build? I have no doubt you can hire some cheap quality labor locally but not sure about city permit or inspection. AFAIK, in the Phils you can literally do just about anything within your property limit without a permit, especially in the province.

    If I were you, I’ll build my indoor pool equipment as simple as possible.

    Equipment:
    I’ll go with Hayward Tristar VS pump (SP3202VSP) and 400 sq ft Super Star Clear Cartdrige (x4 filter) to avoid the much complicated and cumbersome DE. Cartridge filter eliminates sewer line connection. A Pool heater if deemed necessary. But I doubt you will ever need one since gas heater is not even an option! Don’t forget the Siemens GFCI breakers for the pump, PS3000 and Intermatic T101 timer for the SWCG (optional).

    Plumbing:
    I'll go with sch 40, 2” pipe all the way and 90 deg elbow instead of the pricey sweep. A 3-way Jandy valve is needed in order to direct suction between the main drain and skimmer. Depends on the location of the pump, an inline 2” check valve may come handy. Drop the suction side vacuum! A Robotic cleaner is the way to go.

    Chlorination:
    Your local weather pattern is either wet or dry. January being the coldest with an air temp in the low 70’s F. A 40k gallon Salt cell maybe the cheapest route to sanitize your pool water since your air temp does not go below 70 F. For you, this means the SWCG will produce an x amount of chlorine all year round. Alternatively, you can use pucks and bottled bleach if anything goes wrong with the SWCG.

    Test Kit:
    Order the Taylor K-2006C and K-1766. Might as well get the Speedstir and stock up on reagents.

    Shipping method:
    I believe you can use the “Balikbayan” box for cheap. AFAIK, they ship the 24” box at fix rate regardless of its weight. Please correct me if I’m wrong!

    Anyway, all the above is just me and of course, it’s your money…your decision…hence, the choice is yours. Good Luck!
    20k gallons, IG plaster with raised Spa, Hayward C-4000 cartridge, Hayward TriStar SP3202VSP, Hayward H400 gas heater, Hayward Super II (2HP) Spa jets, Hayward Swimpure Plus T-15,
    Intermatic PS3000 SPD, PureLine-PureColor LED's, Dolphin Triton cleaning robot, Taylor K-2006, K-1766, OTO Test kit & various Guess strips.

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Quote Originally Posted by melinphils View Post
    All the manufacturers I've contacted only supply 2.0 inch pipe. It's even worse as their 2.0 inch pipe is 63mm outside dimension (OD) or 2.48" instead of the US pipe that has 2.375mm (60.325mm) OD. The inside dimensions are also different. Living in Philippines, many construction items are sold as "non-standard" sizes.
    If you are buying all of the "standard size" equipment from the US, how are you going to connect it to your "non-standard", locally sourced PVC pipe?

    Yes, you might want to get "standard" PVC piping and fittings from the closest available source with overage for future repairs.
    Keith
    15,000 gallon in-ground gunite/plaster pool, 1.5" PVC plumbing
    1.0HP Sta-Rite DuraGlass P2R pump, Hayward S244T sand filter
    Teledyne-Laars Lite-2 250k heater, Hayward CL200 chlorinator
    Polaris 380/Hayward 6060 booster pump

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Quote Originally Posted by sktn77a View Post
    If you are buying all of the "standard size" equipment from the US, how are you going to connect it to your "non-standard", locally sourced PVC pipe?

    Yes, you might want to get "standard" PVC piping and fittings from the closest available source with overage for future repairs.
    Guess I could ask the same question? "Turn to fit"...found this Blog and I'm stumped The album link does not work but here is how the poster turn the pipe to fit the Jandy valve. More pictures! Unbelievable...
    Thought the Philippines had long been since adopted and referenced both ASTM International and ANSI standard as Phils National Standard. AFAIK, Phils is the only country in the South East Asia that follows and use American standard. Am I wrong?

    It would be very interesting to know what do locals use to plumb their pool. I think it is best for the OP to look deeper into this matter.

    OTOH, found this very interesting Blog by Patrick @ INYOPOOLS..."How Much Does A Pool Cost"?
    A 15' x 30' IG pool in the Phils cost a little over $5k to build. Really? I think I know now where I want to retired! OP, here I come...
    Last edited by Meadow; 12-04-2017 at 01:35 PM. Reason: added link
    20k gallons, IG plaster with raised Spa, Hayward C-4000 cartridge, Hayward TriStar SP3202VSP, Hayward H400 gas heater, Hayward Super II (2HP) Spa jets, Hayward Swimpure Plus T-15,
    Intermatic PS3000 SPD, PureLine-PureColor LED's, Dolphin Triton cleaning robot, Taylor K-2006, K-1766, OTO Test kit & various Guess strips.

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    I'm guessing the connection was turned down to fill, or trimmed in a lathe, not home gamer stuff
    Intex 24' x 52" Closed for 2017/18 Winter
    2 Main Drains, hard lined 1.25" and 1.5" PVC
    1/2 HP Intex Pump w/ 42 lb 13" Sand Filter

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Quote Originally Posted by sktn77a View Post
    If you are buying all of the "standard size" equipment from the US, how are you going to connect it to your "non-standard", locally sourced PVC pipe? Yes, you might want to get "standard" PVC piping and fittings from the closest available source with overage for future repairs.

    Local pool builders here have quoted Neltex brand pipes, which are ok but not as good quality as Atlanta Blue In-House pvc pipes. Both are O.D 63mm for 2" pipes, so one way to get them to fit is to shave the PVC down as another person (here in Philippines) did for an outdoor pool that he could easily dig the soil to access any leaks on these shaved pvc joints. It was a good solution for his pool and certainly saved him some money by using locally made pvc pipes.


    Although more expensive, I plan on using IPEX brand imported pvc pipe (shipped from Manila distributor) so that my pvc pipes fit properly without having to grind down the pvc pipe as our pool will be indoor and any underground leaks would be more costly to detect/repair.


    Yes, I realize contractors want to supply everything so they can increase their profits, but that often leads to using leftover materials or substandard china-made products. I prefer to supply as many items as I can to ensure no expired glue or inferior parts and negotiate the builder's profit separately. If he's not happy, I will simply find another builder. I've learned you cannot rely on seller warranties here, so the best protection is to rely on the quality of the components themselves.


    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow View Post
    A 40k gallon Salt cell maybe the cheapest route to sanitize your pool water since your air temp does not go below 70 F.

    My concerns with SWCG are the high initial equipment costs, replacement costs, and the corrosion. Chlorine pools seems to be the preferred here. Perhaps that is due in part to fewer residential pools and being more familiar experience with public pools.


    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow View Post
    I’ll go with Hayward Tristar VS pump (SP3202VSP) and 400 sq ft Super Star Clear Cartdrige (x4 filter) to avoid the much complicated and cumbersome DE. Cartridge filter eliminates sewer line connection.

    The 1.65 hp Hayward SP2303VSP costs $655 vs 1.85 hp Hayward TriStar SP3202VSP at $960 or higher. I don't plan on having any separate spa, water features, or high-end automation so I see no reason to spend an extra $300 for upgrade to TriStar in my specific case.

    These pool filters are too large for me to import myself and the Hayward brand DE filter here costs much more than comparable size Pentair DE filter, so I prefer to stick with Pentair brand filter. The local builders have been recommending DE filters and because of the micron level that's what I've focused on. Based on your input, I will have to look more closely at Pentair Clean & Clear Plus filters. The Pentair 180008 FNS Plus 48 sqft 96 GPM DE filter I had planned to use costs $665 in USA (a little more from the Manila distributor) while the Pentair 160301 420 sqft 150 GPM costs $888 or the Pentair 160340 320 sqft costs $725, but you suggested 400 sqft so I'll look at the sizing and check pricing with the Pentair distributor here. Thx!


    Anyone else have a suggestion on DE vs Cartridge filters ?


    How important is it to have "looped" returns ? Should these all be connected "for balance" or not really worth the extra piping ?


    Thanks for all the great advice.
    Pool under design is approx. 13,000 gallon rectangular (30 x 13.5 ft) in-ground concrete pool with avg depth 4.25 ft, no spa, no water features. Pentair 160301 Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter, 150 GPM. Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pump, 230 Volt... in Philippines

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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow View Post
    OTOH, found this very interesting Blog by Patrick @ INYOPOOLS..."How Much Does A Pool Cost"? A 15' x 30' IG pool in the Phils cost a little over $5k to build. Really? I think I know now where I want to retired! OP, here I come...
    Based on my calculations (see previous posted links) our 13.5 x 30 ft x 4.25 (avg depth) will costs ~P300,000 in basic materials (cement, sand, rebar) so at Php 50 per dollar exchange rate that's $6000 USD. You could eliminate the hollow block formworks and use plywood instead with a poured pool wall but it's probably a tradoff of hollow blocks vs labor to build the heavy duty plywood form. You can also go cheaper on the thickness of the pool shell or reduce the rebar, but that's the material costs. Add costs of good equipment which in my situation is ~3000 USD and extra money for PVC pipes and electricals. If you did all the work yourself, I think it could be done for $11,000 to $12,000. If you use local labor, add $X. If you use relatives to help you, add $X*X + lots of food and beer (haha). The local builders have quoted inferior equipment but their prices have ranged from P800,000 to P1.5M (i.e. $20,000 USD = P1 Million Philippine pesos) with the highest (most ridiculous) bid being P2.3M pesos. Tiles and other accessories are extra.

    I've seen some of the extremely large and beautiful pools a few people on this forum have built and WOW !!! That's a lot of rice money (haha).
    Pool under design is approx. 13,000 gallon rectangular (30 x 13.5 ft) in-ground concrete pool with avg depth 4.25 ft, no spa, no water features. Pentair 160301 Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter, 150 GPM. Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pump, 230 Volt... in Philippines

  16. Back To Top    #16
    Meadow's Avatar
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    Temecula, CA
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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Quote Originally Posted by melinphils View Post
    How important is it to have "looped" returns ? Should these all be connected "for balance" or not really worth the extra piping ?
    I don't have an answer but for reference I'm sharing the layout of our 17 year old pool from which I inherited 2 years ago. So far, it is being work on...resurface, new tiles and coping. Hate that flaky flagstone coping!
    Return:
    Return from the pump is a 2" pipe run, reduced to 1" I.D. (3x) bare (no grate or fitting). R-1 has the highest output @50%, R-2 @ 35% and R-3 @ 15%. I am not sure if they use "T" , "Y", or "y" connection. It is a return and I don't see how a safety grate comes into play. A return fitting will allow you to divert the flow of water.

    Suction:
    Skimmer has a diverter and share with 2x Main drain in a single 2" run. Oh...and we also have the now extinct suction side port for vacuum cleaner.

    Hope others can chime in and steer you in the right track.

    20k gallons, IG plaster with raised Spa, Hayward C-4000 cartridge, Hayward TriStar SP3202VSP, Hayward H400 gas heater, Hayward Super II (2HP) Spa jets, Hayward Swimpure Plus T-15,
    Intermatic PS3000 SPD, PureLine-PureColor LED's, Dolphin Triton cleaning robot, Taylor K-2006, K-1766, OTO Test kit & various Guess strips.

  17. Back To Top    #17

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    Davao City, Philippines
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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    My spouse asked me a question today... Why do I have to spend so much time at the computer doing all this "stuff", researching, drawing, comparing, etc... and why not just let the builder do everything the way he wants it? I explained that it's because "we" want our house & pool built correctly, with quality parts, and with an good (energy efficient) design so "we" will be very happy and not complaining (at me) for the next 20-years :--)

    After doing more research, I fully agree that a cartridge filter would probably be better for us than a DE filter. We're still considering the robotic cleaner but haven't decided yet.

    Here are our updated design drawings and specifications. With the wonderful advice from members here, I think it's pretty close and time to go visit the pool builders again for a round of discussions.

    Dropbox - POOL LAYOUT (PLUMBING) #3.png
    Dropbox - POOL LAYOUT (EQUIPMENT) #3.png
    Dropbox - POOL SPECS #3.pdf

    Thanks again to everyone!
    -Mel
    Pool under design is approx. 13,000 gallon rectangular (30 x 13.5 ft) in-ground concrete pool with avg depth 4.25 ft, no spa, no water features. Pentair 160301 Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter, 150 GPM. Hayward SP2303vsp Max-Flo VS Variable-Speed Pump, 230 Volt... in Philippines

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    sktn77a's Avatar
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    May 2010
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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Quote Originally Posted by melinphils View Post
    My spouse asked me a question today... Why do I have to spend so much time at the computer doing all this "stuff", researching, drawing, comparing, etc... and why not just let the builder do everything the way he wants it?
    How sweet............. they just don't get it, do they!
    Keith
    15,000 gallon in-ground gunite/plaster pool, 1.5" PVC plumbing
    1.0HP Sta-Rite DuraGlass P2R pump, Hayward S244T sand filter
    Teledyne-Laars Lite-2 250k heater, Hayward CL200 chlorinator
    Polaris 380/Hayward 6060 booster pump

  19. Back To Top    #19
    Meadow's Avatar
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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    Mel, I sent you PM.

    Iím not an expert but I must say, the orientation of the diverter valves I marked with ďXĒ are wrong! Also, a check valve is not needed before the filter. If the skimmer level is higher than the pump then a gate valve is more suitable when conducting maintenance on the pump.

    I can't figure out the purpose of those 2 Jandy valves on the pumpís output. Are they for maintenance purposes like draining the pool? But why 2? Remember, you canít let the pump run dry and risk damaging it! Pump output to filter input port requires a direct connection to reduce head loss. A sump pump is ideal when draining a pool. Eliminating one check valve and 2 Jandy valves should at least help you cut cost.

    The waste water line by the drain port of the filter is not necessary! With the pump off, open the air release valve. This will enable the water inside the filter to flow back down the pump suction line and then back to the pool. Only then you can open the filter or the pump basket lid for maintenance. Only use the drain plug to release the small amount of water sitting at the base of the filter. A gallon or two at the most.

    Last but not the least, are you sure you want to install the returns too close to the skimmer?

    Iím sure I miss something and hoping experts will chime in. Iíll learn along with you.

    20k gallons, IG plaster with raised Spa, Hayward C-4000 cartridge, Hayward TriStar SP3202VSP, Hayward H400 gas heater, Hayward Super II (2HP) Spa jets, Hayward Swimpure Plus T-15,
    Intermatic PS3000 SPD, PureLine-PureColor LED's, Dolphin Triton cleaning robot, Taylor K-2006, K-1766, OTO Test kit & various Guess strips.

  20. Back To Top    #20
    cfherrman's Avatar
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    May 2017
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    Hays, Kansas
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    Re: Need Advice on Plumbing & Equipment for Pool in Philippines

    I thought you he same about those two valves, couldn't you set the filter to waste to drain the pool, or is that a sand filter thing? You also could only drain the pool to the main drain level so a sump pump is better in this regard.

    I see that meadow x'd out the main drain 3 way valve, should that stay as you can throttle them back as the main drains will only be 10% of suction?

    You have the main drain pvc listed as 2.5", you will barely be using those and 2.5" is way Overkill. Only need the 2.5" in the combined run of the drains and the skimmer, from the x'd 3 way to the pump, and from the skimmer 3 ways to the x'd 3 way as you already have listed.

    As meadow mentioned I am not a expert as well.
    Intex 24' x 52" Closed for 2017/18 Winter
    2 Main Drains, hard lined 1.25" and 1.5" PVC
    1/2 HP Intex Pump w/ 42 lb 13" Sand Filter

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