How do I blow-out my pool lines? Need help understanding my plumbing.

[rdelisa]

I've owned the house that came with this in-ground, fiberglass pool for 10 years now and have to confess that I've never really understood the plumbing enough to feel comfortable closing the pool myself. I am tired and broke of paying $400 a year to get the pool closed. I would like to blow-out the lines using my 5HP shop vac. What kind of adapter is needed to connect the Vac hose? I've seen about a dozen different YouTube videos online and no single one of them does it the same way or has quite my same plumbing. I've attached some pictures of my equipment, hoping maybe someone can give me some guidance here.

Below is the photo of my pool equipment while in normal operating mode. This is the position my valve is in when the pool is running. The other side of the valve is labeled VAC. I never use this setting. When I vacuum my pool I do it from the back hole of the skimmer and the valve remains in the normal operating-mode position as pictured here.



Here you can see the picture of the vacuum port on the side of the pool which I never use. Is this the one that goes to the Vac line I references above?



Below is the opposite side of my sand filter. The valve is turned to Jets. The other side is for Fountain.


Here is the picture of my skimmer. I use the back hole (One farthest from the Pool) to vacuum the pool.


Here is what my drain looks like below? Is this where the front hole of the skimmer leads to?



Here is my fountain



Some Additional Questions:
Where would I attach the blower hose to blow out the jets, vacuum line, main drain, and fountain and in what order and what changes do I need to make to the valves during the process? Finally, After pulling the plugs on the pump basket, sand filter and heater, do I need to blow water out of those as well or just let them drain and do I do this part last? I know this is a lot of information and there are so many different ways to do this. I think I would be fairly confident of getting the pipes winterized if I had a better understanding where everything goes and in which order to do things. Greatly appreciated!

Thanks,

Rob

 

[Catanzaro]

Rob:

Heading out, but I can help you close your pool. Please read over this post that I put together, including all the links. Your set up is fairly easy and the only issue you may have is clearing out the main drain line. Outside of this, it is very possible to close the pool without any problems. At present, the Cyclone is on sale and with a 3' 1.5" hose, your total investment would be a one time $325. This is a professional pool blower.

If not, you can still use a compressor to clear the main drain line and/or a shop vac. Concept is the same and you will need to push air through the system, etc. Also, your skimmer, is it hooked up to the main drain? Are both ports pulling water at the same time? You can place a small leaf in each port and this will get suctioned to the pump basket.

The concept of closing an inground swimming pool

 

[rdelisa]

Thank you for the help. The main drain line is where I get most confused.
As to answering your question. My vacuum port appears to be the only one pulling water. I put a leave near the other port and nothing is happening in that port while the pump is running. I assume this port is what leads to the main drain line at bottom of pool and can be blown out separately?

Rob:

Heading out, but I can help you close your pool. Please read over this post that I put together, including all the links. Your set up is fairly easy and the only issue you may have is clearing out the main drain line. Outside of this, it is very possible to close the pool without any problems. At present, the Cyclone is on sale and with a 3' 1.5" hose, your total investment would be a one time $325. This is a professional pool blower.

If not, you can still use a compressor to clear the main drain line and/or a shop vac. Concept is the same and you will need to push air through the system, etc. Also, your skimmer, is it hooked up to the main drain? Are both ports pulling water at the same time? You can place a small leaf in each port and this will get suctioned to the pump basket.

The concept of closing an inground swimming pool

 

[Catanzaro]

Thank you for the help. The main drain line is where I get most confused.
As to answering your question. My vacuum port appears to be the only one pulling water. I put a leave near the other port and nothing is happening in that port while the pump is running. I assume this port is what leads to the main drain line at bottom of pool and can be blown out separately?

If the main drain is open, then the leaf should be pulled in. Which vacuum port are you referring to? The one in the skimmer or the pool? The skimmer should be pulling as well. Try placing something small and sturdy slowly to see if it drops 4"-6". If not, you will need to figure out which one is your main drain. On your suction side, you have 2 lines coming in. Assuming one is the main drain and one is the skimmer. It is possible that the main drain is plumbed separately.

You will have to blow air through the system. It will probably be best to use an air compressor, in where at the pump there is an NPT fitting. You remove the screw and the fitting goes in the thread, which then attaches to an air compressor hose. Once you have this figured out, the system will need to be isolated. You could close the main drain and blow out the skimmer only first. The MPV valve should be on closed. Then work on the main drain and create an "air lock". Once you are done, then move MPV to recirculate and work on the returns and plug one at a time.

Because your valve controls both the main drain and skimmers, you may need to close this off completely first and blow out the returns first. Then after you are done, close the MPV and work on main drain and skimmer.

You have Pentair valves with locking pins. You will have to lift the handle and move the handle to close the suction side first. Think of the pool as 2 hoses attached together. Water is coming from the main source to both hoses. What you are essentially doing is blowing air through the hose at the attachment in opposite directions. Back to the source is the main drain/skimmer and to the end is the return area. Hope this helps!

 

[PoolFool.]

It looks to me like the Jandy valve to the pump supply is half closed off.
If you move that valve near the door to have the handle point into your pump room, that is in the direction that water travels to your pump, are there more skimmers and drains that start working?

 

[rdelisa]

Thank you PoolFool,

Sorry for the long delay in reply. As a school teacher, I was unusually busy this week, but I still plan to get this pool closed. You are right. In normal operating mode, I keep the Jandy Valve pointed as shown in the picture. The valve remains in this position when I backwash the pool and water drains out the main drain outside of my yard. This pipe is labelled, Skimmer. The other, opposite facing pipe is labelled, VAC, and I have never used this. I assume this is the pipe that leads to the vacuum port at the side of the pool?

I am most confused about the main drain? Is there a valve or pipe that leads to the drain at the bottom of the pool? As you can tell, I have very little understanding of my pool plumbing.

My vague understanding so far is that I should lower the water a few inches below the simmer. Plug the vac blower hose into the Vac port in the skimmer and water should blow out of the jets. I should plug each port after the water stops flowing. Next, I should turn the valve to the fountain to flow water through the vacuum slit. I have PVC pipes to screw into the skimmer ports and plugs to insert into them. I can use AntiFreeze for extra assurance.

After that, I am unsure what to do or how to blow and air-lock the main drain. I am also uncertain how to blow out the pipes, filter, and heater, in the pump room.

Thanks again for all your help.

Rob

 

[Chemnut]

Fairly simple closing. Connect/hold a shop vac or cyclone to the the union located before the pump. Blow into the pump until all lines are empty, remember to burp them with a closing plug. Then switch and blow into the union in the direction of that valve. It's position now is to skimmer. Blow that free, then move valve to close, then blow again to remove water from your dedicated suction line.

 

[rdelisa]

You make it sound very simple. Looking at my plumbing I don’t know how I would fit a shop vac hose aagainst that section of pipe. I don’t see where there is any access to it without removing some plumbing.

 

[Catanzaro]

You make it sound very simple. Looking at my plumbing I don’t know how I would fit a shop vac hose aagainst that section of pipe. I don’t see where there is any access to it without removing some plumbing.

You will probably need to use an air compressor with an NPT fitting. Shop vacs, IMO do not work very well. Some people have had success, but this is probably due to the fact that they lower the water below the returns.

 

[Chemnut]

Undo the unions on suction and return sides, slide pump out if the way. Use a good shop vac to blow all lines free of water. If you are going to start doing this yourself invest in a cyclone. One pool closing and it has paid for itself.

 

[rdelisa]

My pool is an extremely long ways from where my Pump is, so the chances are good the Shop-Vac might not have the power.
Removing the union from the pump and sliding that pump out of the way makes me fear that I will create water leaks when I open the pool next spring.
Would it be as effective to blow air in the opposite direction from the skimmer itself?

I'm seriously considering buying the cyclone. What would I need to order as far as a hose and the proper fittings for either my skimmer ports or the union on the pipe by the pump? Would these three items suffice for either method?

Thanks so much,

Rob

 

[Chemnut]

Cyclone, 1.5" mptxslip connector plus 2' spa flex plus the exact same union that is on your pipes

 

[Catanzaro]

Rdelisa:

Shop around as I have seen the Cyclone for about $289 on sale. Everything should be less, but you have all the necessary parts that are needed. Below are the parts that I ordered. Part #'s may have changed, but this is what I did. Invest in the Cyclone. You can work from the skimmer with the set up you have in your post as well.

Modified Cover for Swimming Pools

Modified Cover for Hayward Super Pump for Closing Swimming Pool

 

[rdelisa]

Thank you, both.

In deciding where to do the blowing: If I blow from the pump side of things, isn't that going to blow the water back up into the skimmer and drain back down into the pipes? Where-as if I blow from the skimmer, the water will go out the jets?

My second question. On the right side of my pool furnace I have a Jandy valve that changes water flow from Jets to Fountain. Should I change the valve to fountain after I blow out the skimmer and vacuum lines?

Rdelisa:

Shop around as I have seen the Cyclone for about $289 on sale. Everything should be less, but you have all the necessary parts that are needed. Below are the parts that I ordered. Part #'s may have changed, but this is what I did. Invest in the Cyclone. You can work from the skimmer with the set up you have in your post as well.

Modified Cover for Swimming Pools

Modified Cover for Hayward Super Pump for Closing Swimming Pool

 

[pookiesunshine]

......In deciding where to do the blowing: If I blow from the pump side of things, isn't that going to blow the water back up into the skimmer and drain back down into the pipes? Where-as if I blow from the skimmer, the water will go out the jets?
....

Many people use a gizmo in the skimmer hole. that would allow you to blow back from the pump without letting the water flow back into the pipe. Whether you drain the pool level below the skimmer opening or not, you can use the pump to mostly empty the skimmer line before blowing it out (if you dont drain below skimmer, gizmo will let you do this. obviously, if using a gizmo, remove the plug in the top of the gizmo while pumping or blowing water out).

 

[Catanzaro]

In deciding where to do the blowing: If I blow from the pump side of things, isn't that going to blow the water back up into the skimmer and drain back down into the pipes? Where-as if I blow from the skimmer, the water will go out the jets?

If you are working from the skimmers, then you need to control air flow through the shut off valves. Air is travelling from the skimmer back through the filter (on recirculate) and then to either the other skimmer or main drain and/or return jets. The main drain should be shut off until the end. You will find that the Cyclone is powerful enough to work all areas without shutting them off. As each area is cleared of water and capped off, move on to the next.

 

[rdelisa]

I bit the bullet and got the Cyclone for $289.00 and free shipping. Thanks for the tip. So now I am invested in doing this right.
Now, I am about to ask the most ignorant question in the history of this entire forum: How do I turn off or control main drain? That is not something I've ever worried about. As you can see from my top picture. I have a Jandy Valve going out to the skimmer and another line which is actually labelled Vac. Turning the valve to the off position in the middle of both closes the main drain?

If you are working from the skimmers, then you need to control air flow through the shut off valves. Air is travelling from the skimmer back through the filter (on recirculate) and then to either the other skimmer or main drain and/or return jets. The main drain should be shut off until the end. You will find that the Cyclone is powerful enough to work all areas without shutting them off. As each area is cleared of water and capped off, move on to the next.

 

[Catanzaro]

Turning the valve to the off position in the middle of both closes the main drain?

You just answered your own question. Keep the valve open until the main drain bubbles on the surface of the pool for about 45 to 60 seconds and then turn valve to off position in the middle and the main drain will be locked with air. Make sure you shut off Cyclone at the same time not to build up back pressure.

 

[rdelisa]

You just answered your own question. Keep the valve open until the main drain bubbles on the surface of the pool for about 45 to 60 seconds and then turn valve to off position in the middle and the main drain will be locked with air. Make sure you shut off Cyclone at the same time not to build up back pressure.

I assume that the main drain will begin to bubble after I inserted plugs in all of the jets with the Cyclone still blowing since water has no place else to go??

Also, just to confirm a couple steps before I begin blowing:
1. Backwash a few inches below the skimmer line?
2. Turn main valve off to get as much water possible out of pipes?

And I do have a couple of homemade gizmos that my previous pool guy used constructed from PVC pipe. I will re-use those.

 

[Catanzaro]

Sounds good! Keep the main drain closed until the end. Then open up when you are ready. This will be your last step before winterizing the filter, heater, and cover. Also, please add your signature.