Unable to maintain chlorine levels - help

sas90

0
Jul 31, 2017
105
edmond/ok
Hello,

A little background first - we purchased the home in April 2016; the pool was only 1 yr old (installed Summer 2015). It had a high (100+) CYA level. It took a full year to get the CYA level below 80. Most recently, the local pool store has reported our CYA readings as low as 30 (late June/early July) and as high as 60 (as of 7/27). As of 7/27, all other readings (ph, TA, Calcium, TDS, phosphates) are in normal ranges except free and total chlorine which are both 0; PH 7.4, TA 80, Calcium hardness 290, TDS 800 and 0 phosphates. We did leave the pool open over the winter months and for the most part only ran the filter when it was below freezing. the walls of the fiberglass did turn green but the water never did. in the spring, i shocked it, scrubbed the walls, and we haven't been able to maintain a chlorine level since yet the water is crystal clear.

We have an inline chlorinator that holds 3 inch chlorine tabs that I keep full and maxed out at a 5 on the "rate" dial. additionally, we use non-CYA powdered shock which will provide a chlorine level (not much over 3-5 and sometimes less) for about 8-12 hours and then fades away, by the following day there is 0 chlorine left in our water.

As of 7/27 (when i learned the CYA was back at 60), i have turned the chlorinator back down to a 3 only because nothing seems to help and now our CYA has risen! And, i certainly don't want to battle high CYA levels again! After a few days of not shocking the pool (because it's very expensive), i will notice some green discoloration (patchy areas) on the fiberglass walls. The areas aren't bigger than 2-5 inches and they scrub away easily with no residual effect on the water, i.e. the water does not turn cloudy at the area where i scrubbed the green discoloration. the local pool store tells me it's probably pollen rather than algae but they have no explanation or guidance (other than continual shock which is expensive) on the reason for 0 chlorine levels.

i'm getting really frustrated because i'm told fiberglass pools are the easiest to maintain! So far, it's been quite difficult!

i noticed an old forum (2010?) of a gentleman with a much larger capacity pool have the same issue and it was suggested to use bleach (household type bleach?) instead because there was most likely an algae still lurking. i used pool math to determine the amount of 6% bleach but not sure how many treatments i need to do to be sure this issue goes away permanently.

also - which is probably a side note and not related - our gauge reads around 40 since we've owned the pool. i noticed in another area of your site that the gauge shouldn't be much above 20? when the pump is off, the reading is 30 so i'm guessing we have a bad gauge?

i also have an automated vacuum that i run faithfully at the first sign of any debris on the floor of the pool.

my pool appears clean; people tell me they've never seen such a clean, clear pool but it's not sanitizing which concerns me greatly!

hopefully, i've provided enough information that some guidance can be given as to what i need to do next to rid myself of this problem, hopefully permanently.

thanks for any help!
 
Welcome! You've come to the right place. Sounds like you have a few problems, the biggest of which is the pool store!
It's proven time and time again that we just cannot trust pool store testing. The test they are often the worst at is the CYA result and that is one of the most important tests. You need quality, at home testing! It's easy and we can help. Nobody cares more about your pool than you do, get a kit and take control.

We use either the TF100 or the K-2006c. These kits are different than others in that they use an FAS/DPD chlorine test that is very accurate and will give you an actual number instead of a range and can test very high levels. With exception of the PH & CYA tests, the tests rely on complete color shift rather than matching shades so the results are much easier to read. The kits range from $70-100 which may seem expensive but I promise they save far more than they cost. Don't worry about TDS or Phosphates, those are scare tactics the pool stores use to sell you overpriced remedies.

You need to stop using any of the dry forms of chlorine. Those tablets, powder or granular shock add extras you may not want, especially CYA. When CYA increases, FC levels must also be increased in order to compensate! If you use liquid pool shock, liquid chlorine, or plain old household bleach you will not increase CYA further.

No matter the name these products are all Sodium Hypochlorite, the only difference is the concentration. Most of the Pool chlorine products are stronger at 10-12.5% while bleach is 6-8.25%. The lower concentrations keep longer and can be picked up at the grocery store. I use plain great value bleach from walmart, it's 8.25% and always fresh.

With a CYA of 60 you need to maintain FC around 7-9 and never let it fall below 5. Two things consume your chlorine, sun and fighting algae/bacteria. Since you have a CYA of 60 the sun is not likely your problem, you have algae working to get established. Get one of these kits ordered right away, if you go with the TF100 order the XL option and if the budget allows get a speedstir, it makes testing much easier. Also, it does sound like you need a new gauge, they can fix you up with one of those too.

While waiting for your kit, add one gallon of bleach each day by pouring it in a small stream directly in front of your return jet. When you get your kit, run a set of tests and post the results, we can help. Brush the pool daily to help the chlorine kill whatever is growing. Follow the pool school link at the top of the page to begin learning how you can have a trouble free pool.
 
As long as you are using pucks you will be battling high CYA. If you are interested in taking control of your pool, the first thing you need is accurate testing. Everything we do here is based on very accurate and consistent testing, then adding only exactly what is needed. No pool store magic potions, or combination products that add unwanted and unneeded chemicals.

Liquid chlorine, liquid "shock" and plain unscented laundry bleach are all the very same chemical. The only difference is concentration ranging from 8.25% for concentrated bleach and 10-12% for pool store liquid chlorine. It is also the only form of chlorine you can add to a pool that doesn't add extra unwanted chemicals.

Get yourself a good test kit. Unfortunately you will need to order it online, pool stores don't stock the right ones, even if you could find one it would be very doubtful that the reagents would be fresh. So order that test kit, add bleach each day while waiting for it to arrive, and one other thing you can do is start reading and studying Pool School, that's the button at the upper right of this page. It has all the information you will need to manage your pool. It may seem a bit overwhelming at first, but with some study will all fit together and begin to make sense.

Welcome to the work of Trouble Free Pools. There are thousands of happy pool owners here, and many experts who will be ready and able to answer any questions you have and help you along the way.
 
thanks to all that responded; i will get the test kit ordered and begin using liquid bleach! I will post back once I know where I'm at with the new test kit. And, I have been reading some of the pool school info. It sounds like I will need to "SLAM" but can't do that until I have one of those test kits?

***with the use of liquid bleach, how long before it is safe to swim? I've been told the rule of thumb is 4 hr wait time when using powdered shock but didn't know if it's the same or different when using liquid bleach?
thanks again!
 
You do need to have a proper test kit that can test FC above 10 ppm before you can do a SLAM. In the meantime - keep adding bleach to keep at least a FC based on 10% of your CYA level. If you cannot test that high, just add it each day based on PoolMath.

Take care.
 
thanks again to everyone that has responded!

is there any concern for skin or swimwear with FC levels so high? i was under the impression residential pools shouldn't have FC levels much higher than 4 ppm. it sounds like by using liquid bleach my levels may and need to be 6 or higher for awhile? I assume once i get the kit and use the SLAM method the pool will be off limits to any swimmers?
 
You can safely swim in the pool with FC up to shock level based on your CYA; you can see the bottom of the deep end; and your pH was 7.2 to 7.8 when you tested before the SLAM started.

You will need to read more of Pool school - but the 4 ppm thing is not valid. Your FC depends on your CYA in the pool.

Take care.
 

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Hello again
I received my TF100 kit in the mail! My FC is .5 and CC is .5; making my TC 1.0. My CYA was near 50. My TA is 90. My ph is 7.6. i'm going to plug my #s in and begin the SLAM process; hoping to get things resolved now! thanks for any thoughts or suggestions!
 
I want to make sure all my information is correct in the pool math calculator so i re-measured my pool. it looks like i have more galloons than i was originally told. it is an oval, free form (irregular) shaped pull. at the widest it's approximately 14 ft and at the longest it's approximately 33 ft. the shallow end is approximately 4 ft while the deep end is approximately 6 ft. I'm getting approx. 15,700 galloons; is this correct?
 
You can check your numbers by adding acid or chlorine. Add a specific amount of one of them that is calculated to change either the pH or FC by a certain amount based on a pool volume. Circulate your pool for 30 minutes, re test, and use the answer you got in pool math to narrow down your volume.

- - - Updated - - -

Might want to use the acid if you have an algae outbreak ----
 
i have another question; on testing for FC and CC. The test instructions indicate to apply drops until it turns clear. is this the 1st time it turns clear or need to keep adding drops until it remains clear. i notice when i remove from the speed stir and it sets for a little while (seconds to a minute), it has a very slight pink to it. but, at the time it was clear on the speed stir.
 
Once the test turns clear, the test is over. You then immediately do the CC test, if so desired.

The sample will turn pink if left for some time. Means nothing.
 
Update - I've poured a lot of 96 oz jugs of chlorine (bleach) into the pool today based on pool math's direction. Before i began the SLAM process, my CYA was 50 which indicates a FC Shock level of 20 is needed. After the 1st hour, i adjusted my pool volume (pool math calculator) slightly based on my FC reading at that time. I believe i'm around 13,200 galloon pool.
My FC hasn't been lower than 10.5 today and that was after about 3 hours after the second application today. i've had my vacuum running about half of the time and brushed the entire pool surface about 4 times and i have completed 1 back wash and 1 rinse cycle. This evening (at dusk), i did another round of chlorine and 1 hr later (after dark) my FC is 21. Which i realize is higher than where it needs to be; it called for 1.9 jugs and i ended up pouring 2 jugs. i will check it again in the morning but i won't be surprised if it's dropped given the earlier readings just after a few hours. Oh, my CCs have ranged from .5 to 1; most recent reading (when FC was 21), the CC was .5. My water has remained clear throughout the day. seems the only thing i'm missing is maintaining FC!
Questions - through the SLAM process do i need to re-check my CYA at some point to make sure i'm maintaining the right FC shock level? I have calcium hypo-chlorite 73%; is it ok to use this or should i stick with household bleach (6 or 8.25 %)? once i have not lost more than 1 ppm overnight, my CC is .5 and water is clear what do i do then? i.e. do i turn my in-line chlorinator back on? And, if so, what setting on a 5 dial? Or, should i just continue to maintain FC with household bleach?
 

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