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Thread: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

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    Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    My 2 HP Pool motor died and thinking to replace with Variable Speed Motor. Challenge is to integrate with Aqualogic Automation and Chlorination PS-8. I read few posts and concluded that I can install replacement VS motor but have to control water flow from motor built in controller.

    Questions -
    1) If I use Aqualogic Timer and provide Power to VS motor through relay the way I do for current motor - will it damage VS motor ? as it has on board controller for power on/off (timer) and expects continuous power from source.
    Also using Aqualogic times will make sure pool cleaner interlock so that cleaner is started only after pool motor is running.

    2) Can I disable freeze protection in motor so that I utilize freeze protection from Aqualogic ? As Aqualogic toggles water to Pool and spa during freeze by using remote controlled Jandy Valves.

    3) Or should I just go with 2 speed motor and control it with Aqualogic using 2 relays. (I still have to understand how but I see it is possible and Aqualogic will control 2 speeds) ?
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    First you have to check to see what revision your aqualogic board is. I believe you need 2.6 and higher, otherwise it will not control a VS pump. If your board is okay I would look into the Hayward Ecostar pump. THP of 2.7

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    Quote Originally Posted by kadavis View Post
    First you have to check to see what revision your aqualogic board is. I believe you need 2.6 and higher, otherwise it will not control a VS pump. If your board is okay I would look into the Hayward Ecostar pump. THP of 2.7
    Unless you are going with a Hayward VS, this doesn't matter.


    BCJ, you mentioned replacing the just motor with a VS motor but I just wanted to make sure you meant just the motor and not the entire pump.

    1) It shouldn't. Most VS drives can recover gracefully from power outages as still remember the programmed settings. But depending on the drive you may be able to configure relays for speed switching too.

    2) Depends on which drive/motor you are going with.

    3) Yes, you can control a two speed motor with the AquaLogic.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    Correct I want to replace only motor.
    My Aqua logic main SW is 2.4 so I need to upgrade this to control Hayward VS motor. That will be expensive.
    So, I have 2 Options -
    a) Use 2 speed Motor like A O Smith B2984 (This will provide less savings in Electricity bill)
    or
    b) Use generic VS Motor. EcoTech EZ 2.4 HP or AO Smith ECM27SQU
    - Disable Timer and Freeze protection in Motor and program lower flow for the season
    - Power ON and OFF motor everyday through Aqualogic using Aqua Logic timer (say 10 hrs per day). - this power on/off every day will not harm motor/ drive.

    Question 1 - Will this Option B work ?

    Question 2 - A O Smith & others have some kind of automation adapter kit that will allow me to control everything , part number 2517501-001. but it is not clear how ? As Aqualogic does not have any setting for variable speed.
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    Question 1 - Will this Option B work ?
    Of course it will "work" but it depends on what you mean by "work".

    Question 2 - A O Smith & others have some kind of automation adapter kit that will allow me to control everything , part number 2517501-001. but it is not clear how ? As Aqualogic does not have any setting for variable speed.
    You would simply connect these to available relays. You would then program each AUX relay to operate one at a time. The limitation is how many available relays you have.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    Mark - what I meant by "work" in Option 1 is - Motor (including on board controls) are not damaged by regular switching power ON/OFF through Aqualogic Timer Relays as my understanding is VS motor has all the controls on board and it expects direct connection to circuit breaker for continuous power. It does store setting in case of power failure but that happens once in couple of months in US. So, it may not be designed for power ON/OFF 2 times a day. This is the only concern.

    Will I be able to disable Freeze control as it will conflict with Aqua logic freeze control. During freeze aqualogic runs pump for Pool for 30 min. then switched pump off pump during interlock when valve are moving to spa only then runs pump for 30 min for spa and repeats this. I don;t want to lose this.
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    I don't think you will need to turn on and off the motor via the AquaLogic. I believe, you can keep the motor powered all the time and turn it on on off via one of the control logic lines (i.e. close any of the relays and it turns on). As for freeze control, you should be able to turn it on and off on either unit depending on how you want it set up.

    But by the time you pay for the motor and the interface, it won't be that much more to get a new VS pump.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    Even if I go for VS Pump like INTELLIFLOW Variable Speed Pump I still have same problem to integrate with Aqualogic. I could use timer in pump but this Aqualogic also switches Valves during freeze between pool and spa lines.
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    I believe the IntelliFlo requires the IntelliComm for external control but the SuperFlo does not. The SuperFlo is a cheaper pump too but it is not as powerful as the IntelliFlo.

    Will this pump be running spa jets? If so, the EcoStar VS or TriStar VS might be a better choice since it has the relay connections already on the pump. Plus if you upgrade the board later, you get full control. You might even find a cheap upgrade like I did on eBay.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    I called Century to get their feedback on Variable Speed Motor ECM27SQU ; they say I can't control (on/off ) using Aqualogic Timer and I have to buy Automation Adapter. Motor expects continuous power.
    I am kind of lost as I will need many relays in Aqualogic even with this kit.

    Looks like 2 speed motor is the only solution I have. I have to re purpose one of the relay used for light by combining Pool & Spa lights in to one relay and use it for low speed.
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    A 2 speed motor will most likely have a lower lifetime cost anyway for your area because of the difference in up front costs.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    One last question - I have pressure side Pool Cleaner running with separate Pump but it is interlocked with pool pump. Do I need High Speed in Pool Pump to run this properly or it will run OK at lower speed on pool pump.
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    For a pressure side cleaner without a booster, you will probably need full speed. But you may be able to redirect some of the flow to the returns. Do you do that now?
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    I have booster pump for cleaner. Therefore pool pump speed should not matter, right ?
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    Right.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    BCJ,
    I had a similar situation. Older Aqualogic board that would not control a VS pump. My system had only room for 4 relays which it has already. I used the pump relay to power the new Intelliflo VS with the onboard timer. Pump runs the speeds and times and the Aqualogic just supplies the power. On all but 15 minutes a day. Freeze guard is set at the same temp. for the pump and AL. Pump is more accurate. AL still handles the cell and booster pump. I was not upgrading the board as Hayward doesn't know how to build automation products without defects.

    Since switching to VS I have seen a savings and it works just fine. Freeze guard turns on when its supposed to, cell comes on when flow is sensed.
    40'x19' IG Diamond Brite 29K 4' Waterfall/Dive Rock FNS60 DE Inteliflo VS 2hp Whisperflo pumps Aqualogic(P4) SWG TF100 Tester


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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    maxepr1: Thanks for sharing your experience, I just have one variation. With the help of 2 Valves operated by AL PS-8 I can switch between SPA only and SPA+POOL mode. During freeze period AL switches between these 2 modes and there is interlock which makes sure pump is not running when Valves are turning.

    This is the problem I can't use VS motor anti freeze feature and there are conflicting messages on disabling this feature on motor.

    Anyway, I ordered 2 speed motor with toggle switch in the back of motor. I plan to run it on low RPM all the time expect backwash or vacuum function. Hope it will still save energy and it is the simplest way.
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    I was in the same situation as you a couple of weeks ago. On this great forum in another thread I found that the SuperFlo is controllable with four relays to select four separate speeds with their expensive cable. I have a home automation system in my house so I'm controlling the pump outside of my older Jandy Control Panel with two Z-Wave Dual Relays. I could control my whole system this way if I wanted because the Jandy just controls a stack of relays anyhow. The relays are $80 for the dual and $60 for a single so I'm using the duals. If I were starting from scratch I'd skip the pool company's controllers and just control it totally with Z-Wave and relays but I'm not starting from scratch so I'm just adding this on to my existing set up which is itself controlled by a add on device from Autelis to bridge the gap from Z-wave to HTML to Jandy.. There's 8 relays in my panel and knowing what I know now I would have skipped the Autelis and just did the relays last year but no biggie. The pump is in and when I get the electronic portion set up I'll post a complete write up on it.

    Sorry to go on and on but there are ways to add in relays and get more control outside your control board and I wanted to bring it to your attention to at least ponder..

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    Re: Variable Speed Motor and Aqualogic Automation

    Sammy2 - thanks for sharing your set-up. Please share once your electronic is set-up.

    I agree this forum is very good for learning new things.

    I am using Insteon for some home automation (Motion sensor and Plug-in modules) but it very tedious to program so gave up. Waiting for home automation to be stable (Inter working). I understand Z-wave is quite matured and widely used but I have not tried it yet. Some of my friends are even using AMAZON ALEXA and others (more adventurous) are using "Raspberry Pi" for automation.

    I could not get a final verdict if I can switch ON/OFF VS motor by switching power ON/OFF from external source without using expensive "Automation Interface" therefore just settled for 2 speed motor.
    BCJ
    In ground 35'X13' 14,500 Gallon Salt Pool with raised spa, WhisperFlo Pumps, MiniMax NT Pool & Spa Heater; Pentair 60 Sq. ft DE Filter; Aqualogic Goldline Controller and Chlorination AQS-PS8;Letro Legend Platinum Pressure side pool cleaner; 3X18" Sheer decent water feature;

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