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Thread: Making the switch

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    Making the switch

    Hi, I am new to the forum and a new pool owner. I am making the switch from Baq to BBB. I don't have a test kit yet, but below are the water test results I got from a pool store.

    TC -
    FC -
    Ph - 8.0 1-drop
    T Alkalinity - 80
    T Hardness 250
    Cyanuric Acid - 0
    Biguanide - 15

    I found the guide at pool-school/baqua_chlorine_conversion. So I start by bringing the PH within levels? I'm not sure what the 1-drop means on the test and I didn't think to ask while I was at the store. They did not give a reading on the TC or FC.

    I looked at the calculator and it showed add 28 oz of muriatic acid to get the PH from 8.0 to 7.2. It also showed to add 311 oz of 6% bleach to bring the FC from 0 to 15. Am I going in the right direction?

    Thanks for the help,
    Tim
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

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    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    Yes, but I got 23 oz MA for the ph to go to 7.2....

    Take lots of pics!!! Good luck!
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    Welcome to TFP!

    Yes, you are on the right track!

    I would not add quite that much acid all at once. If there are any measurement errors or miscalculations you could overshoot and lower the PH too far. The best thing to do is to add perhaps 16 oz, give it 30 minutes to mix in and then test the PH and see where you ended up and adjust from there.

    The one drop notation on the test sheet probably means that they did an acid demand test to see how much acid would be required to lower the PH to whatever it was that they thought it should be lowered to. You can just ignore that.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Making the switch

    Thanks for the welcome and the fast replies. I found the thread about the water test kits and I am going to try and find the Leslie's kit on the way home today (the wife and grandkids don't want to wait on mail order). I do have several more questions:

    How long do I wait after I add the MA before I can add the bleach?
    After I add this initial amount of bleach, how long do I wait to test the water again?
    After adding the initial bleach, I should then do a second water test and go back to the calculator to see how much bleach I should add again?

    I have been reading posts about 10's of gallons of bleach, but the calculator showed that I should add less than 3 gallons.

    Thanks,
    Tim
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

  5. Back To Top    #5
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    Be very careful when buying a test kit to only get the specific one we recommend. They sell several other test kits with very similar names that will not work for a baquacil conversion. The stores tend to not stock the kit we recommend, and the sales people will often try to push one of the other kits on you. The other kits do not have the FAS-DPD chlorine test, which you really really want to have to complete the conversion. All you absolutely need right this moment is a simple chlorine and PH test. You will need the full FAS-DPD chlorine test in a couple of days, but you can get started with anything simple.

    Wait 30 minutes, with the pump running, after adding acid, then check the PH again, and if the PH is alright you can add bleach. You don't want to test the PH when the FC level is very high, since the test results will be incorrect.

    At the start, the FC level will fall very quickly, so you can test the water again after an hour and add enough more bleach to bring the FC level back up to 15. You don't need to test/add chlorine every hour, but the more often you do so the faster the whole conversion will go. Later on the FC level won't fall as quickly and you will be testing and adding chlorine less often.

    You only add 2 or 3 gallons of bleach at a time, but if you are home all day you can easily use 20 or 30 gallons on the first day alone.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Making the switch

    I followed the link from the Test Kit compared page to make sure I get the right one.

    I am not home during the day, so I will have to start this evening. Thanks again for the help.
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

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    geoshecks's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    Welcome!

    Definitely buy the tf100 kit if you can. They shipped mine very promptly. Follow the advice here and your conversion will go smoothly. The folks on this forum know their stuff! :good job:

    I just finished my conversion and my water looks better than it has in 10yrs!

    Good choice!
    Geoshecks
    Perry Hall, Maryland
    27' round above ground, 17100 gal, vinyl, Hayward1.5hp, 200lb.sand, EX baqua-goo user.

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    Re: Making the switch

    Day One (Tuesday)-
    Got my K-2006 kit, bought MA at Lowes, then off to Wal-Mart for Bleach. I bought 16 - 182oz bottles ($2.54 ea) to start with. I actually got them to sell them by the case (no price discount though). The guy that brought me me cases said that I couldn't buy ammonia or certain other chemicals since I was buying bleach. I told him I was good on the ammonia and asked where the panty hose were. (I had read the thread about skimmer socks) His look was priceless.

    I added 16oz of MA, waited a bit and started adding Bleach @ 2 bottles per hour until bedtime. Several days prior to the Bleach, I had tried several pounds of chlorinated shock, that didn't appear to do anything. With the last 2 bottles of the night, I threw in the last 3 pounds of granular shock I had bought. Almost immediately I got a really cool looking white stuff all over the pool. Couldn't get a pic, it was dark and I was using a flashlight.

    Day Two (Wednesday)-
    Water was green and hazy with visibility about 8 -10 inches (same as Day One). The wife was at home and added 2 bottles per hour, almost every hour. During the day, the water cleared. I had my wife stop the Bleach for 2 hours and check the PH, it was 7.5. I had to stop at 2 Wal-Marts on the way home, for a total of 20 - 182oz bottles. When I got home from work, the water was clear and you could see the bottom. It looked kinda cloudy on the bottom, but it's not green. Continued to add 2 bottles per hour until bedtime. Also, changed out the skimmer sock, it was nasty. I failed to get any testing done, other than the PH with a stick. Will get a good reading on Day Three.
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

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    Re: Making the switch

    Day Three (Thursday)-
    I was running late this morning, so I added Bleach and hit the road. Wife was adding 2 bottles of Bleach per hour up until lunch time (roughly 4 hours). I asked her to stop the Bleach during the heat of the day. I will test the water when I get home, upload a pic of the water and post the new test results.
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

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    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    Quote Originally Posted by blx286
    I told him I was good on the ammonia and asked where the panty hose were. (I had read the thread about skimmer socks) His look was priceless.
    Now that's funny.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Re: Making the switch

    Quote Originally Posted by blx286
    Day Three (Thursday)-
    I was running late this morning, so I added Bleach and hit the road. Wife was adding 2 bottles of Bleach per hour up until lunch time (roughly 4 hours). I asked her to stop the Bleach during the heat of the day. I will test the water when I get home, upload a pic of the water and post the new test results.
    My wife hasn't put in any bleach since about 2:00pm. I tested the water at 6:30pm and here is what I have:

    FC - 15
    CC - 1.5
    PH - 7.4
    TA - 150
    CH - 430
    CYA - 0 (I guess this is 0, the test never got cloudy)

    I could use some guidance. So, do I continue with the same bleach schedule?
    Do I need to worry about some of my numbers going up and some going down?

    Here are some pics. They are from a camera phone, so they are not real good.

    Thanks,
    Tim

    [attachment=2:2wk4v6g2]IMG00364.jpg[/attachment:2wk4v6g2]
    [attachment=0:2wk4v6g2]IMG00366.jpg[/attachment:2wk4v6g2]
    [attachment=0:2wk4v6g2]IMG00366.jpg[/attachment:2wk4v6g2]
    Attached Images Attached Images
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    You are doing very well!

    You might want to do an overnight FC loss test tonight. That is a good status check to see how you are doing.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  13. Back To Top    #13
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    Hey Tim,

    Things are progressing nicely! Okay, your first set of results were from a pool store. Useless, IMHO!

    Your tests from your K2006 look fine. The only thing that concerns me is the CH result. Kinda high.

    Can you run a CH test on your tap water to compare? Do you have high CH locally? And are you sure you did the test correctly, it's important to swirl for a full 30 seconds in between drops....the test takes a LONG time to do it correctly.

    Don't bother testing for CYA yet - you don't have any in the pool, you're just wasting reagent.

    Do the overnight FC test tonight - and compare it to the a.m. test. If your FC holds overnight or you lose 1ppm or less you can change your filter media and then add CYA.

    Hope this helps.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Re: Making the switch

    Thanks for the quick replies. After reading your post, it seems I ran the CH test wrong. I will run the FC and CH tests in the morning and check back in.

    Tim
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

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    Re: Making the switch

    Day Four (Friday)-

    Ran the FC overnight test and I lost more than 1ppm, but it looks like I'm almost there. I have readjusted the bleach level (per the calculator) and will try the FC test again today. When I get home this evening I will run all the tests and post the numbers.

    I do have several more questions on the steps to take after passing the FC overnight test. After passing the test I should do the following steps to complete the conversion?

    Change the filter
    Stop adding bleach
    Add CYA
    Adjust pH and other levels using the calculator

    The recommended levels I should be shooting for are:

    FC 3-7
    pH 7.5-7.8
    TA 70-90+
    CH 50-300
    CYA 30-50

    So I will let the sun drop the chlorine levels back down to acceptable swimming levels?
    Will my pH drop drastically when the FC level drops?
    Do I add CYA using a nylon sock?
    After adding CYA, I need to wait a week before testing it's level?
    Once the FC is within recommended levels, can we swim or do we have to wait on the CYA test?

    Thanks for all of the help and your patience,
    Tim
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

  16. Back To Top    #16
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    Quote Originally Posted by blx286
    Change the filter
    Yes

    Stop adding bleach
    Until the FC drops to normal range, then again add it nightly to keep your FC at the recommended levels

    Add CYA
    Yes

    Adjust pH and other levels using the calculator
    Yes, if necessary

    The recommended levels I should be shooting for are:

    FC 3-7
    pH 7.5-7.8
    TA 70-90+
    CH 50-300
    CYA 30-50

    Yup!

    So I will let the sun drop the chlorine levels back down to acceptable swimming levels?
    Exactly, shouldn't take long if you have no CYA in the pool. So keep an eye on it.

    Will my pH drop drastically when the FC level drops?
    Can't predict - it shouldn't be that drastic a drop. Easily fixed with Borax or Soda Ash.

    Do I add CYA using a nylon sock?
    Or tube sock or old black sock, whatever

    After adding CYA, I need to wait a week before testing it's level?
    Correct, but after 24 hours assume it's there. If you target 30, after 24 hours your level is then 30 and you need to keep your FC at the recommended 2-4 range. If it's 50 then 4-6.

    Once the FC is within recommended levels, can we swim or do we have to wait on the CYA test?
    You can swim as soon as the FC drops a bit and you have added the CYA, assuming your PH levels are good. You don't have to wait for the CYA test to swim.

    Thanks for all of the help and your patience,
    Tim
    No problem.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  17. Back To Top    #17
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    What frustratedpoolmom said, except that after you add CYA you keep the FC level at 15 until CC is 0.5 or lower on two consecutive days.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Making the switch

    Quote Originally Posted by frustratedpoolmom
    And are you sure you did the test correctly, it's important to swirl for a full 30 seconds in between drops....the test takes a LONG time to do it correctly.
    Thanks for the tip on the CH test. I think I got it right this time, but it's still high. Here are the numbers as of 10:30pm.

    FC - 15
    CC - 1.5
    PH - 7.2
    TA - 110
    CH - 325
    CYA - 0

    Will be testing first thing in the morning for the FC overnight test.

    Thanks,
    Tim
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: Making the switch

    I still have not got this conversion complete yet and need some more direction. I have been following the calculator and adding bleach during the day, but I get a lot of direct sunlight (I live in Texas, near Dallas, and the pool has no shade at all) and my FC drops drastically.

    I also have not gotten the Overnight FC test to within range yet. Below are the tests from yesterday and this morning.

    06/24/2006 @ 6:15pm (only tested FC, CC & PH)
    FC - 12.5
    CC - .5
    PH - 7.6
    TA -
    CH -
    CYA -

    Added the recommended bleach (from a new 182oz bottle) and tested again.

    06/24/2006 @ 11:00pm (only tested FC, CC & PH)
    FC - 13.5
    CC - .5
    PH - 7.8
    TA -
    CH -
    CYA -

    Was disgusted with the results and added the remainder of the bottle of bleach.

    06/25/2009 @ 6:15 am
    FC - 16.5
    CC - .5
    PH - 7.8
    TA - 110
    CH - 300 (this appears to be dropping now, down from 325)
    CYA - 0

    The water is crystal clear and the CC level is staying within range. I have several questions I need help with.

    Should I continue adding bleach during the heat of the day, or is that an uphill battle due to loss?

    I am not home to test, during the day and my wife has been adding bleach based on the morning test results. I think we are not offsetting the afternoon FC loss with enough bleach during the day to maintain shock level. Should I just wait until I get home, test and begin shocking the remainder of the evening instead of adding bleach during the day?

    Should you use or not use a skimmer sock during the conversion process? Would the sock be a foreign object that effects the FC levels? We have been using the skimmer sock, but I asked my wife to remove it this morning and keep it off until the conversion is complete.

    Although the water is crystal clear, we have a black ring in the skimmer daily. The stuff is like black tar. Is this Baqua or something else (maybe skimmer sock goo)? I am a little late in reporting this because the stuff has been there since last week. We were assuming it was Baqua and thought it would disappear as the conversion was winding down. Some days the ring is thicker than others. We remove this goo daily, but the ring was there again this morning.

    I know I'm doing something wrong, but I'm not sure what it is. I would have thought we would be through the conversion process by now (started last week). Your help is greatly appreciated.

    Thanks,
    Tim
    10k gallon, round, vinyl AG; 2HP pump; Pro Clean 125 sq ft cartridge | Baqua to Chlorine Convert
    Helpful links: Pool School | The Pool Calculator | Recommended Levels | CYA/Chlorine Chart

  20. Back To Top    #20
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Making the switch

    No, it probably isn't worth adding bleach during the day. You will be losing way too much of it to sunlight at this point.

    Since you added some bleach after the final FC test last night, you can't really tell what your overnight FC loss was. But it is obvious that you are getting really close and might be there already. Do a careful FC loss test tonight, making sure to measure the FC level after sunset and at least 30 minutes after your final chemical additions for the night.

    Using a skimmer sock is fine, not using a skimmer sock is also fine.

    You might want to try a scumbug for the goo in the skimmer. It should catch the goo and is a bit easier to clean up than residue on the sides. The goo will go away eventually, but may continue for a while even after the conversion is done.

    Some conversions go really quickly and others take a while. You are doing just fine. You don't have the fastest conversion on record, but you also aren't even close to the slowest conversion on record. It really shouldn't be much longer, you are in the home stretch.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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