I'm not sure if I read that at TFP or not, but I remember reading that for the very first backwash after a new fill to repeat the backwash/rinse cycle twice to make sure you got out any small particles. Then backwash as usual.
Filter & Pump Upgrade
- Thread starter domct203
- Start date
I think today is a bust as far as vacuuming, or taking pictures of the new setup. The forecast is nicer for tomorrow.
I have been wandering outside and taking a look every couple of hours. The water already looks noticeably cleaner, the pressure gauge has gone up ~1 psi since startup yesterday evening (was initially just over 12, now a little under 14). So, filtration is actually taking place, which is cool.
It's been over a month since our previous pump died (the 2500 gph Intex w cartridge filter), and we had been limping along during the interval with the tiny little pump that was originally sold with the pool. That pump was better than nothing, but not by much, so the water quality has been going downhill. Even with keeping chlorine levels up, it starts getting grungy without decent filtration.
This is certainly a pleasant change!
Of course, this is all in the nature of an experiment -- no one is actually going to swim in the water we're cleaning up here. Waayyy too cold :uhh:
I have been wandering outside and taking a look every couple of hours. The water already looks noticeably cleaner, the pressure gauge has gone up ~1 psi since startup yesterday evening (was initially just over 12, now a little under 14). So, filtration is actually taking place, which is cool.
It's been over a month since our previous pump died (the 2500 gph Intex w cartridge filter), and we had been limping along during the interval with the tiny little pump that was originally sold with the pool. That pump was better than nothing, but not by much, so the water quality has been going downhill. Even with keeping chlorine levels up, it starts getting grungy without decent filtration.
This is certainly a pleasant change!
Of course, this is all in the nature of an experiment -- no one is actually going to swim in the water we're cleaning up here. Waayyy too cold :uhh:
Looks like a great day ahead. The sun is peeking out, and my tracking info has finally updated!
dkimble
0
- Jun 22, 2013
- 352
OMG, mine will be here tomorrow for my 18' 52" Intex pool. I also got the in wall skimmer. I had purchased the Game Sandpro75D a few weeks ago but although it seemed to work well, this deal looked too good to be true. I didn't like a few things about the Game filter so I plan to sell it off at a fair rate. Keep us posted on your installs.
dkimble
0
- Jun 22, 2013
- 352
I got mine today. You can tell by looking at the pump and filter that the quality is insane, compared to the game and intex filters. I am really glad I upgraded and I am looking forward to operating our pool the TFP way next year.
Well, I'm having the darndest time getting my camera to talk to the computer; have also tried emailing cell phone photos to myself without luck so far. Anyway, I still plan to post some pictures when I figure out those issues.
As for setup, given the lack of instructions that come with the package, I thought it might be useful to describe how I hooked things up, and what my reasoning was. The box came with two plastic bags of parts for connecting hoses -- two barbed fittings (threaded on one end, barbed on the other), two smooth hose connection fittings (threaded on one end, and more or less smooth on the other), two hose clamps, and four wire clamps (not sure what the technical name for these clamps is). I decided that the barbed fittings are best used with the transparent (with reinforcing web inside) piece of tubing that is provided to go from pump to filter, since that tube feels more 'stretchy' and flexible than the two ribbed hoses provided to connect the system to the pool. One of the barbed fittings I received was an L -- I put this on the filter side of the tubing, since there was no way it could thread into the port on the pump side of the tube (the end of the L would have hit the pump while trying to tighten it). I used the hose clamps on the pump/filter tubing; I think they make a better seal than the other type of clamp, and they were in the plastic bag with the barbed fittings (so perhaps it was Hayward's intention to use those clamps with those fittings).
I used the two smoother plastic fittings, and the wire-type clamps, with the hoses from pool to pump, and from filter back to pool. On the pressure side, I double clamped the hose at both ends (using hose clamps I already had in hand from the previous pump setup), since I had read various stories about hoses popping off.
I used 3-4 wraps of teflon tape on the fittings before threading them in (probably more than what was provided on the tiny little roll of tape provided with the system; I'm not sure, since I didn't use that tape). I did end up with a leak on the pressure side, at the pump fitting connected to the tubing running up to the filter. That wasn't too surprising, as that fitting screwed in more easily than the others, and bottomed out before I felt enough drag from the tape. Next spring, when I set this up for the long run, I will use more tape, or possibly the paste compound. There is also a slight suction side leak, where the ribbed hose is clamped onto the existing intake fitting on the pool. It works fine during normal operation (just a few tiny bubbles visible, whizzing through the water in the pump basket). However, when I experimented with vacuuming, a lot of air quickly got into the basket from the leak, so I discontinued that. Again, this is something to fix next spring.
After running the system for a about 8 hours a day, on two successive days, the gauge read 14 psi (it started at ~12.5 psi). I backwashed, watching sight glass, then rinsed, and it came back down to the original 12+. Kind of fun that this all works like it is supposed to (sand filters are a new thing to me).
Next spring I may also consider hard-plumbing part of the setup. For now, though, I am happy with how it works, and am now waiting for a nice sunny day to drain the pool and pack things up.
I will still post pictures, but wanted to give a few details that might be useful to other new owners of this system.
As for setup, given the lack of instructions that come with the package, I thought it might be useful to describe how I hooked things up, and what my reasoning was. The box came with two plastic bags of parts for connecting hoses -- two barbed fittings (threaded on one end, barbed on the other), two smooth hose connection fittings (threaded on one end, and more or less smooth on the other), two hose clamps, and four wire clamps (not sure what the technical name for these clamps is). I decided that the barbed fittings are best used with the transparent (with reinforcing web inside) piece of tubing that is provided to go from pump to filter, since that tube feels more 'stretchy' and flexible than the two ribbed hoses provided to connect the system to the pool. One of the barbed fittings I received was an L -- I put this on the filter side of the tubing, since there was no way it could thread into the port on the pump side of the tube (the end of the L would have hit the pump while trying to tighten it). I used the hose clamps on the pump/filter tubing; I think they make a better seal than the other type of clamp, and they were in the plastic bag with the barbed fittings (so perhaps it was Hayward's intention to use those clamps with those fittings).
I used the two smoother plastic fittings, and the wire-type clamps, with the hoses from pool to pump, and from filter back to pool. On the pressure side, I double clamped the hose at both ends (using hose clamps I already had in hand from the previous pump setup), since I had read various stories about hoses popping off.
I used 3-4 wraps of teflon tape on the fittings before threading them in (probably more than what was provided on the tiny little roll of tape provided with the system; I'm not sure, since I didn't use that tape). I did end up with a leak on the pressure side, at the pump fitting connected to the tubing running up to the filter. That wasn't too surprising, as that fitting screwed in more easily than the others, and bottomed out before I felt enough drag from the tape. Next spring, when I set this up for the long run, I will use more tape, or possibly the paste compound. There is also a slight suction side leak, where the ribbed hose is clamped onto the existing intake fitting on the pool. It works fine during normal operation (just a few tiny bubbles visible, whizzing through the water in the pump basket). However, when I experimented with vacuuming, a lot of air quickly got into the basket from the leak, so I discontinued that. Again, this is something to fix next spring.
After running the system for a about 8 hours a day, on two successive days, the gauge read 14 psi (it started at ~12.5 psi). I backwashed, watching sight glass, then rinsed, and it came back down to the original 12+. Kind of fun that this all works like it is supposed to (sand filters are a new thing to me).
Next spring I may also consider hard-plumbing part of the setup. For now, though, I am happy with how it works, and am now waiting for a nice sunny day to drain the pool and pack things up.
I will still post pictures, but wanted to give a few details that might be useful to other new owners of this system.
Last edited:
dkimble
0
- Jun 22, 2013
- 352
Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade
Awesome. I recently bought the Game Sandpro 75D pump and filter which works a lot better than my Intex sand filter and pump did. I couldn't pass up this deal though. This thing is very nice and makes the Game pump/filter look like a toy. I plan to hard plumb mine in the spring as well. I also bought the through wall skimmer to go with it.
My only issue is the pressure gage needle is broken. or its just not attached to the gage. I called Hayward and they said call Amazon. I called Amazon and they wanted to replace the entire box and ship a complete new package. I said isn't that kind of stupid cause you sell the gage for $17. lol They insisted on shipping an entire new unit out. Finally I suggested they credit me $20. and that would be much cheaper than shipping both ways to exchange... They went for that.
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oh, and did it make the 18' pool like a whirlpool? lol
Awesome. I recently bought the Game Sandpro 75D pump and filter which works a lot better than my Intex sand filter and pump did. I couldn't pass up this deal though. This thing is very nice and makes the Game pump/filter look like a toy. I plan to hard plumb mine in the spring as well. I also bought the through wall skimmer to go with it.
My only issue is the pressure gage needle is broken. or its just not attached to the gage. I called Hayward and they said call Amazon. I called Amazon and they wanted to replace the entire box and ship a complete new package. I said isn't that kind of stupid cause you sell the gage for $17. lol They insisted on shipping an entire new unit out. Finally I suggested they credit me $20. and that would be much cheaper than shipping both ways to exchange... They went for that.
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oh, and did it make the 18' pool like a whirlpool? lol
Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade
TFTestkits.net has high quality glycerin filled gauges for $12.50
I use one on my current filter, and plan to put it in the Hayward as well.
Here's a link: TFTestkits.net
TFTestkits.net has high quality glycerin filled gauges for $12.50
I use one on my current filter, and plan to put it in the Hayward as well.
Here's a link: TFTestkits.net
I forgot to mention that when I first unpacked the multi port valve I noticed a superficial defect in the top of the valve body:
I believe the valve is fine, and this doesn't really bother me as long as it works. I emailed Amazon just to let them know about it. They offered me the choice of a replacement, refund, or 20% discount. I took the discount, it paid for the 3-yr service plan.
I believe the valve is fine, and this doesn't really bother me as long as it works. I emailed Amazon just to let them know about it. They offered me the choice of a replacement, refund, or 20% discount. I took the discount, it paid for the 3-yr service plan.
Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade
Yes, the pool is more of a whirlpool than it ever was before (other than when my kids swim/run around in circles near the outer edge of the pool, which far outdoes even this pump
part of the fun of the game is to sweep non-participating swimmers off their feet if they are not careful). The assorted floating bits of debris circulate quite briskly with the Hayward system running.
I'm likely to get a different pressure gauge also. Mine isn't broken, and seems to work well. However, since it is marked all the way up to 60 psi, the readings are quite low resolution in the range of interest. More annoyingly, there is already a lot of condensation inside the gauge, after just 4 days -- that is not very promising as far as long-term readability. I will have to take a look at the tftestkits gauge.
One other (sort of funny) detail while I was setting this up -- since this is my first encounter with a sand filter, I was unfamiliar with the proper tightness of the locking collar that attaches the multiport to the top of the filter, and so I was initially conservative in tightening the relatively small bolts on the collar. When I turned the pump on for the first time to backwash the new sand, two symmetrical fountains of dirty water came leaping out on opposite sides of the collar, at the locations of the bolts. I turned off the pump and tightened the bolts; went through that process a couple of times before the leak disappeared completely. Fortunately, by dumb luck, I didn't happen to be standing in line with the fountain!
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That is a shame about the damage; glad you found a resolution that satisfied you!
Yes, the pool is more of a whirlpool than it ever was before (other than when my kids swim/run around in circles near the outer edge of the pool, which far outdoes even this pump
part of the fun of the game is to sweep non-participating swimmers off their feet if they are not careful). The assorted floating bits of debris circulate quite briskly with the Hayward system running.I'm likely to get a different pressure gauge also. Mine isn't broken, and seems to work well. However, since it is marked all the way up to 60 psi, the readings are quite low resolution in the range of interest. More annoyingly, there is already a lot of condensation inside the gauge, after just 4 days -- that is not very promising as far as long-term readability. I will have to take a look at the tftestkits gauge.
One other (sort of funny) detail while I was setting this up -- since this is my first encounter with a sand filter, I was unfamiliar with the proper tightness of the locking collar that attaches the multiport to the top of the filter, and so I was initially conservative in tightening the relatively small bolts on the collar. When I turned the pump on for the first time to backwash the new sand, two symmetrical fountains of dirty water came leaping out on opposite sides of the collar, at the locations of the bolts. I turned off the pump and tightened the bolts; went through that process a couple of times before the leak disappeared completely. Fortunately, by dumb luck, I didn't happen to be standing in line with the fountain!
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That is a shame about the damage; glad you found a resolution that satisfied you!
Got everything hooked up and tested yesterday & everything worked fine. Ran the system for about 15 minutes.
Glad I came across that Amazon deal. They are back to $433 now, about $300 over what we paid. They must of had a boat load of these.
The pic doesn't do it justice, the filter is huge compared to the 14".
Glad I came across that Amazon deal. They are back to $433 now, about $300 over what we paid. They must of had a boat load of these.
The pic doesn't do it justice, the filter is huge compared to the 14".
Well, I just made another Amazon purchase:
Amazon.com : Hayward SP15922S Power-Flo Matrix Above-Ground Pump 2-Speed : Swimming Pool Water Pumps : Patio, Lawn Garden
That is a 2-speed Hayward Powerflo Matrix pump, 1 hp size, currently on sale for ~$132. I had been thinking of getting a 2-speed motor for 1.5 hp pump that comes with the pump/filter combo we've been discussing in this thread... That was a tentative plan for a year or two down the road. However, this complete pump is about $100 less than any of the 2-speed replacement motors I had seen so far, so I gave in to temptation.
Now, do I leave the pool up for another week to test the 2-speed pump? Hmmmm... We like to have a relatively warm sunny day for dismantling and folding up the pool, and those nice days will be in shorter supply as we move further into fall.
I do feel sort of guilty over buying a second pump, when the first one works perfectly well! However, the 2-speed option appeals to us, both for energy savings, and for the lower noise level. Although the 1.5 hp single speed pump is not horridly noisy, I did find myself wishing it could be quieter (during the several days I ran it last week). Also, since both pumps are Powerflo Matrix models, I assume they can be 'parts cars' for one another, in terms of basket, lid, etc.
I do have some concerns that we have now committed ourselves to years of struggling with the recalcitrant lids on these Hayward pumps (this is a repeating theme in critical comments about the Powerflo Matrix pumps -- i.e. that it is very hard to open the lid to clean out the basket). I was aware of these criticisms before making the initial purchase, but the low price overcame the concern! I'm sure we will figure out a way to deal with the lid, should it prove troublesome.
The 21" pump/filter combo is up to over $400 again today
The reduced price did hang on (with some fluctuations) for at least two weeks, so they must have had a lot of these units to move out of the warehouse!
Amazon.com : Hayward SP15922S Power-Flo Matrix Above-Ground Pump 2-Speed : Swimming Pool Water Pumps : Patio, Lawn Garden
That is a 2-speed Hayward Powerflo Matrix pump, 1 hp size, currently on sale for ~$132. I had been thinking of getting a 2-speed motor for 1.5 hp pump that comes with the pump/filter combo we've been discussing in this thread... That was a tentative plan for a year or two down the road. However, this complete pump is about $100 less than any of the 2-speed replacement motors I had seen so far, so I gave in to temptation.
Now, do I leave the pool up for another week to test the 2-speed pump? Hmmmm... We like to have a relatively warm sunny day for dismantling and folding up the pool, and those nice days will be in shorter supply as we move further into fall.
I do feel sort of guilty over buying a second pump, when the first one works perfectly well! However, the 2-speed option appeals to us, both for energy savings, and for the lower noise level. Although the 1.5 hp single speed pump is not horridly noisy, I did find myself wishing it could be quieter (during the several days I ran it last week). Also, since both pumps are Powerflo Matrix models, I assume they can be 'parts cars' for one another, in terms of basket, lid, etc.
I do have some concerns that we have now committed ourselves to years of struggling with the recalcitrant lids on these Hayward pumps (this is a repeating theme in critical comments about the Powerflo Matrix pumps -- i.e. that it is very hard to open the lid to clean out the basket). I was aware of these criticisms before making the initial purchase, but the low price overcame the concern! I'm sure we will figure out a way to deal with the lid, should it prove troublesome.
The 21" pump/filter combo is up to over $400 again today
The reduced price did hang on (with some fluctuations) for at least two weeks, so they must have had a lot of these units to move out of the warehouse!
Cool, be sure to follow up with your impression of the 1HP vs the 1.5HP, even if it's next season.
The 2-speed pump has been slow to ship, but tracking now says it should be here Wednesday, so I probably will give it a quick try when it shows up. The pool is still up, and we have no frost warnings in the forecast for the coming week. So, I'll probably be packing the pool up around Halloween. That will be a record for us!
As far as draining the sand filter, I notice that the drain is actually several inches higher than the bottom of the filter container, so there will still be several inches of water sitting in the bottom of the filter, even after draining... I assume that is OK (i.e. no freeze damage hazard)? I've read a couple of threads here where a poster recommends blowing the rest of the water out of the filter (with shop vac or similar device), but the manufacturer doesn't appear to require that extra effort.
I think I will probably follow your earlier recommendation about taking the multiport off, and storing it indoors. I'm wondering what to put over the top of the filter container if I do that -- something that will stay on reliably through winter weather, without letting water into the container.
I'll post again after the pump shows up, hopefully in a few days.
As far as draining the sand filter, I notice that the drain is actually several inches higher than the bottom of the filter container, so there will still be several inches of water sitting in the bottom of the filter, even after draining... I assume that is OK (i.e. no freeze damage hazard)? I've read a couple of threads here where a poster recommends blowing the rest of the water out of the filter (with shop vac or similar device), but the manufacturer doesn't appear to require that extra effort.
I think I will probably follow your earlier recommendation about taking the multiport off, and storing it indoors. I'm wondering what to put over the top of the filter container if I do that -- something that will stay on reliably through winter weather, without letting water into the container.
I'll post again after the pump shows up, hopefully in a few days.
I'm having a few regrets about leaving the pool up to wait for this 2-speed pump (which won't arrive now until tomorrow, according to UPS tracking). With a forecast for temps below freezing last night, I was outside around 11 PM putting the plugs into the pool inlet and outlet points, and then drained the filter and the pump. Boy, that water was chilly to reach into! To those with fancier setups -- we don't have valves to shut off the connections to/from the pool... just reach in and screw a cover over the suction fitting, and jam a sort of flexible plug into the return. I didn't worry about the fate of the pressure gauge -- it doesn't look like great quality to begin with, and ours is obviously leaking. At first I thought it was condensation, but water has been gradually accumulating inside it over the past few weeks, so now it is nearly 1/3 full of water. A new gauge will be on the shopping list for next spring. If the pump actually shows up on Thursday, I'll still hook it up and see how it works.
I hope there will be at least one more warmish day next weekend, so I can pack up the pool. Not only is the cold uncomfortable for the human operator; the pool material gets stiff and hard to fold when it is cold.
I hope there will be at least one more warmish day next weekend, so I can pack up the pool. Not only is the cold uncomfortable for the human operator; the pool material gets stiff and hard to fold when it is cold.