My Baquacil to chlorine conversion

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mikehilliker

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Jun 3, 2009
18
OK lets first start by saying that I havent had any problems with Baquacil from the first time I started using it 4 years ago, its just to expensive and I like to be able to test the water and not take it to a place to get it done. That being said these were my first readings before the conversion. 25,000 gallon 30' above ground
Baquacil was 34ppm
ph was 7.7
baquacil shock and oxidizer was 0
total alk was 110
cal hard was 156

while talking to the pool rep he told me that the Baquacil was low enought to start the conversion and to add 2.5 pounds of chlorine in it. So I did and the water turned army green. I then did some research and found out that was normal. I read so many posts and came across one that stated to use a non chlorine oxidizer to help eliminate the Baquacil. So I added 10 lbs of that and got the water tested the following day. The time between these 2 tests are 3 days.
Baquacil is 0
ph is 7.5
baquacil shock and oxidizer is 16 (which I believe is due to the non chlrine oxidizer i put into the pool)
total alk is 102
cal hard is 141

after that test I started to add chlorine. I added 5 gallons and waited 24 hours.
I went to a local store today and bought a test kit that measures TC and FC as well as ph, bromine, total alk, and acid demand. the tests he did are as followed:
FC=.5
TC=5.0
ph=7.6
TA=140
cal hard=210
TDS=500

Now the guy there told me to add more of the non chlorine oxidizer due to a "chlorine lock" that was going on. so I added another 5 lbs of it just a few minutes ago. I guess what I need to know is does this sound like good advise or should I have just kept dumping chlorine into it until I get a good FC reading. Any other information will be appreciated as well.
 
Welcome to TFP!

You want to do the conversion as described at Pool School. Given your description, you are probably better than half way through at this point.

Don't add chlorine to the pool for at least an hour after your most recent oxidizer addition, to give it some time to work.

Your PH is a little high for a conversion, I would lower it to between 7.2 and 7.4. Do this before adding bleach.

The non-chlorine oxidizer works, it is just more expensive than chlorine.

"chlorine lock" is a myth that pools store people use to cover situations they don't really understand.
 
ok my test kit is pretty much like the 1st one that you described. now I added the oxidizer and didnt add anymore chlorine until like 3 hours later. I just did another test and it says that I still have like .5ppm FC but the TC is off the chart from what I can read on the test kit I got from the pool store it only reads up to like 10ppm. so I guess i need to know why my FC isnt comming up and staying stuck at .5ppm.

so if the oxidizer doesnt release a chlorine lock what is the reasoning for using it if it is more expensive? and when i went to put in the chlorine after the 3 hour soak it started to turn the water a light shade of bronze again. my wife said when she was looking at it from the second floor that it looked as if it was clearing up until i put the bleach in that is. like i said once i did that it went a little bronze again.

my wife noticed on the stairs going into the pool some brownish slimly substance. so i took the stairs out of the pool and put the cleaner that sucks crud off of the bottom of the pool, while I was brushing it. i also went out and purchased 10 more gallons of bleach and i am wondering if i should add any more until my fc comes up and stops holding at .5ppm or just keep adding bleach until it breaks the barrier. i dont understand why the TC is so high but the FC is so low. is there any way to get it to come up to the 15ppm that is required?
 
o by the way what is FAS-DPD FC used for besides measuring the FC. soed it measure anything else, because at this stage with as much money as i have dumped into bleach and oxidizer i would just rather use the kit that i have because it at least reads up to 10ppm and just make sure it is much darker. i cant believe it is taking this much money to convert :(
 
I probably wouldnt feel so bad about doing this if i hadnt bought the power ionizer for $400 bucks. so i am still a little stressed about the amount of money i have had to dish out just to goto a cheaper and easier way of taking care of the pool....sorry to all.
 
There is no such thing as chlorine lock. Forget about chlorine lock. Chlorine lock has nothing to do with it.

You keep adding chlorine to bring FC back up to 15. At the beginning the chlorine will go away very quickly. That is completely normal. Just keep adding more chlorine. Over time the FC level won't fall as quickly, but you have a ways to go before you get there.

You really really want the FAS-DPD chlorine test. The test kit you bought does not include it. You can get the FAS-DPD chlorine test from TFTestKits.net or from various places on the Internet.
 
ok i will forget about the chlorine lock, but is there a reason for TC to be over 10ppm and fc to be so low? I will check tomorrow if Leslies has one of those kits Ill get it. Now I am going by the Jason's Pool Calculator and adding the chlorine like it says. I have a 25,000 gallon pool and I put in the first box that I have .5ppm and in the second box I put in that I want 15ppm and it tells me to put in almost 5 gallons of bleach. I do that and wait an hour before testing to make sure that it is good and mixed throughout, but the reading is always .5ppm. now can I test it sooner than that and it be accurate? also should i use a stablizer while I am doing this to make the chlorine last a little longer? i know it takes time, i have had fish tanks for almost 15 years and were not talking the little 10 gallon ones you get from walmart. i know how to use the test kits, because i have them for the tanks. but the thing that bugs me is having TC so high compared to the FC. I understand that the chlorine was suppose to be eating the baquacil, but when i had it tested there wasnt anymore baquacil left at all, 0ppm. so i am not understanding what other factors are at work here that is causing the FC to stay so low. should i add more than what the Jason's Pool Calculator states? how much would be unsafe to add at one time? and would adding more than what it says make it work any better? i know its alot of questions but i want to see some progress. i dont care if its a little just to see some forward movement would be great.
 
i just wanted to add that i have an item called the powerionizer running right now, should i turn it off. it has 2 electrodes in it which are suppose to inhibite the growth of algea. it is inline with the output of the sand filter i have. could this be inhibiting my results in some way?
 

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mikehilliker said:
but is there a reason for TC to be over 10ppm and fc to be so low?
Click to expand...
Yes, that is completely normal. The chlorine is attacking the baquacil and turning into various intermediate chemicals on the way to breaking everything down to stuff that can get filtered out. Along the way some of it is turning into CC. As long as there are some of the earlier intermediates in the water the chlorine reacts with them more quickly than with the CC and continues building the CC level. Eventually, when you run out of fast reacting components and the chlorine will focus on breaking down the CC.

You can test after as little as half an hour if you want. The results won't be as precise, but should be good enough for the early stage of a conversion. If you do this and have a two speed pump, make sure the pump is on high speed.
 
i dont have 2 speed pump it is a 2hp pump and it is on 24hrs a day. now what do you think about the powerionizer being on...leave it on or turn it off till the conversion?

stabilizer or dont worry about it?

as far as your last reply it sets me at ease. it makes a little more sense now, i know there is a learning curve to the chlorine just like there was with the fish tank water chemistry. thx alot.
 
JasonLion said:
Ionizers are not well thought of around here.
Click to expand...

Amen Brother!

Hang in there, Mike. :)

It will be worth it, you'll see. Order the FAS-DPD test to supplement your kit, its around $25. You'll be glad you did, no more guessing.

By the way, just wondering, where are you buying the chlorine?

Also, it might be helpful or reassuring for you to read some of the other threads on converting. :wink:
 
well i am getting the walmart brand of chlorine...is that ok? i have added 10 1 gallon bottles and 7 1.42 gallon bottles tonight. I will go by the leslies pool place tomorrow and see if i can get that test kit. hopefully since its the name brand test i should be getting from there they will stock it. as far as the bleaching i have read some other posts about only applying the bleach at night and all or at least when the sun isnt hitting it directly. i get direct sunlight from about 10AM till almost 4:pM so i have a pretty good window after noon wise. i put the last of my bleach in tonight just a few minutes ago. i want to see a change in this soon...some kinda change...any change. i feel stagnent right now so i added all 7 1.42 gallon bleaches. hopefully when i go out to test it i can see a test higher than .5ppm of FC. now is it possible that using a test that cannot read as high as the one you suggest getting would render invalid results. could this .5ppm i keep comming up with be a false test return due to higher bleach levels than it wants to see?????
 
mikehilliker said:
well i am getting the walmart brand of chlorine...is that ok? i have added 10 1 gallon bottles and 7 1.42 gallon bottles tonight. I will go by the leslies pool place tomorrow and see if i can get that test kit. hopefully since its the name brand test i should be getting from there they will stock it. as far as the bleaching i have read some other posts about only applying the bleach at night and all or at least when the sun isnt hitting it directly. i get direct sunlight from about 10AM till almost 4:pM so i have a pretty good window after noon wise. i put the last of my bleach in tonight just a few minutes ago. i want to see a change in this soon...some kinda change...any change. i feel stagnent right now so i added all 7 1.42 gallon bleaches. hopefully when i go out to test it i can see a test higher than .5ppm of FC. now is it possible that using a test that cannot read as high as the one you suggest getting would render invalid results. could this .5ppm i keep comming up with be a false test return due to higher bleach levels than it wants to see?????
Click to expand...

Yes, the Wal-Mart brand bleach is fine, that's what I use. :goodjob:

If the FC in your water was higher than 5 or 10, your test would read up that high, it wouldn't read .5. If its reading .5 then your FC is .5. :wink:

This is normal. Let me think for a minute - when did you begin the conversion? 1 or 2 days, right? Conversions can take a week, especially when Baq levels are present....You won't be losing crazy amounts of FC the hole time, this loss you are seeing will gradually get smaller and smaller....

So it's perfectly normal to add enough bleach to 15, test and find 0 and high CC's. Happens to everyone converting, especially at the beginning as you oxidize the Baq goo. Around 1/2 way thru the process, you'll start getting higher and higher FC levels, lower and lower CC levels, and one morning you'll test and the FC is really high, almost holding overnight!...then you'll know you're almost there. :wink:

Conversions require a lot of POP. Did you read any of the other threads? You'll see what I'm talking about. Hang in there....
 
well i would expect that if i had left over baquacil in the pool. if you look up at the very first time when i posted the thread you will see my numbers. as far as the test showed us there was no more baquacil in the water when i started to add all this bleach. i have yet to see anyone who presented the thread with thier starting baquacil numbers like i did. the first test did show 34ppm of baquacil and 0ppm shock and oxidizer. the second test a couple days later after adding non chlorinated oxidizer resulted in 0ppm of baquacil and 16 days worth of oxidizer which i contributed to the fact of adding the non chlorinated oxidizer. so i have the tests in hand to prove there was no baquacil in the water so my thinking is it should go rather quickly. like i said i havent seen any other thread that shows thier baseline of water quality, so i have no real data to cross reference it to for an accurate timeline.
 
Okay, if you used the Baq brand non-chlorine oxidizer, it's Hydrogen Peroxide and here's a related thread

http://www.troublefreepool.com/sodium-percarbonate-question-t11185.html

that says it increases chlorine demand at the beginning of the conversion. (This is what you are seeing now).

Then, read on, this gals conversion showed her levels similar to yours, and she used the Sodium Percarb method, which also increases FC demand, and her FC began to hold around Day 4.

http://www.troublefreepool.com/starting-conversion-using-sodium-percarbonate-t12348-20.html

I hope this helps to reassure you? :wink:
 
non baquacil brand off non chlorine oxidizer. i felt it wouldnt do me any good to use any of thier products if i was going to prolong the effects of what i was tryn to do. :) i am assured that it will FINALLY work, its just not seeing any result change in the FC while testing is a little frustrating to say the least. i bought a powerionizer at $400 and then decided to do the conversion, i know in the long run it will save money but you know its hard to see that light until its right in fron of you. o yeah why are powerionizers not like here. what is the deal? if it keeps you from having to buy an algecide then why wouldnt you get one.
 

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