- May 23, 2015
- 24,410
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE
- Thread starter grumpiebk
- Start date
I gotta do just enough to make it look like I'm doing something... While I'm doing nothing 
South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE
First night with the spa heater on! I am typing while enjoying 104 degrees! I am please to report that our electric Hayward 140k BTU heat pump got water temp (700 gallon) from 82 to 104 in just about an hour and a half with 75 degree/70% humidity weather. I am pleasantly surprised with the heat time. Thank goodness for Screenlogic on my way home from work!
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First night with the spa heater on! I am typing while enjoying 104 degrees! I am please to report that our electric Hayward 140k BTU heat pump got water temp (700 gallon) from 82 to 104 in just about an hour and a half with 75 degree/70% humidity weather. I am pleasantly surprised with the heat time. Thank goodness for Screenlogic on my way home from work!
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South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE
A quick update on our plaster. After addressing the matter with the PB, we discussed options with the owner of the plaster company. Should we decide to redo the plaster, two options were discussed: 1) use the same product with up to 5 bags of black Quartz stone added or 2) used a dye based Quartz plaster color that is darker. The owner of the plaster company recommended we keep the white/grey based plaster color we currently have and add the black stones as that will be the most consistent finish. After quite a battle with the PB, they agreed to refinish the pool on their dime (as it was their mistake) but I would be required to pay for the black stone additive (approx $500 in total) as that was not considered in our original contract. An added bonus of the replaster would be that the finish company would knock off all of the step/marker tile and retile and plaster in between the tiles instead of the current horrendous dark grey grout. It actually makes their lives easier from a re-finish perspective and they were unhappy with the PB grouting the tile anyway. Aside from the $500 out of pocket cost, the downside is the extra month of rendering the pool useless and resetting the clock on brushing, chemistry balancing, etc.
A few questions I have for the TFP family are:
Will 5 bags of black stones in a 17k gallon pool darken the water color noticeably? In certain sunlight our color is nice, but in broad sun it is very light.
Any concerns with a replaster job so soon?
Does $500 for 5 bags of Quartz additive sound reasonable?
What are the thoughts about the dyed plaster option?
Anything else I should be thinking about before making a final decision?
I've got to give it to the PB, as much of a pain as this is, he seems to be stepping up to address our concerns. I still wouldn't recommend them, but I appreciate him trying to get it right.
Here is a pic of the dyed color samples vs current plaster (middle sample in our 6" water depth shelf). I don't have a sample of our plaster with black added, but it seems closer to the pool we saw in person (second pic).
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A quick update on our plaster. After addressing the matter with the PB, we discussed options with the owner of the plaster company. Should we decide to redo the plaster, two options were discussed: 1) use the same product with up to 5 bags of black Quartz stone added or 2) used a dye based Quartz plaster color that is darker. The owner of the plaster company recommended we keep the white/grey based plaster color we currently have and add the black stones as that will be the most consistent finish. After quite a battle with the PB, they agreed to refinish the pool on their dime (as it was their mistake) but I would be required to pay for the black stone additive (approx $500 in total) as that was not considered in our original contract. An added bonus of the replaster would be that the finish company would knock off all of the step/marker tile and retile and plaster in between the tiles instead of the current horrendous dark grey grout. It actually makes their lives easier from a re-finish perspective and they were unhappy with the PB grouting the tile anyway. Aside from the $500 out of pocket cost, the downside is the extra month of rendering the pool useless and resetting the clock on brushing, chemistry balancing, etc.
A few questions I have for the TFP family are:
Will 5 bags of black stones in a 17k gallon pool darken the water color noticeably? In certain sunlight our color is nice, but in broad sun it is very light.
Any concerns with a replaster job so soon?
Does $500 for 5 bags of Quartz additive sound reasonable?
What are the thoughts about the dyed plaster option?
Anything else I should be thinking about before making a final decision?
I've got to give it to the PB, as much of a pain as this is, he seems to be stepping up to address our concerns. I still wouldn't recommend them, but I appreciate him trying to get it right.
Here is a pic of the dyed color samples vs current plaster (middle sample in our 6" water depth shelf). I don't have a sample of our plaster with black added, but it seems closer to the pool we saw in person (second pic).
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I was thinking about your plaster situation today and wondering what was going on. I totally understand where you are coming from and honestly would want it fixed as well. Even though what you have now looks good, it isn't what you wanted, envisioned, or were promised. I can't help with technical questions but glad the PB is working to take care of this. I would personally want to see actual pools of these samples to make sure you are getting exactly what you want. Unless he can show you a pool with your current color with black pebbles added in, I personally wouldn't trust it to come out correctly but I am the type that needs to see examples in larger, real life scale when it comes to certain things. The dyed stuff seems more definitive in the color unless, again, they absolutely know what your plaster with black pebbles looks like.
Also, in regards to the retiling of the accents... After I saw what happened with your grey grout there, I brought that up with my PB as well since we are using grey grout as well. He said speaking to the plaster guys, they will use the actual plaster to grout without the pebbles added in so color wise it matches but we dont have to worry about pieces of pebble not sitting properly in the grout line. So I would ask about them grouting with plaster sans pebbles to get a solid, uniform fill. But apparently a common thing to do and glad you will be able to correct this issue as well at the same time as your plaster color.
Spa looks great. I hope you get this squared away and can start enjoying your pool fully - physically and visually.
Also, in regards to the retiling of the accents... After I saw what happened with your grey grout there, I brought that up with my PB as well since we are using grey grout as well. He said speaking to the plaster guys, they will use the actual plaster to grout without the pebbles added in so color wise it matches but we dont have to worry about pieces of pebble not sitting properly in the grout line. So I would ask about them grouting with plaster sans pebbles to get a solid, uniform fill. But apparently a common thing to do and glad you will be able to correct this issue as well at the same time as your plaster color.
Spa looks great. I hope you get this squared away and can start enjoying your pool fully - physically and visually.
We had on pool chipped out and redone within days of the first plaster job was done. They put a WAY wrong color and none of the extras the PO had asked for so no worries there.
Will they be doing a full chip out or just around the lights, returns, skimmer, etc?
There is one PO who just had a place on his spa seating redone due to a crack. It REALLY showed how much the color of the plaster had faded. I am saying that to have you think about staying away from the dye. I think, notice I said think, the black stones will really help your color. I did a search for black beads and the color difference was noticeable in the pictures so.........hoping it will be in real life also.
The cost of the additives? I really don't know and am not sure how you could find out. I guess you could call other PB and ask them what they would charge for it to get a baseline.
So glad you were able to enjoy the spa! Nice on the speed of it heating up! Must have been nice!
for you while you decide what to do.
Kim
Will they be doing a full chip out or just around the lights, returns, skimmer, etc?
There is one PO who just had a place on his spa seating redone due to a crack. It REALLY showed how much the color of the plaster had faded. I am saying that to have you think about staying away from the dye. I think, notice I said think, the black stones will really help your color. I did a search for black beads and the color difference was noticeable in the pictures so.........hoping it will be in real life also.
The cost of the additives? I really don't know and am not sure how you could find out. I guess you could call other PB and ask them what they would charge for it to get a baseline.
So glad you were able to enjoy the spa! Nice on the speed of it heating up! Must have been nice!
for you while you decide what to do.Kim
Didn't realize the dyes would fade... Good point. I would def like to see what your color with the black pebbles looks like though to be sure.
Unfortunately seeing both options is person is not possible. The PB, plaster co and plaster manufacturer do not have any references. I do have the sales person contact from the manufacturer tho, so I want to get his opinion on adding black stones to the product. The plaster co owner has also seen my pictures of the pool we saw and he believes the black additive gets us there.
I think I am also going to see if the PB can do the dyed product without any cost to me (no stones will need to be added to that product which is what I will need to pay for if we go with the white based plaster). I have only seen pictures on the internet of that product (which is beautiful), but again the risk there is the mottling/streaking/blotching. The one thing that is nice about our current finish is that it is a pretty even application.
Anyone else have any opinions on how black might change the water color? Or concerns about the dyed product or replaster in general?
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We had on pool chipped out and redone within days of the first plaster job was done. They put a WAY wrong color and none of the extras the PO had asked for so no worries there.
Will they be doing a full chip out or just around the lights, returns, skimmer, etc?
There is one PO who just had a place on his spa seating redone due to a crack. It REALLY showed how much the color of the plaster had faded. I am saying that to have you think about staying away from the dye. I think, notice I said think, the black stones will really help your color. I did a search for black beads and the color difference was noticeable in the pictures so.........hoping it will be in real life also.
The cost of the additives? I really don't know and am not sure how you could find out. I guess you could call other PB and ask them what they would charge for it to get a baseline.
So glad you were able to enjoy the spa! Nice on the speed of it heating up! Must have been nice!
Kim
Thanks Kim. Do you mind sharing what you found in your search for black beads (if accessible)? I also spoke to the sales person who works for the plaster manufacturer. He also thought the black stone option was a safer bet for a consistent finish and he also thinks it will be a noticeable difference. But seeing pictures, even if on the internet are certainly helpful.
If we refinish, they will be chipping around lights, tile (excerpt for markers which will be completely chipped out), returns, etc.
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I also must say, the tri jet seat in the spa is amazing! I'm so glad we added that. There were concerns that it might decrease overall pressure to the spa jets (going from 6 to 8), but they are all plenty powerful. For anyone considering this, DO IT! The only thing I would suggest is to invert the triangle to have the two jets higher and the one jet lower.
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This is one quote I found that stuck me for you:
"Aggregates is plaster mixed with small pieces of quartz, granite, river stones, or glass beads. It is a very durable pool resurfacing material.
The colors and texture add a beautiful dimension to your pool. The color beads or pebbles reflect on the water giving the water the color of the beads present. Color ranges from sky blue, to aqua to deep blue and anything in between"
The bold is mine to help point it out. The pictures I found that show up when I google "black beads in pool plaster" does not really show which ones have black beads per say I found out once I went back and looked to copy them for you.
Kim
"Aggregates is plaster mixed with small pieces of quartz, granite, river stones, or glass beads. It is a very durable pool resurfacing material.
The colors and texture add a beautiful dimension to your pool. The color beads or pebbles reflect on the water giving the water the color of the beads present. Color ranges from sky blue, to aqua to deep blue and anything in between"
The bold is mine to help point it out. The pictures I found that show up when I google "black beads in pool plaster" does not really show which ones have black beads per say I found out once I went back and looked to copy them for you.
Kim
what technique or product should i use to clean our spa glass iridescent tile? There is some haze build up where the spillover touches the tile. A simple scrubbing doesnt get it off.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,410
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Diluted muriatic acid, 5 parts water to 1 part MA. Use a contractor sponge or grout sponge to wipe it clean. Rinse with clean water.
WHERE EYE PROTECTION AND GLOVES.
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WHERE EYE PROTECTION AND GLOVES.
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Thanks. Should I try to avoid the grout or is it safe to just spray/wipe the whole area?
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Muriatic acid and water. Start with 1:4 MA and water. Move to towards 1:1 if needed. Use care as the fumes are not fun.
Remember the MA will lower you PH so keep an eye on it.
Kim
Remember the MA will lower you PH so keep an eye on it.
Kim
- May 23, 2015
- 24,410
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
You won't be able to avoid the grout. It will fizz. No big deal just don't excessively spray it.
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We are officially swimming and enjoying the pool. We've been in the pool and spa nearly every day of the last week, even though it's been a little cold by South Florida swimming standards. Today is the first day we started heating the pool and I also broke out the el cheapo wheeler vacuum.
One thing we've realized now is our plumbing setup also has some limitations as it relates to our heating of the spa. Days like today where it's a little cooler out, we'd like to have the spa heated (as close to 104 as possible). Since we have an electric heat pump, that really means keeping it in spa mode most of the day. But then we get no water circulation at all in the pool. I don't regret the heat pump, as it was cost effective and the heat time is acceptable to us. I guess I just thought we'd be able to heat the spa while still getting water flow in the pool (even if by way of the spillover). Is there anything I might not be thinking about that could accomplish that? Even our manual "monkey valve" doesn't work when in spa mode since it is bypassed. Again, maybe this is the standard, but it's not something we thought about.
We still don't have our glamour shots as we've been dragging our feet on landscaping and trying to work through the plaster matter. They will come soon though and officially close out our build.
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One thing we've realized now is our plumbing setup also has some limitations as it relates to our heating of the spa. Days like today where it's a little cooler out, we'd like to have the spa heated (as close to 104 as possible). Since we have an electric heat pump, that really means keeping it in spa mode most of the day. But then we get no water circulation at all in the pool. I don't regret the heat pump, as it was cost effective and the heat time is acceptable to us. I guess I just thought we'd be able to heat the spa while still getting water flow in the pool (even if by way of the spillover). Is there anything I might not be thinking about that could accomplish that? Even our manual "monkey valve" doesn't work when in spa mode since it is bypassed. Again, maybe this is the standard, but it's not something we thought about.
We still don't have our glamour shots as we've been dragging our feet on landscaping and trying to work through the plaster matter. They will come soon though and officially close out our build.
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- May 23, 2015
- 24,410
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Get a bubble cover for the spa. It will help to retain heat when you're trying to bring it up to temp. Also, don't use the spillway and lose hot water to the pool. This is the downside of an attached spa, they share the same body of water as the pool so there's more compromises to be made.
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