Rownder

[Rownder]

I pulled this thread from it's original location. Please do not hi-jack a thread that has been started by another. It becomes terrible confusing when trying to follow two questions in the same thread.

New pool owner here, just started looking into vacuums. So, do I understand this correctly, the independent robotic vacuums tend to be better than the automatic vacuums that connect to the pool pump/drain port by my skimmer?

 

[ping]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

Rownder,

Each has their own pros and cons. A lot of people with the non-robot cleaners leave them in the pool all the time and just let them automatically come on. The downside is that the pump (or pumps in the case of the pressure side cleaners) have to come on to make them run. And in the case of a VS pump it will have to run at a pretty high RPM to make the cleaners work. Depending on the set up, and if automation is involved, often valves have to be moved in order for the non-robot cleaners to work.

A robot is powered by a low voltage electrical cable and none of the pool pumps need to be running. The downside to robots is the initial cost, although, as they get more popular, that cost is coming down. Also, it is recommended that the robot be removed from the pool when the cleaning cycle is complete, where non-robot cleaners can just live in the pool.

For me, it is a no brainer. Robots are like today's cell phone technology vs. the old rotary dial non-robot technology.

I'm sure others will join in with an opposing view..

Jim R.

I have to agree with Jim.

I made the switch from "The Pool Cleaner" to my robot a little over a month ago.

With CA electrical rates and having to run the pump extra just to clean the pool, it was a no-brainer for me to make the switch. Another benefit of the robot is that it cleans better than the suction cleaner.

 

[Rownder]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

Ok, so I actually have an automated Pentair system. I could easily program the pump to turn off/on a few hours day or night to clean, and my valves have actuators, so not much labor involved. But, I don't think I'd leave the vacuum in all the time, not with an 8 and 9 old jumping around. So hooking up a suction port vacuum and dropping a robot in seem to essentially be the same amount of work. From what I've read in this forum, the concensus is that the robots do a better job cleaning, so I lean that way. Then again, our pool is enclosed. So, not much gets in the water but some sand and random debris. Haven't had any algae yet. Would a robot just be overkill? I would compare the Pentair sand shark ($300) for a suction vacuum vs the Doheny discovery ($650) for robot. Also, most important, which type can I get my wife to use easier? Any opinions?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

Rownder,

So far you are only hearing one side of the story, but in my case, if my robot broke today, I'd have the Doheny Discovery on order tomorrow morning.

Jim R.

 

[Pemolis]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

The other consideration is power. The sucker needs to be plugged in. No I'm not talking about the dangers of electrical lines in pools, I'm talking about.. where is your nearest outlet and will you be able to power it without running the powerline through half your yard.

I almost bit on the robotic cleaner until I realized that I do not have a real viable plug to power the thing (I do now but then I did not). Stuck with the polaris that was left in the pool by the previous owner (sucker), and bought the remodel kit for 80 bucks, fixed the broken parts, and thing runs like magic. Bought the soot bag and that's working miracles. Now just have to unwind the tubes because they keep getting bunched up.

Did replace the booster pump vs repairing it as the replacement was only 30 dollars more than the repair (check amazon before the pool guy comes) Put some rubber mats underneath it and it runs pretty quiet.

Have it set to run from 2 to 4 pm. The variable speed pump starts up at 2500 rpm at 145 and ends at 4:15pm. I'm going to add a second cycle of cleaning to the polaris and adjust the variable speed to do a 2nd cycle of 2500 for about 30 minutes in the morning.

 

[smracing]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

I'll give the opposing side. Where I live the electricity is cheap and I need to run the skimmer 8 hours a day (split into a 2 hour session and 6 hour session) to keep leaves , bugs, dog hair out of the pool. I have a suction side cleaner that goes years with no issues. It stays in the pool 24/7. I would never even consider a robot that I had to take out, put up, get out and put back in every day.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

smracing,

Very good point. It is funny how people have different views. Your reason for liking the suction side cleaner, is exactly my reason for liking the robot. I don't want to see my cleaner in my pool except when it is in use. And because a suction side cleaner is much harder to remove from the pool, if I had one, I'd be just like you and leave it in 24/7.

Thanks for the input..

Jim R.

 

[Mindflux]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

I'll give the opposing side. Where I live the electricity is cheap and I need to run the skimmer 8 hours a day (split into a 2 hour session and 6 hour session) to keep leaves , bugs, dog hair out of the pool. I have a suction side cleaner that goes years with no issues. It stays in the pool 24/7. I would never even consider a robot that I had to take out, put up, get out and put back in every day.

I bought a robot when my 480 Pro started acting up. After it went back for repair a month after owning it I haven't put it back in the pool I got my 480 back in working order. I hated hooking the robot up, tossing it in the pool and then doing the reverse in the evening when I got home.

When they can be left in the pool indefinitely I might change my mind.

 

[LoomisBill]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

My primary concern is not so much a comparison between the cleaning ability between robot, suction, or pressure, but with the suction requiring running my VSP at 2500 rpm's and basically having to shut off my main drain and skimmer, I'm concerned about forcing my 3hp VSP to pump thru a 1.5" suction line. My main drain and skimmer are 2.5" lines which make the pump work less hard (think of trying to drink a milkshake thru a small straw). I guess the other option is to install another smaller pump to support the cleaner (running for only 2hrs per day) and then allowing my VSP to run at low rpm's for longer period of day to turn the water. Of course, with the cleaner costing $400 and another smaller pump at $250, I'm up to the cost of a robot, however, I would have the benefit of leaving the cleaner in the pool. I'm also not thrilled about having to pull a robot in and out of the pool daily.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

My primary concern is not so much a comparison between the cleaning ability between robot, suction, or pressure, but with the suction requiring running my VSP at 2500 rpm's and basically having to shut off my main drain and skimmer, I'm concerned about forcing my 3hp VSP to pump thru a 1.5" suction line. My main drain and skimmer are 2.5" lines which make the pump work less hard (think of trying to drink a milkshake thru a small straw). I guess the other option is to install another smaller pump to support the cleaner (running for only 2hrs per day) and then allowing my VSP to run at low rpm's for longer period of day to turn the water. Of course, with the cleaner costing $400 and another smaller pump at $250, I'm up to the cost of a robot, however, I would have the benefit of leaving the cleaner in the pool. I'm also not thrilled about having to pull a robot in and out of the pool daily.

I look at it this way - anytime you can "decouple" your pool processes from needing the pool pump in order to operate, the better off you are. Obviously with an SWG this is not possible for chlorination purposes (too bad the equipment makers don't make a high quality floating robotic chlorinator??). But, if I had a robot, I could cut 1-2 hours of pump runtime at 1-kW everyday and substitute it with 200 to 300W of robot usage a few times per week (probably around 3 cleaning cycles per week). So that would be a net savings everyday in electric costs. It would also enable me to recalibrate my pump RPMs so that my standard chlorination cycle uses only slightly more than bare minimum RPMs needed to make the SWG work; right now, I use higher RPMs to make the cleaner crawl around (but t's not very effective). That too would save pump energy costs.

Is that worth the extra "hassle" of putting a robot in my pool a few times per week? For me, yeah, lugging a robot around would be no big deal and I'd likely go big and get the robot caddy and remote controls anyway to make it easier.

 

[Geebot]

Re: Suction Cleaner with Pentair VS pump???????

To be as effective as a robot a pressure-side cleaner needs to stay in a lot longer. The robots are designed to effectively cover the area of the pool floor as well as walls and tile line in a fixed amount of time. The pressure-side cleaners meander and given "enough time" will be effective enough. So if you're averse to leaving it in while the kids play (although no reason not to leave it in) then you're likely not going to get full coverage.

We have the Dolphin S300 which is close enough to the Doheny Discovery. It's dead simple to use, covers the pool effectively in a 2-hour sweep, collects an awful lot and is simple to clean. My wife can easily manage it (weighs about 15 pounds once it's drained).