Pool guy ruined summer

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G

Grandpalean

0
Jul 24, 2016
17
Irvine ca
I hired a new pool guy because my former one relocated. I have a 22 x 44 above ground pool built with a deck surrounding it. My cya numbers were a tad low prior to his arrival, on his first day he texted to let me know he added 8 lbs stabilizer and 2 gallons chlorine at 12 noon. I thought it was a little odd as my test only showed to add 2 pounds, I added one pound to a sock the day before he came. At 7 pm I returned home and noticed two huge mounds of granular stabilizer sitting directly on the vinyl. At 8 pm I noticed all the water drained and a giant tear in the liner wear he placed the chemicals.

My my heart is sunk for my kids, I bust my butt and travel all year for work which is seasonal with Summer's off. This is my time to enjoy and We swim all summer everyday. We do not travel much, our pool is almost our entire summer entertainment. My daughter when only 2 years old could pass a swim test, and now at only 3 can beat most 5 and six year olds. I was hosting a family reunion on July 4th, canceled that, didn't want to entertain 10 kids for a week with no pool. Have another family gathering scheduled for August 15th back to school party and it looks like that's going to be a bust as well.

The pool guy is being honorable and filing an insurance claim. Although the whole time he says that he never has a problem with applying chemicals like that it's already been a month and the claims adjuster is just now getting here and he thinks it will be another month before the claim is finished at minimum. We have resorted to joining the closest public pool to us, a YMCA 18 miles away.

My questions regarding compensation. What do you guys think is fair and reasonable. Put yourself in my shoes. I rent the house, but the pool care is my responsibility and my landlord is backing me in the fight against the pool guy. I would never pay my landlord less because this was not his fault. What would you request for not being able to use your pool for the whole summer? We pay a premium to have this pool compared to other similar homes in the area and can only use it 3 to 4 months a year. We will not be using it for this entire season.

Please also let me know if you believe the pool guy was wrong in his application.
 

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Please also let me know if you believe the pool guy was wrong in his application.
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It sounds like you will need a lawyer far more than a bunch of pool geeks. What was the CYA test prior to his addition? What was the CYA test you got that said to add just 2 lbs?

How did you get such a huge difference?
 
duraleigh said:
It sounds like you will need a lawyer far more than a bunch of pool geeks. What was the CYA test prior to his addition? What was the CYA test you got that said to add just 2 lbs?

How did you get such a huge difference?
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I am talking more about the direct application to a vinyl liner. I believe the pool guy was probably adding stabilizer based on a concrete pool, that's why he was adding so much.
 
CYA level is based on climate and is the same regardless of of the pool surface, vinyl, plaster or fiberglass. It seems unlikely to me that CYA sitting on the liner would cause the liner to fail and tear. It isn't a particularly strong acid. Sounds like the pool is about 29k gallons and 8lbs of CYA would raise it 33ppm. In a warm, sunny climate we would recommend a CYA level of 50 ppm for a normally chlorinated pool or 80 ppm for a saltwater pool.
 
Yes, 50 cya was generally the target of previous pool guys recommendation. I thought it was because of vinyl but I guess it's because of climate. When I tested it showed around 40, that's why I added 1 pound to start. It was a bit low because we previously had a large windstorm and I bypassed the filter and discharged a little water vacuuming dust and leaf particles. Pool is actually around 25000 gallons.

a quick Google search tells one to never add stabiles to the bottom of a vinyl pool.
 
The recommendations not to let pool chems sit on the bottom of a vinyl pool are because of cumulative effects over years. And TFP certainly does not recommend it. Bleach, muriatic acid and to a much lesser degree CYA can cause a vinyl liner to bleach out and become brittle after several years. I would bet you could let CYA sit on the bottom of a vinyl pool many dozens of times before it would cause serious problems.

The pool would have to be an average of 3-1/2 feet deep to only be 25k gallons. Seems shallow.
 
pooldv said:
The recommendations not to let pool chems sit on the bottom of a vinyl pool are because of cumulative effects over years. And TFP certainly does not recommend it. Bleach, muriatic acid and to a much lesser degree CYA can cause a vinyl liner to bleach out and become brittle after several years. I would bet you could let CYA sit on the bottom of a vinyl pool many dozens of times before it would cause serious problems.

The pool would have to be an average of 3-1/2 feet deep to only be 25k gallons. Seems shallow.
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Yes the pool is fairly shallow, 44inch water line, and not exactly 22x44, more like 21.3 by 43.2 . I assure you it's 25k gallons, according to manufacturer.

The stabilizer can still be seen sitting on the bottom in the photos. Surely it is not a coincidence this failed at this spot shortly after being placed there. Liner was well under its expected length of life, and did not fail at a seam.
 
looks like there's no pool wall behind the liner - how was it holding all this time? I thought liner is called 'liner' because it's not supposed to carry any load and just cover pool wall. I think new pool guy just got unlucky due to someone else screw up. CYA bags shouldn't cause any damage in properly constructed pool especially taking into account their weight was less than 5 lb in the water instead of 8 lb in the air. Compare to that practically anyone standing tall in the pool would create higher load with part of the body above the water especially since the pool is shallow.

Wonder how much replacement liner would run for? I mean to compare ruined summer vs some deal. Depends on your goals of course.
 
I too am not sure what I am looking at. If the pool let loose and failed with a quick drain I would think the CYA would have been washed away. This is just not adding up for me.
 

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What's a ruined summer worth? Maximum is the pool service liability insurance. Just gotta set a target and find the right lawyers, judge, & jury. Feed the lawyers liberally. They will feed the engineers. If you search TFP, you'll find threads for legal/structural/pool lawyers/engineers.

That's very weird what happened to your pool. If they're taking responsibility, and you don't have mega-bucks ready for a fight you might lose, grab what you can and keep your head down. Just my two cents. Please stick around. Really interested to hear how the tale turns when the insurance adjusters do their thing.

It looks like you're on a hill. I'd be getting an expert to make sure anything downstream of that flood is still structurally sound.
 
OP, I'd consider discussing immediate liner replacement with your landlord. Its pretty clear to me the seam gave, and its highly unlikely the entire seam gave out horizontally like that based on chemicals sitting on one portion of it. I fear your pool guy's insurance may well fight it...in which case you'd wait all this time for nothing. If you go ahead and replace the obviously aged liner, that wouldn't nullify your claim, would it? Insurance companies don't usually punish one for restorative efforts...since leaving it as is with further compromise the structural integrity for which you will not be compensated, I suspect.
 
Good points. Why not spend a few days and a few thousand dollars replacing the liner rather than paying you a few hundred dollars for lost use of the pool or whatever you think that might be worth? Seems it would be better to spend the money on the liner than the lost use. It doesn't take long to install a new liner. Entire vinyl pools can be installed from scratch in a week.
 
WASP said:
Seems to me that the owner needs to repair HIS pool and take care of negotiating any insurance claims.
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That would really depend on the terms of the lease. I can't imagine leasing out my home and pool and simply relying on the tenant to do everything right without somehow protecting myself (especially on legal liability).
 
max2k said:
looks like there's no pool wall behind the liner - how was it holding all this time? I thought liner is called 'liner' because it's not supposed to carry any load and just cover pool wall. I think new pool guy just got unlucky due to someone else screw up. CYA bags shouldn't cause any damage in properly constructed pool especially taking into account their weight was less than 5 lb in the water instead of 8 lb in the air. Compare to that practically anyone standing tall in the pool would create higher load with part of the body above the water especially since the pool is shallow.

Wonder how much replacement liner would run for? I mean to compare ruined summer vs some deal. Depends on your goals of course.
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There is no pool wall. It is an above ground pool with a deck built around it. Like the photo I attached here just larger. The pool has been in place for over 6 years. Any structural defects with the pool would have surfaced in that time.

liner cost is 6500 and another 4500 for install. If this was just a few grand I would have covered it. But 10 grand is too much for me to lay out, I have three kids and my wife is a stay at home mom.

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MarianParoo said:
I keep looking at your photos. I am a bit confused but I am also unfamiliar with your issue. Is the brown the undercoat to your pool and the edges of the tear?

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And what is that piping in the lower right?
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The brown is a 6 inch layer of sand under the liner.
piping in lower right is skimmer basket.

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needsajet said:
What's a ruined summer worth? Maximum is the pool service liability insurance. Just gotta set a target and find the right lawyers, judge, & jury. Feed the lawyers liberally. They will feed the engineers. If you search TFP, you'll find threads for legal/structural/pool lawyers/engineers.

That's very weird what happened to your pool. If they're taking responsibility, and you don't have mega-bucks ready for a fight you might lose, grab what you can and keep your head down. Just my two cents. Please stick around. Really interested to hear how the tale turns when the insurance adjusters do their thing.

It looks like you're on a hill. I'd be getting an expert to make sure anything downstream of that flood is still structurally sound.
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Nothing downstream but avocado farms and my hermit neighbor Larry. Yes on a steep rocky hill.
 

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