I need help! Cloudy Pool

[Dickie and Teresa]

I have done my tests again, except for the CYA. Let me know if I need to repeat it. The previous CYA didn't even register. The pool is not quite as cloudy as it has been. We can barely see the bottom now and where the leaves and debris are on the bottom. There also appears to be some sand or some kind of grit on the steps and I have noticed it around the basket. The force of the water coming out in the pool comes and goes. Is this a pump problem?

Here are my results:

pH between 7.2 and 7.5
FC 0
CC .5
TA 200
CH 320

We obviously need chlorine but I am going to wait until I hear from you guys about how much to put in. We bought 6 bottles of bleach, 2 big boxes of Borax, and a big box of baking soda last night so we are ready to do what needs to be done. Look forward to hearing from you guys!

 

[PaulR]

Because the pH is fine and the TA needs to come down, not up, you won't need the borax or baking soda, at least not right away. You need CYA and chlorine; do that first. Getting the TA down should happen too, you can read up on lowering TA in the Pool School.
--paulr

 

[reebok]

and as far as exact numbers, try www.thepoolcalculator.com

 

[JasonLion]

Have you added any CYA/stabilizer/conditioner yet? It is very difficult to fight algae with an extremely low CYA level.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

We just came from the pool store. We were going to get some liquid stabilizer (which they did not have). I didn't tell them I had my own kit or anything. They pulled up our recent test numbers and highly advised against putting in any stabilizer. They said the last time our CYA was checked on May 1, it was 60 and that should have been fine. They also said that sometimes we could get a false reading on CYA if our chlorine is low. I am as confused as a termite in a yo-yo about right now. I don't think we have algae. Wouldn't our pool be green??? Should I go ahead and put in several gallons of bleach and see what happens? If so, do I do it all at one time?

What is CYA and what is conditioner? Are they called anything else?

 

[johnfromphilly]

We just came from the pool store. We were going to get some liquid stabilizer (which they did not have). I didn't tell them I had my own kit or anything. They pulled up our recent test numbers and highly advised against putting in any stabilizer. They said the last time our CYA was checked on May 1, it was 60 and that should have been fine. They also said that sometimes we could get a false reading on CYA if our chlorine is low. I am as confused as a termite in a yo-yo about right now. I don't think we have algae. Wouldn't our pool be green??? Should I go ahead and put in several gallons of bleach and see what happens? If so, do I do it all at one time?

What is CYA and what is conditioner? Are they called anything else?

This is taken right from the "pool school" in the top right corner of this page:

CYA - Cyanuric Acid

CYA can be raised with cyanuric acid. Cyanuric acid is sold under a variety of names, including Stabilizer, Conditioner, Instant Pool Water Conditioner, Stabilizer 100, Stabilizer & Conditioner, etc. Instant Pool Water Conditioner is a liquid product that is significantly easier to use than the others and is also significantly more expensive.

Solid cyanuric acid should be placed in a sock, and the sock put in the skimmer basket. After adding solid cyanuric acid you should leave the pump running for 24 hours and not backwash/clean the filter for a week. Solid cyanuric acid can take up to a week to fully dissolve and register on the test, so it is best not to test the CYA level until one week after adding some.

The pool school will make all of this stuff that seems confusing very clear. Just read it a few times and your yo-yo feeling will stop, or at least slow down.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

Thanks. Well, duh. Hhhmmm...the pool place insists that they don't think our CYA is low. They think our need for chlorine is masking the CYA. Wonder if I just go ahead and add all the chlorine at once this evening and then recheck everything tomorrow, if that might bring that CYA and TA where it needs to be. The pool calculator says that I also need borax.

 

[johnfromphilly]

The pool calculator says that I also need borax.

If you plugged your ph in as 7.2 it would tell you that you need borax. You said it was 7.2-7.5, unless you know what it was for sure then you don't really know what to plug into the calculator. You need good test results to plug into the calculator. Get a good test kit and plug those results into the calculator.

In terms of the cya - chlorine question- that is over my head to advise you- hopefully one of the pros will help you there.

 

[JasonLion]

CYA below 20 - I poured the entire contents of the cylinder into the CA tube and could still see the black dot.

If I am following correctly, you did a CYA measurement with the TF100 CYA test, filled the view tube and could still see the black dot. If so, your CYA level is very very low, what we call zero (though it could really be somewhere between 0 and 15). You should trust your own test results, not the pool store test results.

The CYA test in the TF100 is the most reliable CYA test on the market. There are several others that can occasionally (or in a few cases frequently) give wildly inaccurate results. That is not a problem with the test in the TF100 (likewise for the one in the Taylor K-2006 kit, which is the same).

You want to raise your CYA level to around 30 (anywhere from 20 to 50 will do, precision is not required). That will make fighting the algae much simpler.

Your PH is acceptable for now. Don't bother adjusting the PH until the algae is taken care of.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

So do I add chlorine? How and how much? I bought several bottles of bleach. Do I add stabilizer? I don't want to add the stabililizer blocks. I couldn't find liquid stabilizer, but it seems like I did see something called conditioner. The pool store said that not having enough chlorine could skew my CYA results. When they checked it on May 1, it was 60.

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

So do I add chlorine? How and how much? I bought several bottles of bleach. Do I add stabilizer? I don't want to add the stabililizer blocks. I couldn't find liquid stabilizer, but it seems like I did see something called conditioner. The pool store said that not having enough chlorine could skew my CYA results. When they checked it on May 1, it was 60.

Hi again.

The pool store is quite possibly wrong. Believe us, it happens all the time. I would trust your results first, and you did the test twice. And it is possible for the CYA to have been converted to ammonia by bacteria when the FC is allowed to go to 0. So you may have had CYA at one point, and now it's 20 or less.

You can add liquid CYA, it might be called "conditioner" but you have to read the active ingredient on the label. Don't let the pool store dictate what you do, it's up to you to take control of your pool.

IN order for you to do that, you need to feel confident in YOUR test results and YOUR ability to calculate how much bleach to add. So use the Pool Calculator as advised above to figure out how much bleach you should add. Do the calculation and then post it here, and we'll confirm if you did it right. But you need to learn how to do this....

You want to reach a FC level of 10. So your "now" is 0 and your "target" is 10. Give it a try, tell us what you come up with.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

Okay, my calculations say to add 4 gallons of bleach, 3 lbs 9 oz of borax, 4 lbs 11 oz stabilizer or 1 gallon 2 qts of liquid stabilizer. Does that sound right? Here are some questions, too?

Do I add the bleach all at once?
What is the active ingredient I look for on the liquid stabilizer? What if it doesn't list the active ingredient? If it says conditioner on the bottle, is that a safe bet that it is stabilizer?
Doesn't the dry stabilizer take forever to dissolve?
Do I have to add the bleach and the stabilizer at the same time? I think our pool store is closed already today.

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

Okay, my calculations say to add 4 gallons of bleach, 3 lbs 9 oz of borax, 4 lbs 11 oz stabilizer or 1 gallon 2 qts of liquid stabilizer. Does that sound right? Here are some questions, too?

Do I add the bleach all at once?
What is the active ingredient I look for on the liquid stabilizer? What if it doesn't list the active ingredient? If it says conditioner on the bottle, is that a safe bet that it is stabilizer?
Doesn't the dry stabilizer take forever to dissolve?
Do I have to add the bleach and the stabilizer at the same time? I think our pool store is closed already today.

Okay, bleach comes in 96 oz containers, not gallons, FYI. I calculated 3 96 oz bottles of bleach, for a total of 290 oz. If you have the larger jugs, like 174 or 182 oz, let me know. 290 oz of 6% bleach will raise your FC to 10.

No, the dry stabilizer is perfectly fine to use, and easy to do and ALOT less expensive. Just put 2lbs at a time in a sock and get some heavy string or whatver and tie it off to the return on your pool, so that the sock dangles in front of the return. Leave the pump running and it should dissolve in 24-36 hours. You can "assume" your CYA level has increased to the level you dosed to after 24 hours, and that day adjust your FC accordingly - refer to the chart.

Leave the pump running for 24 hours after the last of the CYA dissolves.

Do not add any Borax yet. Your PH is fine where it is for now.

You can add the bleach, pouring it slowly in front of the return so it doesn't splash on you, and do all three bottles, one after the other. When you are done with that, you can do the CYA any time. As I said, you want your pump running while adding any chems, and the entire time the CYA is dissolving.

Don't retest the CYA for 1 week, you don't want to waste your reagents.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

Right - I knew what oz the bleach bottles are; I was just using the gallon calculation. When you say I can do the CYA anytime, are you referring to the stabilizer? Sorry - I just want to make sure I get this right.

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

Yes, CYA=Stabilizer.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

we put in the bleach and I have been vacuuming the bottom until now. There is some kind of green, sandy-like goo that is coming up in the skimmer sock. I presume this is algae. I initially thought this was sand, but when I rub it between my fingers it disintegrates. I used a test strip just now and it shows everything is low, including chlorine. Just wait until morning and test again using my good kit?

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

When did you add the bleach? If it's been more than 30 minutes, go ahead and test FC, CC PH and TA.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

I'm going to check right now. What about the CH? Check it, too?

 

[frustratedpoolmom]

No.

 

[Dickie and Teresa]

Okay - here we go:

pH 7.3
FC 1
CC .5
TA 200 (It started getting pink at 200, then was magenta at 210)