New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments-UPDATED 9/22

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shadetree

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May 19, 2014
30
Allen, Texas
Yet another DFW/north Dallas build. We are in the process of obtaining bids for our first pool and spa. We have two young boys (6, 3).

Our PB sent this design, which we really like, but have some questions.
PS_Autosave00_001.jpg
PS_Autosave00_012.jpg

Do those of you with small children find that you use the tanning ledge often? This design really makes the tanning ledge into almost a kiddie pool. We are just wondering how functional that will be, now and in a few years when the kids are a little older.

Any suggestions on the design?
The cabana is 20x20'. We may shorten it to 20x15' or 15x15' to move the pool over to the left so that more of it is visible from the house and patio. We are also thinking of moving everything towards the back fence so there is more space between the house and pool. As designed, there is only about 8' in some places and we wonder if there will be enough room to put in a safety fence and still have room to get to the rest of the yard.

The PB's bid includes the following:
634 sq ft., 124' perimeter, depth be under 6', we just haven't decided exact depths

10x10" grid 3/8 steel on walls, floor, raised beam, retaining walls and footers
4 bar box beam #4, 1/2 steel around top edge of shell
pneumatically applied 6 sack mix gunite

Spa- 24"above pool, 12" above tanning ledge/kiddie area
8 jets
dual main drains, plumbed with split 2.5" suction and hydraulic loop on return side

Equipment-
main circulation- Jandy 2.0 HP variable speed
Jandy 160 GPM water feature pump
Jandy high flow, commercial grade cartridge or DEV filter
Polaris 280 with dedicated .75HP booster pump
Jandy JX1 400k NG heater
polaris 1.5HP blower for spa
5 SAvi melody J series LED
rainbow 320 in line chlorinator
Del Escape ozone system
Jandy PS RS6 + iAqualink
Jandy neverlube valves

Decking- interestingly, PB said pavers would be cheaper than concrete. We haven't made a decision about decking yet, but they lay pavers over 6" bed of 1/4" gravel, decomposed granite and cushion sand

As for equipment, I am planning on ditching the ozone system based on recommendations here. I am thinking cartridge for the filter vs DEV. Thoughts?
Are three different pumps really needed?
We are considering an in floor cleaner rather than the 280

Going to add the neck roll to the spa. We saw it suggested here and it seems like a great idea.

I plan on maintaining the pool myself.

Any other thoughts/suggestions? We are new to this. I have been reading up here, but there is quite a bit of information to digest. Any help or comments are greatly appreciated!
 
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Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

Welcome to TFP!!

Ok, super awesome design! Love the kiddie pool concept. I'd keep the cabana at 20x20. With sun angles in later afternoon, the shade disappears quickly. Our freestanding pavillion (that's our word choice versus cabana) is 12x20. You can see pics of it in our build thread. Neck rolls always looked comfy to me - no spa here. I'd consider a robot for cleaning versus either a pressure/suction or in-floor. How will you sanitize? I see options listed that aren't good choices in your equipment list (inline chlorinator - adds CYA & ozone - not needed due to the sun's effects). We recommend bleach (liquid shock) or a SWCG (salt water chlorine generator)..

Take a look at the following to get you started here. Getting Started
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

As stated above, you don't need these.

rainbow 320 in line chlorinator
Del Escape ozone system

Now is the time to consider a salt water chlorine generator.
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

I love this design so much!! I really wanted geometric but our yard shape didn't work well with it.
We are building now, so I'm not qualified to give advice on anything pool related :)
What are the measurements of the main swim area, like along the back wall where the bench is? and the width from front to back? I'm thinking ahead of when your kids are older if you might wish that extra tanning ledge area was in the main pool swimming area. I was worried about the tanning ledge taking up too much of our pool space, but I ended up making pool a little longer rather than shrinking the tanning ledge.

You asked about moving pool back some closer to the fence. One advantage to that would be you'd have more decking between house and pool (but you have plenty of decking!), the disadvantage would be the cost of that extra decking :( It's going to be awesome either way!
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

Thanks for all of the suggestions. I will look into the robot. I have seen others recommend the SWCG, I think that is the way we will go. Any particular model to recommend?

sham said:
I love this design so much!! I really wanted geometric but our yard shape didn't work well with it.
We are building now, so I'm not qualified to give advice on anything pool related :)
What are the measurements of the main swim area, like along the back wall where the bench is? and the width from front to back? I'm thinking ahead of when your kids are older if you might wish that extra tanning ledge area was in the main pool swimming area. I was worried about the tanning ledge taking up too much of our pool space, but I ended up making pool a little longer rather than shrinking the tanning ledge.

You asked about moving pool back some closer to the fence. One advantage to that would be you'd have more decking between house and pool (but you have plenty of decking!), the disadvantage would be the cost of that extra decking :( It's going to be awesome either way!
Click to expand...

Main swim area is 35'x16.5' at the longest/widest parts. I agree that when the kids are older, the kiddie area may not get much use. We've discussed putting a true tanning ledge on the right side (opposite the spa) and opening up the pool near the spa. We are already over 1500 sq.ft of decking. We will likely move everything back away from the house though, so I'm sure more decking is in our future.

Any other suggestions? Thanks for all of the input!
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

I would definitely move it toward the fence or landscape the yard back there. Would look like wasted space otherwise and yards here in Allen never seem to have enough space (I am by Alma and McDermott). Personally I would rather have more deck area then a small strip of yard, makes parties much nicer to have lots of deck space.

I don't know about the robot cleaner, I am sure they are great but just about everyone I know with a pool down here has a pressure cleaner. That's the way I would go - a pressure cleaner (I have suction). The pressure cleaners need upkeep, as do the suction cleaners, but they seem to do what you expect them to do. The robots always seemed like way too much work for me and there is no way they last more than a few years without some sort of repair.

Definitely go with SWCG and make sure you get your rock sealed and keep it sealed. Or plan for more concrete in the coping, decking.
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

One thing to remember is that the overhead view is the one view you will never get (unless you have a second floor balcony ). It is clearly the best "selling" view. Make sure you love the look of the pool at ground level looking horizontally at it.

Love the cabana and the size of pool and decking. This pool will be 150k plus where I live...
 

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Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

What a great design!! The kiddie pool idea is cute but kids grow up fast! With that being said, grandkids come around quickly! I tell my kids that I put them to bed one night when they were 10 and the next day they were getting married!

You'll love the deck space!
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments

Ok, here are my thoughts based on the above:

1, Ditch the Ozone system they are pointless in outdoor residential pools (they do have a place in hot tubs, therapy pools, high use indoor pools, etc.)

2, We have numerous reports of problems with Savi brand LED lights, but I can't recall any in the last year or so, so maybe they have finally fixed their issues.

3, For the SWG you probably want to stick with Jandy if you are using a Jandy automation system, otherwise Hayward is probably the most popular choice on this forum by a wide margin, which ever you go with OVER SIZE IT, over sizing lets you cut your pump run time and saves you electricity, it also extends the effective life of the SWG cell.

4, I too would move the pool back another 5-10 feet, but that depends on what the real yard looks like

5, I would strongly consider adding a bathroom / changing room to the left end of the cabana, and I would also add an equipment room for the pool equipment there. Putting pool equipment indoors will help extend its service life, and will make it quieter. You might also want to run services, plumbing, drain etc. for future outdoor kitchen while you are at it. The closer the bathroom is to the pool the better, particularly for small kids who will wait till the last second before making a bathroom run.

6, I am with everyone on ditching the pressure side cleaner in favor of a robot.

7, I would not worry too much about line of sight from the house with modern hi-res home security cameras that can let you watch what is going on from your smart phone. These technologies are just going to get cheaper and better. Mount 1 or more under the cabana and you can not only see what is going on from inside the house, you can see what is going on from anywhere on the planet.

8, This one is a personal thing, but I feel 5.5 - 6 ft is the worst possible depth for a pool, it is just deep enough that a typical 5'5" - 6'0" adult can not stand up in, too shallow to safely dive into, even doing cannon balls from the side, and just overall an awkward depth. Go shallower and then people who are not professional basketball players can stand up, or go deeper and adults will not bang their toes into the bottom when treading water. I would tend to go deeper, kids love jumping into pools, so make it deep enough for them to safely jump in (feet first).

Ike
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments-UPDATED

Updating this thread.

We made some design changes. Added a true tanning ledge and got rid of the "kiddie pool". Moved the spa and adjusted the overall size of the pool.

Some photos and layout measurements:
pool photo (2).jpgpool photo.jpgView attachment LARGE WALKWAY.PDF

The pool will have 3.5 feet of water on the tanning ledge/spa side, 5 feet in the middle, and 4 feet on the opposite end.

Since we are adding a pool fence, we are concerned whether a cantilever umbrella will work. We are considering adding umbrella sleeves in the tanning ledge (on each side rather than the middle). PB is recommending brass over PVC/plastic. I have seen the AquaStar ones and was thinking of using something like that to match the color of the drains in the pool. Does anyone have a brass model they like?

We are trying to decide how large of a walkway to the pavilion. Currently it is 6' wide, but with the pool fence it will only be 4' of usable walkway. Expanding the walkway will make it 10.5'.

We are going with travertine pavers- light walnut 6"x12", in a herringbone pattern. They will look like this:
pavers.jpg

Travertine torreon bull edge coping, with the veneer- silver travertine:
IMG_4163.jpg

The water tile is NPZ- square beige and the plaster is crystal pebble blue granite. I will post those pictures soon. Not sure on the water time or plaster. We may want something darker for the plaster. Anyone use this one that has photos to share?

Grout for everything will be buff, which is supposed to match. It's hard for me to tell.

We still have the Ozone system in the contract, but I am 99% sure I will have it removed. Since we are using travertine, I am leaning towards not using a SWCG. Thoughts?

We still have the Jandy NG heater, but have considered adding a chiller. Others have recommended it.

We are moving the equipment pad to the "left" side of the house in the photos. It will be large enough to have space for storage.

I think we are going to stick with the polaris for now, but may change to a robot in the future.

The vacuum line is set to be attached to one of the skimmers, but each skimmer and main drain are separate. Is that good enough or should I push for a completely dedicated vacuum line?

We will be finalizing the plans for the pavilion in the next few days, and hopefully start digging next week. As always, suggestions are appreciated. This is our first pool. Thanks.
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments-UPDATED

Hehe.... I am building with Hauk as well, ditch the Ozone and go SWCG. They won't like this forum if they catch whiff of everyone insisting on SWCG.
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments-UPDATED

I love the herringbone pattern for the travertine patio - very elegant. We are going to use a SWG and have travertine patio and coping - in New England no less. I have been repeatedly assured that with the correct grade / quality of travertine, it will hold up to just about anything.

Unless you need space for a garden, or are low on budget, I'm all for having as much patio and walkway space as possible. Especially for moving around patio furniture, carrying platters or coolers, or even large pool floats.
 
Re: New build in North Dallas- looking for suggestions/comments-UPDATED

TortugaCat said:
I love the herringbone pattern for the travertine patio - very elegant. We are going to use a SWG and have travertine patio and coping - in New England no less. I have been repeatedly assured that with the correct grade / quality of travertine, it will hold up to just about anything.

Unless you need space for a garden, or are low on budget, I'm all for having as much patio and walkway space as possible. Especially for moving around patio furniture, carrying platters or coolers, or even large pool floats.
Click to expand...

It's the heat that supposedly has the effect on salt water corrosion, from what I have been told. Correct me if I am wrong.
 

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