Lighting around pool

[ntobik]

Hi,

I have a question regarding lighting the patio area around our pool. We have an outdoor GFCI breaker that feeds two GFCI outlets on our back patio. The setup is pool, 7ft of concrete, river rock trench (that the outlets are in) and a wall behind them. I'll attach pictures to this thread in a following post from my phone.

We've been doing some work and I dug out all the river rock. I'm re-running one of the outlets in new conduit, the old outlet was falling apart. So while the trench has been opened up the topic of putting lights on the patio as come up.

We've looked at well lights at Lowes, but they all state they need to be at least 10ft from a pool or spa. This is true for all deck lights. We only have 7ft in distance. What are some light solutions that aren't LED solar? I have electric there, so I can run "normal" lights with a switch.

I'd be ok with 12v systems if they exist. I also want to avoid paying an absurd price for this if possible. I saw some well lights that I liked that were in the $35/light range, I'd be happy with that.

Is there something that would work? Any ideas?

 

[ntobik]

Here are some pics

The rock trench is seen at right. Electric runs through that to our outdoor sub panel. You can see the one outlet.

I want well lights in the trench every 5-8ft or so. Here's another picture of the trench and wall.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[gwegan]

Lets start by saying that Penn is on the 2008 edition of the NEC. So that is appeartly what applies. Call your local building department to verify.

Under the 2008 NEC You can have 120v lights so long as the lights are 5 feet or more away from the pool horizontally and protected by a GFCI. NEC 680.22(C)(1) Low voltage lights are not permitted within 10 feet of the pool even if protected by a GFCI (this is different in the 2014 version of the NEC which Penn HAS NOT ADOPTED)

Your outlets must be at least 6 feet from the edge of the pool.

Make sense?

Want it all explained with pictures? Google "Mike Holt swimming pools part 1" its the first result. THIS IS THE 2008 CODE NOT THE 2014 CODE.

 

[Jimrahbe]

gwegan,

Any idea why low voltage lighting would be prohibited while 120 volt lights would be ok? I'm sure you are right, but logically, it does not make sense. I'm sure there must be some reason, but I can't think of why that would be.

Jim R.

 

[gwegan]

Under the 2014 NEC listed low voltage lights on a pool rated transformer are allowed within five feet of the pool. My answer above is based on the 2008 version of the NEC which appears to be the applicable code version for Penn.

Low voltage lights are a fairly new mass market product --- the code is just catching up to the market. Nobody said these guys are fast. The code committees are concerned about pools. Swimmers are vulnerable to electrical shock when exiting a pool and they like to stay with things they know.

In many areas the world is changing faster than the code. I have spent hours negotiating with the building department to obtain approval for state of the art fire suppression systems that were prohibited by the then current code version. Building officials tend to be concerned about life safety issues so its always a intense discussion.

 

[ntobik]

gwegan,

Appreciate the responses, exactly what I was looking for. I read the Mike Holt pdf last night. The 5' jives with what my electrician said. He was out doing the sub-panel and said I needed to move an outlet, it was less than 5' from our spa, he said it wasn't to code.

I wonder if the 12v recommendation is partly related to the wiring. For 120v applications outdoors you're required to buy outdoor wiring, and by a pool it needs to be buried in a conduit. That provides a lot of protection to the wire. The 12v wires I've seen for lights is just a very small wire with a tiny bit of plastic over it. It doesn't offer much protection.