I have a 1999 Morgan Dayton spa that I just rebuilt. When I got it from my parents he told me the blower was not working. While rebuilding the frame I took the spa pack out and took the blower off. Plugged a pigtail into the connector and plugged it into the wall outlet. Worked great. When I was done rebuilding I filled up the tub just to check for leaks. For the fun of it I hooked the pigtail back up and had the blower running for about 5 minutes. But now that I have my #4 wire run as 220V when I hit the blower button blower will run for about a second then trips the breaker. The spa pack was replaced 3 to 4 years ago from spaguts.com. Is it the blower going bad or the GFCI going bad? Or the control board? Is there anyway to test this problem.
Blower Tripping GFCI
- Thread starter rkersh409
- Start date
We are going to bump you to the top so maybe someone with some spa knowledge will see you !!!!
The two most common components on any spa that will trip a gfci, are the heater, or the air blower, if water gets past whats known as the blower "loop" ( the pvc pipe goes to the highest point under the spa skirt, then back down to connect with the blower, this helps to stop any water in the blower line from going beyond the high point to reach the blower motor, the loop will fail when the spa water level goes over the top and spills down the sides, either from overfilling ,or several people getting in the spa at same time (5 people in a spa is like 50 people in a pool ) this will allow water to go beyond the loops high point and enter the blower motor, instantly tripping the gfci, the blower motor will have to be removed and dried out to stop the gfci from tripping, or replaced depending how long it has been effected by any water damage,
A wet blower motor when connected to an outlet on the house, without gfci protection, to test it will run possibly, like you describe, but when you connect it back to spa it trips what you describe as the "breaker" but i think you are referring to the gfci tripping, i can only guess here, because you used the word "breaker" but if it is the gfci you describe as being the breaker that trips, then moisture is in the blower motor, and that will always trip a properly wired gfci, it doesnt have to be saturated either, the slightest detection of water will trip a gfci,
You seem very uncertain, or unfamiliar with electrical circuits, i may be wrong, but will just say electrical troubleshooting has nothing to do with guessing, hoping, color coordinating wires, praying, etc. but rather knowing exactly what you are doing 100%,
Also drilling a small hole in the pvc, where the pvc pipe connects to the blower motor, will provide a drain for any water accumulation in pipe, (if there isn't a hole somewhere there already)
A wet blower motor when connected to an outlet on the house, without gfci protection, to test it will run possibly, like you describe, but when you connect it back to spa it trips what you describe as the "breaker" but i think you are referring to the gfci tripping, i can only guess here, because you used the word "breaker" but if it is the gfci you describe as being the breaker that trips, then moisture is in the blower motor, and that will always trip a properly wired gfci, it doesnt have to be saturated either, the slightest detection of water will trip a gfci,
You seem very uncertain, or unfamiliar with electrical circuits, i may be wrong, but will just say electrical troubleshooting has nothing to do with guessing, hoping, color coordinating wires, praying, etc. but rather knowing exactly what you are doing 100%,
Also drilling a small hole in the pvc, where the pvc pipe connects to the blower motor, will provide a drain for any water accumulation in pipe, (if there isn't a hole somewhere there already)
Sorry I meant tripping the "GFCI" not the breaker itself. My dad is a retired electrician and is the one that wired it just like he had it since 1999. So pretty sure its not the wiring. Even though I am not an electrician I have 20+ years of component level repair of electronics and working with my dad installing 2 mega watt generators so I have a good grasp of the subject.
The wall outlet that I plugged the blower into is a GFI outlet, like you have in your bathroom. Has the test and reset buttons on the outlet. So should be the same as the GFCI breaker. Any detection of ground fault (water) should trip my outlet. Which it did not.
The wall outlet that I plugged the blower into is a GFI outlet, like you have in your bathroom. Has the test and reset buttons on the outlet. So should be the same as the GFCI breaker. Any detection of ground fault (water) should trip my outlet. Which it did not.
i will assume also that the blower motor is indeed 120v, and it has an amp style plug at the end of the cord from motor (plastic,rectangular,red in color perhaps,etc) the color of the 3 wires that enter the plug should then be white,black,and green.
Now when you tested the motor on your outlet, did you make sure that the wire colors from the blower motor matched the white/neutral side of your household gfi, and that the black wire was on the hot side of the gfi, and the green wire was on the ground lug of a 3 prong test cord etc?, if not, you may have defeated the gfi possibly, white to hot side, black to white/neutral, im sure you understand my explanation,
Rule out the possibility of moisture content of any kind on the blower motor, is it possible there might be? once again blower motor moisture is notorious for tripping gfi's maybe also explain what you mean when referring to #4 wire run as 220v? after a second trips gfi, did it not trip gfi when wired 120v perhaps before you switched to 240v? i don't understand what you are describing
240v connection has 4 wires red,black,white,green, the red and black wires are 6awg, and the white and green are 8awg this is wire size for 50amp service
My instincts, without being able to put my eyes on it, point to moisture on blower motor, perhaps you could put a 120v lamp on the blower plug on the pack to see if it illuminates when blower switch is pressed, or maybe it goes off after 1 second too, I would have brought out a known good blower and tested it that way but..basically everything is pointing to a blower motor moisture issue in my opinion so..
with electrical diagnostics there is no room for anything other than proper answers to any questions regarding any part of the circuit to continue with the process, when you say things like "i am pretty sure its not the wiring" that tells me "it could be the wiring" don't take that the wrong way, i am just saying, if i am on site, a customer can tell me all day long something is right, but i am still going to verify it myself. continue on your quest here, continue to ask yourself why is the motor tripping gfi on spa circuit, but not when tested on home outlet, is it 100% correct when you test it? hmmm...keep me posted to any progress, or additional concerns, and i will do my best to help. I have done pool&spa repair for 25 years in the phoenix metro area, "I am not a pool cleaner" lol
Now when you tested the motor on your outlet, did you make sure that the wire colors from the blower motor matched the white/neutral side of your household gfi, and that the black wire was on the hot side of the gfi, and the green wire was on the ground lug of a 3 prong test cord etc?, if not, you may have defeated the gfi possibly, white to hot side, black to white/neutral, im sure you understand my explanation,
Rule out the possibility of moisture content of any kind on the blower motor, is it possible there might be? once again blower motor moisture is notorious for tripping gfi's maybe also explain what you mean when referring to #4 wire run as 220v? after a second trips gfi, did it not trip gfi when wired 120v perhaps before you switched to 240v? i don't understand what you are describing
240v connection has 4 wires red,black,white,green, the red and black wires are 6awg, and the white and green are 8awg this is wire size for 50amp service
My instincts, without being able to put my eyes on it, point to moisture on blower motor, perhaps you could put a 120v lamp on the blower plug on the pack to see if it illuminates when blower switch is pressed, or maybe it goes off after 1 second too, I would have brought out a known good blower and tested it that way but..basically everything is pointing to a blower motor moisture issue in my opinion so..
with electrical diagnostics there is no room for anything other than proper answers to any questions regarding any part of the circuit to continue with the process, when you say things like "i am pretty sure its not the wiring" that tells me "it could be the wiring" don't take that the wrong way, i am just saying, if i am on site, a customer can tell me all day long something is right, but i am still going to verify it myself. continue on your quest here, continue to ask yourself why is the motor tripping gfi on spa circuit, but not when tested on home outlet, is it 100% correct when you test it? hmmm...keep me posted to any progress, or additional concerns, and i will do my best to help. I have done pool&spa repair for 25 years in the phoenix metro area, "I am not a pool cleaner" lol
Thanks for the help on trouble shooting my problem.
The tub has always been wired as 240v since 1999. It has always had 4 wires all 4awg. Even pulled the wires out of the conduit and installed at my house. Black,Red,White,Green. Black,Red are hots, White neutral, and green ground. Wired like this in the spa pack and at the breaker box. The white pigtail off of the GFCI is going to neutral as well.
When testing the blower on my work bench I did make sure the white was going to neutral. Tested with meter to make sure the pigtail I was using was correct as well. I will have to try the light plugged into the amp connector and hit the pump button to see if it trips the GFCI. Yes the blower is 120v.
The blower very well could have moisture in the motor. When he had it, it set out in the weather with a deck built around it. Stray cats busted holes in the skirting and water could have gotten into the motor also. Plus I do not know if rain ever caused the water level to get to high causing water to enter blower as well. The blower line does not have any drip holes in it. It has the check valve in the "blower loop" but have read where they fail all the time. Do you recommend drilling a drain hole in the line?
Another problem I am having is water coming out my air venture valve (Air Venture Valve). This valve is glued to the end of two air manifolds. When the pump is running I get a steady drip out of the valve. Do you have an idea what could be causing this?
The tub has always been wired as 240v since 1999. It has always had 4 wires all 4awg. Even pulled the wires out of the conduit and installed at my house. Black,Red,White,Green. Black,Red are hots, White neutral, and green ground. Wired like this in the spa pack and at the breaker box. The white pigtail off of the GFCI is going to neutral as well.
When testing the blower on my work bench I did make sure the white was going to neutral. Tested with meter to make sure the pigtail I was using was correct as well. I will have to try the light plugged into the amp connector and hit the pump button to see if it trips the GFCI. Yes the blower is 120v.
The blower very well could have moisture in the motor. When he had it, it set out in the weather with a deck built around it. Stray cats busted holes in the skirting and water could have gotten into the motor also. Plus I do not know if rain ever caused the water level to get to high causing water to enter blower as well. The blower line does not have any drip holes in it. It has the check valve in the "blower loop" but have read where they fail all the time. Do you recommend drilling a drain hole in the line?
Another problem I am having is water coming out my air venture valve (Air Venture Valve). This valve is glued to the end of two air manifolds. When the pump is running I get a steady drip out of the valve. Do you have an idea what could be causing this?
View attachment 47045this is a blower loop, and may, or may not apply to your set up ( it appears you have a different style using air injectors placed strategically in spa shell, then manifolds are used to direct flow to each injector installed, yadda, yadda, air injectors became the new way to provide air injection to spas, eliminating the air channel design that older spas had, that air channel was a part of the spa shell during manufacturing, if you have ever seen an older spa that has all the small holes on the inside of the spa that are in rows, thats an air channel, now forced air systems are not seen on many new spas, they have always been problematic, gfi tripping, air cooling the water temp down (inefficient) just wanted to get this out of the way as far as describing blower loop.
Yes I have a blower loop and on one side has a check valve. Could be the check valve is bad and allowed water to get by and get into my blower.
The black valve is at the top of the tub and as the pump is running it is causing water to come out the black valve. I do not know if the black valve is like a check valve. Is it supposed to allow air to come in but block the water from dripping out? Could be that the black valve is stuck open? Looks like it has dropped over the years. Not at the highest point and could be below water line.
The black valve is at the top of the tub and as the pump is running it is causing water to come out the black valve. I do not know if the black valve is like a check valve. Is it supposed to allow air to come in but block the water from dripping out? Could be that the black valve is stuck open? Looks like it has dropped over the years. Not at the highest point and could be below water line.